Against TED talks

[CodeTRUCKER]

I am probably unqualified to comment on the thread as I have no idea what TED is, right (yes, I live in the bottom of a well)?  Well, maybe not.  Given I have no knowledge of TED, I can offer a different (not necessarily better) perspective.  

Over the years I have come to know a bunch of you folks and have come to value your intelligence, wisdom and wit.  The point is what I know of TED has only been gained from this thread.  Here is what I have gleaned from your comments...

• We are being required to "see" the Emperor's New Clothes by a mindless mass-mob manipulated by crafty diatribe.
• There is nothing new under the sun.  Great thinkers throughout history have eschewed fads of this ilk.  If it truly had intrinsic value it would have been seized upon long ago.
• So, I am not the only one seeing a new "Kinder-garten," eh?  Wally-World better lay in a LARGE supply of brown shirts.
• Although the previous bullet is tongue-in-cheek and a bit frivolous, this is really no laughing matter.  Recall how the French Bourgeoisie was incited to riot against Aristocracy which in turn gave us seventeen years of horrible blood-letting and the ultra-efficient guillotine.  Add to that how the mantra of "tolerance" was used to silence anyone who opposed one's point of view.  Talk about "intolerance!"  And who can miss the lessons of the Warsaw Ghetto and the choke-hold on the world by Nazi propaganda which found fertile soil in children's hearts and led to holocaust?  No, this is quite serious and behooves me to take a more proactive stance to understand where TED is headed (Thanks Renegade.).

Although Hitler's "Final Solution" for the six-million Jews created such an outcry in contemporary times, didn't anyone notice Stalin was responsible for the fifty-million slain of his own countrymen?  Strange.

Thanks for this thread folks.

[TaoPhoenix]

Hmm.

I've just spent a few nice hours listening to the non-business talks. It ranged from a great comedy skit, a couple of good science talks about Dopamine overloading, parts of a couple blah "improve your life by writing things down", and a good beat-boxer.

Then one presentation left me with a bit of a lurch.
http://www.youtube.c.../watch?v=YB_sfnwbgvk
The evolution of juggling: Jay Gilligan

Here's why: for someone who has spent his whole life studying and teaching juggling, his presentation was somehow a bit chilling at the over-selling of what looks like only mediocre ability, apalling misunderstanding of historical research vs business concepts, and ... no fun or amazement.

His entire presentation over-sold juggling innovation as this incredibly hard process on the order of the hard sciences. "Look! Years later, we now have a triangular ring! New techniques are possible with this different prop!! It's pointy!!"

There's just one problem. He got schooled about *twenty years ago* by my summer camp juggling teacher. Because she taught us to juggle the two orbs and ...

... wait for it ...

A forlorn half-destroyed rubber chicken. Comedy gold was made that day.

[40hz]

I can put up with almost anything TED does so long as presentations like this one hit the widest possible audience.

(with thanks to fellow DC member Shades for putting me on the track to it.)

[ewemoa]

Wow!

[Renegade]

Although Hitler's "Final Solution" for the six-million Jews created such an outcry in contemporary times, didn't anyone notice Stalin was responsible for the fifty-million slain of his own countrymen?  Strange.

-CodeTRUCKER (March 01, 2014, 09:54 AM)

Hitler was an amateur compared to Stalin, Mao, or the earlier Jewish communists that murdered 5~10 million Ukranians in the early 1930's. But f*ck history and f*ck truth. Only the Zionist political agenda matters. Pfft.

Shut up. Watch TED. Worship at the altar of progressive liberal socialist science. That is your god. Anything else is heresy.

TED makes me sick most of the time.

I can put up with almost anything TED does so long as presentations like this one hit the widest possible audience.

-40hz (March 15, 2014, 07:55 AM)

And it's dripping with agenda...

Any time someone comes out saying "think of all the poor/starving/children/women/whatf*ckingever", I want to puke. The vast majority of the time it's an agenda and when you start following things back, it's the exact opposite of what it looks like. "I am Ukrainian" was a good example of a psyop. F*ck that.

I watched the entire video. And it looks cool, but the agenda there makes me question what's going on. Some people are just pawns...

My distrust of TED has only grown deeper.

If TED disappeared, the world would be a much better place.

[40hz]

Sad to see some people would rather see absolutely nothing good get accomplished - unless it were done in accordance with their standards of political correctness and doctrinal purity.  

Now what was it these people were saying about "agendas"?

[TaoPhoenix]

...And it's dripping with agenda...

Any time someone comes out saying "think of all the poor/starving/children/women/whatf*ckingever", I want to puke. The vast majority of the time it's an agenda and when you start following things back, it's the exact opposite of what it looks like. "I am Ukrainian" was a good example of a psyop. F*ck that.

-Renegade (March 16, 2014, 11:30 AM)

Maybe Renny, but I go into it with a cross of "agendas suspected are agendas half neutralized", followed by "take with a street cleaner truck of salt". So I consider many of the ones I choose to watch much less volatile; for example there's some decent basic science ones there, as well as several of the "BizMgt bubblegum" ones and even "kindergarten cyber security ones" (that I still didn't know!)

Parodies aside, sometimes hearing "the obvious" and knowing it is, but with a new specific phrasing, is mildly useful. And for the science ones, getting a blurb about the role of dopamine that sounds right means you have a new name (the presenter) to search for looking for the real papers.

I myself strongly believe there's value to be *extracted* from almost anything. Pardon this week's Matrix marathon themes, but once you are able to stop just staring in awe, you can find the two minute useful advice amongst the snow-job.

Now excuse me while I Write Things Down JUUUUSST as the presenter told me to!!

1. Get weekly dose of Renny's politically incorrect opinion.
2. Perform this week's thirty seven second worship of Renny.
3. Apply Renny's ideas to Something Serious and Important.
4. Do Dishes. It's the Small things that count.

 

[Renegade]

Sad to see some people would rather see absolutely nothing good get accomplished - unless it were done in accordance with their standards of political correctness and doctrinal purity. 

Now what was it these people were saying about "agendas"?

-40hz (March 16, 2014, 12:46 PM)

That's a complete misrepresentation of what I wrote.

I watched the entire video. And it looks cool, but the agenda there makes me question what's going on. Some people are just pawns...

-Renegade (March 16, 2014, 11:30 AM)

It's certain a nifty bit of science. No disagreement there. I really liked that portion of the video.

BUT... Anything in a TED context is suspect given the company that they keep. Follow the money and often all these "save the world" things end up as scripts written by Rob Zombie (though often much worse).

e.g. The good, lovely, humanitarian USAID is guilty of forced sterilizations of women in Thailand, India, Uzbekistan, Central Asia, and wherever else. Look it up.

Now, let's have a look at some of the TED sponsors (left sidebar).

TED Talks Partners
Allianz
American Express
Delta
Fidelity Investments
Gucci
Intel
InterContinental
Kohl's
Lynda.com
Prudential
Rolex
Samsung
Siemens
Skype
Sony
State Street
Steelcase
TOMS
American Express Project
HP Color Project
Johnnie Walker Ideas Project
Pfizer Health Project
Shell Urbanization Project
TOMS Giving Project

Here are a few connections to USAID from a few quick searches:

American Express - http://www.usaid.gov.../tjada-doyen-mckenna
Delta Airlines - http://www.usaid.gov...e-protection-program
Intel - http://www.usaid.gov...expand-collaboration
Pfizer - http://blog.usaid.go...an-aids-researchers/
Siemens - https://www.google.c...te:usaid.gov+siemens (Most are PDFs, and PDFs are annoying)
Shell - https://www.google.c...:usaid.gov+shell+oil (More PDFs)

You can find many, many more. There's a massive web of foundations out there posing as one thing and doing another. TED is just one of many.

So, we have corporate sponsors helping fund CRIMINALLY INSANE organizations, such as USAID, and also funding TED. Hmm...

If I'm promoting an agenda here, it's an agenda against outright violent criminality posing as humanitarian nonsense.

I myself strongly believe there's value to be *extracted* from almost anything.

-TaoPhoenix (March 16, 2014, 04:04 PM)

Absolutely! There is a lot of good stuff in some TED talks. The thing is you've got to pick the razor blades out of the apples first. Swallowing without knowing what you're ingesting is a really bad idea, and especially so with TED.

TED is sexy.

TED is cool.

TED is fun.

TED is all those things wrapped up in a potpourri filled box with a fancy bow on top.

But there's something insidious in there as well...

Now excuse me while I Write Things Down JUUUUSST as the presenter told me to!!

1. Get weekly dose of Renny's politically incorrect opinion.
2. Perform this week's thirty seven second worship of Renny.
3. Apply Renny's ideas to Something Serious and Important.
4. Do Dishes. It's the Small things that count.

 

-TaoPhoenix (March 16, 2014, 04:04 PM)

Sure. Feel free to mock me. I don't mind. It won't change anything. I'd only encourage you to start connecting some of the dots. They are there if you want to look.



I'm not sure whether I should apologize for not candy-coating everything. Hmmm.... Nah! It's much more fun being the abattoir in the middle of the town square.  

[barney]

It's much more fun being the abattoir in the middle of the town square.

-Renegade (March 17, 2014, 01:59 AM)

Hm-m-m.

A bit of selft-flattery there? 
While I don't disagree with some of your points, you seem inclined to throw the baby out with the bath. 
Not overly fond of TED, nor many of the sponsors, but that does not invalidate all the content.

[40hz]

Sure. Feel free to mock me. I don't mind. It won't change anything. I'd only encourage you to start connecting some of the dots. They are there if you want to look.

-Renegade (March 17, 2014, 01:59 AM)

@Ren - with all due respect, I think many - if not most of us here - are perfectly capable of seeing things and connecting the dots. It's just that some of us are a little more discriminating and careful when it comes to inferring causation or correlation. If a person stares at a field of dots long enough they can eventually see anything they want to see. But "seeing something" doesn't automatically make it true. And just because someone doesn't see things the way somebody else does (or chooses to reserve judgement for the present) doesn't mean they're stupid, craven, negligent, or wilfully blind.

Sad to see some people would rather see absolutely nothing good get accomplished - unless it were done in accordance with their standards of political correctness and doctrinal purity. 

Now what was it these people were saying about "agendas"?

-40hz (March 16, 2014, 12:46 PM)

That's a complete misrepresentation of what I wrote.

-Renegade (March 17, 2014, 01:59 AM)

Hmm...

I gave your previous two posts a slow reread. And after careful re-consideration, I still don't think I have. Guess we'll need to agree to disagree on this point. 

[Renegade]

It's much more fun being the abattoir in the middle of the town square.

-Renegade (March 17, 2014, 01:59 AM)

Hm-m-m.

A bit of selft-flattery there? 
While I don't disagree with some of your points, you seem inclined to throw the baby out with the bath. 
Not overly fond of TED, nor many of the sponsors, but that does not invalidate all the content.

-barney (March 17, 2014, 02:15 AM)

Not self flattery at all. I'm merely acknowledging that I have no bedside manner.

And I was pretty explicit about there being some excellent material presented at TED.

I'm not throwing the baby out with the bath water... I'm asking if there's some sort of toxic weaponry destined for some sinister use in the stroller/diaper bag.

@Ren - with all due respect, I think many - if not most of us here - are perfectly capable of seeing things and connecting the dots.

-40hz (March 17, 2014, 03:04 AM)

No argument there.

It's just that some of us are a little more discriminating and careful when it comes to inferring causation or correlation.

-40hz (March 17, 2014, 03:04 AM)

I guess I'm just far more suspicious than most.

If a person stares at a field of dots long enough they can eventually see anything they want to see.

-40hz (March 17, 2014, 03:04 AM)

I could go on forever with examples. I simply don't have the time. Sorry. I wish I did.

But "seeing something" doesn't automatically make it true.

-40hz (March 17, 2014, 03:04 AM)

Sure. There are "illusions". Now please point out to me how forcibly sterilizing women (or supporting organizations that do that) is an illusion.

Again, the examples are endless. I've pointed out many in the Basement.

And just because someone doesn't see things the way somebody else does (or chooses to reserve judgement for the present) doesn't mean they're stupid, craven, negligent, or wilfully blind.

-40hz (March 17, 2014, 03:04 AM)

I never accused anyone here of being stupid, craven, negligent, or willfully blind.

But I sure as Hell am accusing some "foundations" of being craven and outright evil.

I gave your previous two posts a slow reread. And after careful re-consideration, I still don't think I have. Guess we'll need to agree to disagree on this point. 

-Renegade (March 17, 2014, 01:59 AM)

Sure. I still think you're wrong though. I've not pushed much of an agenda unless you call condemning evil an agenda. So, in that aspect - you're perfectly correct.

You already know what I think, and it seems to me like you're coloring what I have above there with that.

I only meant to come out on the attack, and didn't attempt to offer any "solutions/agendas".

Then again, we could both be off-base there and considering different issues to lead us into a lovely red herring. Wouldn't be the first time.

Speaking of herrings...

Silliness aside...

I'm still not sure what part of what I had above there was "an agenda"... If you could be a bit more explicit about what I wrote, then I might understand a bit better.

[tomos]

I can put up with almost anything TED does so long as presentations like this one hit the widest possible audience.

-40hz (March 15, 2014, 07:55 AM)

And it's dripping with agenda...

Any time someone comes out saying "think of all the poor/starving/children/women/whatf*ckingever", I want to puke. The vast majority of the time it's an agenda and when you start following things back, it's the exact opposite of what it looks like. "I am Ukrainian" was a good example of a psyop. F*ck that.

I watched the entire video. And it looks cool, but the agenda there makes me question what's going on. Some people are just pawns...

My distrust of TED has only grown deeper.

If TED disappeared, the world would be a much better place.

-Renegade (March 16, 2014, 11:30 AM)

Atacking TED and saying you suspect it because of it's sponsers is fair enough.
But for me, and others I suspect, the problem here is that you explicitly attack this particular video, with no real reason, with no backing for your 'dripping with agenda' claim. And that's how you lauch into the topic.
Meh.

[Curt]

Not overly fond of TED, nor many of the sponsors, but that does not invalidate all the content.

-barney (March 17, 2014, 02:15 AM)

^yes, it does.

God stated it already some 3.000 years ago in Job's Book in the Bible;
if the heart of a story is a lie, then all of the story is a lie.

There may be very little in life where I agree with Renegade, but TED is one.

[barney]

God stated it already some 3.000 years ago in Job's Book in the Bible;
if the heart of a story is a lie, then all of the story is a lie.

-Curt (March 17, 2014, 09:18 AM)

To my mind, TED is many stories.  One (1) of them being a lie does not make every other one (1) a lie.  And, since lie is often a matter of perception, what seems a lie to me may not seem so to you or others.

[40hz]

Not overly fond of TED, nor many of the sponsors, but that does not invalidate all the content.

-barney (March 17, 2014, 02:15 AM)

^yes, it does.

God stated it already some 3.000 years ago in Job's Book in the Bible;
if the heart of a story is a lie, then all of the story is a lie.

-Curt (March 17, 2014, 09:18 AM)

Unless that story itself is a lie.

Note: not saying it is or isn't. Just doing it to illustrate how careful you have to be with overly broad assertions, snap judgements, or assumptions that we all agree what "the real story" is.  

There may be very little in life where I agree with Renegade, but TED is one.

In my case it's more that there's probably very few times where I don't agree with Renegade, but his assessment and characterization of TED is one of those very few times.
 

[wraith808]

I think with TED, there's the best of intent on some levels.

... but I think that there's a quote that talks about that from someone much more sage than I.

"L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs"
-  Saint Bernard of Clairvaux

[tomos]

"L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs"[/i]
-  Saint Bernard of Clairvaux

-wraith808 (March 17, 2014, 11:19 AM)

had to look that one up...

Against TED talks

doesnt seem to be a literal translation, but I get the idea ;-)

[Target]

so all this boils down to guilt by association?

TED is guilty because some of it's sponsors have questionable ethics or morals

Speakers (who are in fact guests) are guilty because they participate in a forum?

seems like it mightn't bode well for any of us

[wraith808]

I don't think it's towards the speakers if I'm reading right. It's towards the aims of TED as an organization.  And Ren's not the only one to question on that front.  It's quite valid in the case of these things to question the motives of the organizer.

A friend organized several user groups in several different locations- he'd get them going, and then turn them over.  Was it just for the good of the area?  No- it was because his one payment for doing so was that he was able to always get right of first refusal to introduce a speaker.  So in the end, it was to raise his capital.  Not a bad thing- but definitely an ulterior motive.

Is the organization sponsoring these talks out of a philanthropic gesture?  Or is there something else behind it?

That's a valid question to ask- especially as any organization gets actual power...

[Target]

so TED does something other than facilitate public forums on random topics?

then there's a certain irony in the latest (?) presentation

Daniel Reisel studies the brains of criminal psychopaths (and mice). And he asks a big question: Instead of warehousing these criminals, shouldn’t we be using what we know about the brain to help them rehabilitate? Put another way: If the brain can grow new neural pathways after an injury … could we help the brain re-grow morality?

[40hz]

I still can't help thinking anything that helps tear down info silos and helps make technology and deeper thinking more accessible to a general audience can't be a bad thing. The intended audience is savvy enough to separate the wheat from the chaff without the need for self-appointed guardians to tell them it's all bullshit and they shouldn't be watching any of it. Not that these guardians are doing anything that interesting or significant on their own to offer TED's audience an alternative. (I've called out a few of the more hipster types and asked why they weren't doing something to replace it. Most of replies were worthy of a 15-year old in both the choice of language and debate tactics employed.)

Corporations aren't interested in disseminating what they've discovered or are working on. Government isn't interested beyond slapping a TOP SECRET sticker on as much science as possible. Universities aren't interested. They're too busy building patent portfolios and putting their scholarly papers behind paywalls -  when they aren't out trolling, or slapping their faculty with DMCA notices for having the audacity to post their own work on their own personal websites.

TED is far from perfect. It's presentations can be elitist, questionable, or trivial at times. And it's certainly not everybody’s cup of tea. But it is better than most of what's out there - despite the popularity of all the faux-science and "paranormal phenomenon" shows on the so-called 'science' channels if you're not a diehard UFO or conspiracy buff.

And it's definitely better than nothing. Because there isn't much else like it should you look around.
 

[wraith808]

so TED does something other than facilitate public forums on random topics?

then there's a certain irony in the latest (?) presentation

Daniel Reisel studies the brains of criminal psychopaths (and mice). And he asks a big question: Instead of warehousing these criminals, shouldn’t we be using what we know about the brain to help them rehabilitate? Put another way: If the brain can grow new neural pathways after an injury … could we help the brain re-grow morality?

-Target (March 18, 2014, 05:20 PM)

If they don't, then why does it cost $6K-8.5K to attend?  Where does that money go?  That's a *lot* of money to think that they only "facilitate public forums on random topics".

[40hz]

Where does that money go?

-wraith808 (March 18, 2014, 05:47 PM)

It's published on their website. Or was last I looked.

That's a *lot* of money to think that they only "facilitate public forums on random topics".

-wraith808 (March 18, 2014, 05:47 PM)

Ever attend a 2-day trade or industry insider conference? Those aren't cheap either. These things go on convention budgets. Depending on the location, the facilities, and the number of days, it can add up fast. I just spent last Saturday night at a small inn about 300 miles from where I live. Cost for the night = $235. The week before I was in NYC at one of the Hiltons since I couldn't find anything else for the days I needed to be there. Price per night $424, I've also worked in a hotel. Back in the 80s when they hosted conferences where I worked, the conferences were getting an average of $800-1200 a day to attend. A now defunct guitar Workshop I used to attend offered a 5-day program that ran in a resort someplace out west. Cost to attend = $5250 to $6000. The normal price for the very same workshop held at a local boarding school in my state during summer recess = $1200 for the classes plus an additional $800 to stay in a school dorm room with four other people.

TED seems to be on the higher midrange of what these things tend to charge.

[superboyac]

But it is better than most of what's out there - despite the popularity of all the faux-science and "paranormal phenomenon" shows on the so-called 'science' channels if you're not a diehard UFO or conspiracy buff.

-40hz (March 18, 2014, 05:44 PM)

[40hz]

@SB - ROTFLMAO!

I cannot stand that guy.