Author Topic: Anyone got an iPad and like it? (Read 31939 times)

Carol Haynes · « **on:** October 12, 2011, 06:33 PM »

I have looked at iPads with scepticism since they first appeared but someone called me this morning asking for help with their iPad 2 which had just frozen until the battery went flat over night.

We got it going again easily enough but having played with it for 5 minutes I was ready to throw it through the window.

What a piece of crap - the first thing I found was that a family member had sent her an attachment. There is no way to open attachments that aren't 'approved' by Apple, in this case it was a document that had been formatted as a Kindle eBook (it wasn't from the Kindle store and wasn't copy protected). She has Kindle installed but still couldn't open it (just got an error).

Worse there was no way to save the attachment and use Kindle to open it. You can't save attachments (or at least neither of us could find a way to do so).

Having done some research if you can open an attachment you can read it and that's it. If someone sends you a document that needs updating there doesn't seem to be any way to edit the thing and attach it to a reply.

What is the point of this device? Is it really just a sill expensive toy or have I totally missed the point.

Apart from idiots with more money than sense who buys these things?

If I am wrong can someone put me straight please ...

wraith808 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 12, 2011, 08:50 PM »

I have one (and just bought my wife one) and like it. I use it for my RPGs, for reading, for surfing the net, for e-mail, for work... and it's proven more than capable. It has its limitations, but what doesn't? As far as your problem, I don't know; I use Stanza, eReader, and the Nook app, and with Stanza and eReader have opened files to import into them. I'd say your problem probably has to do with DRM, and the fact that the Kindle app can't sideload content that way (the Nook can't either IIRC).

As far as editing attachments, it depends on the attachment and what apps you have installed. I open attachments in other apps and edit them (rarely, but still..) The app I have shows up for me to open the appropriate attachments in. Then from within that app, I can e-mail it back (or upload it other places).

lotusrootstarch · « **Reply #2 on:** October 12, 2011, 09:01 PM »

Idiots with more money than sense who buys these things are these who have no idea how to utilise an iPad beyond web surfing and music.

But yes attachment handling on iOS is crap, Android does bit way better.

nosh · « **Reply #3 on:** October 12, 2011, 09:39 PM »

I have one and really like it. But you need to start looking at it as what it is - a casual use device, rather than a mission-critical one. I'd recommend a wifi only model, something that can be used in addition to your main machine.
There's a lot that you can't do on the iPad, jailbreaking makes the situation a little better. But there's enough I can do on it to justify its purchase. I lost my Internet connection for a couple of days some months back and what I missed most was surfing on the iPad. Whenever I buy a device that I don't really need, once the novelty wears off, I get real and it ends up eating dust somewhere. The iPad gets used heavily every day (mostly web browsing, email, twitter & ebooks). But people need to stop thinking of it as a laptop replacement, just coz Steve said so.

wraith808 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 12, 2011, 09:44 PM »

But people need to stop thinking of it as a laptop replacement
-nosh (October 12, 2011, 09:39 PM)

Truth.

Renegade · « **Reply #5 on:** October 12, 2011, 09:46 PM »

I bought my wife one as well. (+1 for Wi-Fi only.)

It's nice, but I only surf news and play a few games for a couple minutes when I have a smoke outside.

I bought a remote control app to control windows, but it locks the screen, which isn't what I wanted. i.e. Control windows from laying down on the couch.

Overall, it's a fun toy.

There's a lot more that I probably could do on it, but why? I've got a desktop to do work on. The iPad is for casual consumption.

My wife has commented that she wants a Kindle now though as the iPad is simply painful to look at after a prolonged period, e.g. reading.

lotusrootstarch · « **Reply #6 on:** October 12, 2011, 09:57 PM »

From my experience buying a tablet, any tablet, without 3G support is a very bad idea. Being able to access content and stay in touch anywhere anytime is essential.

I use my iPads heavily for:
Online/offline GPS nav, gaming, Ebook reading, music, video streaming over Wifi/3G, Ebay, banking, Doc processing, SSH, RDP, public transport tracking (real-time), SVN access/source viewing, Podcasts/Vodcasts, Youtube, Skype, Gtalk, Google+, VPN, and ofc, to control my beloved AR Drone.

nosh · « **Reply #7 on:** October 12, 2011, 10:13 PM »

I bought a remote control app to control windows, but it locks the screen, which isn't what I wanted. i.e. Control windows from laying down on the couch.

Probably coz it uses RDP? I use iTap VNC w/ TightVNC running on the PC. No system locking and supports multi-mon. Great for controlling the music player (audio system) from the bed, even better for pranking clueless friends surfing on my PC. Loading random porn sites when they're trying to check their mail or whatever!

Renegade · « **Reply #8 on:** October 12, 2011, 10:15 PM »

From my experience buying a tablet, any tablet, without 3G support is a very bad idea. Being able to access content and stay in touch anywhere anytime is essential.
-lotusrootstarch (October 12, 2011, 09:57 PM)

We only use the iPad at home, so there's no point in having 3G when the telcos have no sane plans for light usage.

We just can't justify the additional costs for something that we'd never use, or only use very rarely.

I still have my phone that I can do all that stuff on too, so it's not like I'm "stranded".

Actually, I prefer my phone for reading news and most things that I do on the iPad. It's simply smaller and nicer to use. The iPad requires 2 hands to use (1 to hold it and 1 to "use" it), while I can hold and use my phone with 1 hand. The other hand is busy with a cigarette.

I almost feel like singing "one hand in my pocket..."

nosh · « **Reply #9 on:** October 12, 2011, 10:22 PM »

From my experience buying a tablet, any tablet, without 3G support is a very bad idea. Being able to access content and stay in touch anywhere anytime is essential.
-lotusrootstarch (October 12, 2011, 09:57 PM)

But then what you can do with the content is limited by the iPad's capabilities, or lack thereof. Unless you're slinging a laptop along too.

wraith808 · « **Reply #10 on:** October 12, 2011, 10:22 PM »

I still have my phone that I can do all that stuff on too, so it's not like I'm "stranded".
-Renegade (October 12, 2011, 10:15 PM)

Again, truth. Especially since I can tether the iPad to my phone.

lotusrootstarch · « **Reply #11 on:** October 12, 2011, 10:37 PM »

I still have my phone that I can do all that stuff on too, so it's not like I'm "stranded".
-Renegade (October 12, 2011, 10:15 PM)

Again, truth. Especially since I can tether the iPad to my phone.
-wraith808 (October 12, 2011, 10:22 PM)

Yes we all can. However the reason that you buy into iPads or Apple stuff in general, is probably not to say "I can do ABC", but to say "I now do ABC in this fashion, with better accessibility/portability and less hassle, etc.".

Carrying and tethering a data-enabled phone to an iPad contradicts the convenience principle and disturbs the peace of mind, especially when you have to remember to worry about the battery status on your phone every once in a while.

wraith808 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 12, 2011, 11:21 PM »

Carrying and tethering a data-enabled phone to an iPad contradicts the convenience principle and disturbs the peace of mind, especially when you have to remember to worry about the battery status on your phone every once in a while.
-lotusrootstarch (October 12, 2011, 10:37 PM)

Not if I only do it rarely. I use my iPad at home (I have wifi) and work (I have wifi). The times that I am between the two is rare- too rare to justify another monthly bill and more money for the device. Others may differ, but it works for my uses.

Renegade · « **Reply #13 on:** October 13, 2011, 01:14 AM »

Yes we all can. However the reason that you buy into iPads or Apple stuff in general, is probably not to say "I can do ABC", but to say "I now do ABC in this fashion, with better accessibility/portability and less hassle, etc.".
-lotusrootstarch (October 12, 2011, 10:37 PM)

I don't find the iPad is significantly easier to use for typing anything into. It's still too small for my hands, and using my thumbs is still awkward due to the distance they need to travel, although I don't hit the wrong keys like I'm prone to do on my phone. It's just a trade-off of one inconvenience for another for me.

So at the end of the day, my phone ends up being more portable and easier to carry.

I really think that it all boils down to personal work-habits or play-habits as the case may be.

For the 3G:

Carrying and tethering a data-enabled phone to an iPad contradicts the convenience principle and disturbs the peace of mind, especially when you have to remember to worry about the battery status on your phone every once in a while.
-lotusrootstarch (October 12, 2011, 10:37 PM)

My bet is that wraith simply has a very high comfort level with those sorts of things, and it comes second nature to him. Me? Heck... I wouldn't bother trying to tether my phone. I simply don't have the patience. Heck, I barely have the patience to use my phone at all, but that's due to the crappy network and not the phone itself.

My comfort level with a lot of things boils down to, "It works? Are you sure? I doubt it. Yeah yeah yeah... Heard it all before... And it only takes 10 seconds? Last time it took an hour... Bah humbug~! It's not that critical. I'll find something else!"

e.g. My first impression of the Internet was, "Yeah? So? I'll check back later when it improves." There were only a few sites on the web at the time, they were ugly as hell, and there wasn't much there. Everything at the time was very much experimental. I already had been using Archie and Gopher, and the new "Internet" didn't really add much for me. That all changed of course.

So regarding "disturbs the peace of mind", yeah... I'm on board with you 100%~!

4wd · « **Reply #14 on:** October 13, 2011, 02:05 AM »

We only use the iPad at home, so there's no point in having 3G when the telcos have no sane plans for light usage.
-Renegade (October 12, 2011, 10:15 PM)

What do you class as 'light usage' ?

$1/month for 50MB, (150MB if you're with TPG - which you were), and 2.75cents per excess MB is hardly a deal-breaker - this is what I use in my Android phone when I want to look up something and don't have WiFi available.

TPG Budget Plan

And the phone/SMS charges are reasonable also.

It even says: Pay As You Go Plans - Recommended for your iPad

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #15 on:** October 13, 2011, 04:06 AM »

So if I understand correctly 90+% of what people do with these toys is surf the net and check email!

They are too hard on the eyes for extended reading of eBooks (one of the reasons I have heard people say they buy them).

You can listen to music - but you can that on so many devices (I do on my blackberry).

Email attachment handiling is seriously broken

They can't multitask.

Expensive device and locked in infrastructure.

I can understand the form factor - but sure they there must be cheaper and more flexible options with a similar form factor. What would possess anyone to choose the iPad in preference?

Apple UK Store: 16Gb iPad2 WiFi only = £400

Samsung Netbook: 1Gb memory, 250Gb space and 10 inch screen = £250. Windows 7.
Asus EeePC = £250 (similar spec to Samsung)

Apart from a minor weight improvement and an annoying touch screen why would you spend £150 extra on a device that can only do 5-10% of what you can do on a much more capable netbook.

Sorry I really don't understand the logic?

nudone · « **Reply #16 on:** October 13, 2011, 05:02 AM »

I hate all things Apple (as I hope you know) but I'm quick to contradict myself when it comes to the iPad. Yep, it's rubbish on so many levels but as an ebook/web-reader device it's better than a netbook simply because it's instant on and instant off. That's instant on and instant online.

So, to me, it really is like picking up an electronic book (one that has all the pages of the internet inside). The instant connection makes all the difference to an impatient sod like me. There's also the battery life. The iPad does last around 10 hours on a single charge. The Samsung netbook (that sits about 5 feet away from the iPad and is never turned on anymore) has never lasted longer than 2 hours on a single charge and that's with the screen brightness turned all the way down.

It's all about convenience. The iPad is the most convenient to use - unless you want to do work; if that's the case, go and sit in front of the PC and do it properly.

Now, would I buy an iPad over the new Android 3 tablets coming out - probably not. The iPad was the only choice at the time and I paid the minimum I could (on eBay for around £250 these days). I say "probably not" as there is still the problem of "apps". The iPad is nothing without the "apps". If Android has the same apps then there's no point in buying an iPad.

p.s.
I've recently had the misfortune to use an Android 2.3 tablet. If you try one of those out you'll think the iPad is some kind of super-computer.

wraith808 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM »

They are too hard on the eyes for extended reading of eBooks (one of the reasons I have heard people say they buy them).
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 04:06 AM)

Your eyes? I do extended reading all the time, and it's fine for me...

Email attachment handiling is seriously broken
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 04:06 AM)

Unless you have a handler installed... wait, that's all devices...

They can't multitask.
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 04:06 AM)

What do you mean by multitask? Look at things side by side? No... because all apps are maximized. Keep apps in memory and switch between them? I do that all the time...

And as I said, I also use it at work (take notes in meetings, use it for an extended monitor/keypad, use join.me and rdp to view remotely) use it for rpgs (mapping, tracking characters, consulting and marking up rulebook pdfs, etc) and writing.

There are downsides and problems to it for sure... but then again, there is with anything else, also.

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #18 on:** October 13, 2011, 09:05 AM »

Your eyes? I do extended reading all the time, and it's fine for me...
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM)

Commenting on an earlier comment - I don't believe in eReaders of any type - I like proper books.

The only thing I would convert to eReaders for a time limited dsiposable books such as computer manuals etc. Trouble is this is the one area that all eReaders really stink at becaus the books aren't produced electronically to the same standards and a lots of books that come with CD utilities don't have them included in the eBooks - plus they cost as much as (or on occasions even more than) the hardcopy which is far more convenient to read and scribble on!

What do you mean by multitask?
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM)

Actually doing more than one thing at a time (not just allowing you to swap between tasks but have background tasks dormant).

wraith808 · « **Reply #19 on:** October 13, 2011, 10:19 AM »

Your eyes? I do extended reading all the time, and it's fine for me...
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM)

Commenting on an earlier comment - I don't believe in eReaders of any type - I like proper books.

The only thing I would convert to eReaders for a time limited dsiposable books such as computer manuals etc. Trouble is this is the one area that all eReaders really stink at becaus the books aren't produced electronically to the same standards and a lots of books that come with CD utilities don't have them included in the eBooks - plus they cost as much as (or on occasions even more than) the hardcopy which is far more convenient to read and scribble on!
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 09:05 AM)

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. Most of the cd content is downloadable now, and I scribble on mine, and find it more convenient to have a stack of books on my ipad than a stack of books on the shelf. I have some hardcopies, but they are becoming fewer and fewer. I do wish that more places would sell both for one price, though.

What do you mean by multitask?
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM)

Actually doing more than one thing at a time (not just allowing you to swap between tasks but have background tasks dormant).
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 09:05 AM)

That's a fallacy. No one works in more than one app at the same time. If you'd said background task (i.e. kick something off, and go into another program while that's still processing) I'd agree with you; though some apps can be backgrounded and still work, others can't, and it's something that I do find limiting in some cases. But other than for reference purposes, or sharing information by drag/drop, no one actually works in more than one program at the same time- the mouse related interface that we have on computers doesn't allow it. I hope in the future multi-touch does allow this (a la Minority Report), but for now, it's an illusion that's been propagated, and doesn't survive the light of reason.

Renegade · « **Reply #20 on:** October 13, 2011, 10:34 AM »

What do you mean by multitask?
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 06:15 AM)

Actually doing more than one thing at a time (not just allowing you to swap between tasks but have background tasks dormant).
-Carol Haynes (October 13, 2011, 09:05 AM)

That's a fallacy. No one works in more than one app at the same time. If you'd said background task (i.e. kick something off, and go into another program while that's still processing) I'd agree with you; though some apps can be backgrounded and still work, others can't, and it's something that I do find limiting in some cases. But other than for reference purposes, or sharing information by drag/drop, no one actually works in more than one program at the same time- the mouse related interface that we have on computers doesn't allow it. I hope in the future multi-touch does allow this (a la Minority Report), but for now, it's an illusion that's been propagated, and doesn't survive the light of reason.
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 10:19 AM)

For the most part, I think you're right there.

But... (you knew that was coming)... If you have say a Word document and a PDF open, and you type in the Word document while reading the PDF, are you "using more than one app at the same time"?

A for multi-touch as in the Minority Report, isn't that all just one big app?

I think that by our nature, we are incapable of proactively using 2 apps at the same time. Passive? Sure. Just like the PDF above. We all use LOTS of them, and even ones we don't know about. Drivers, daemons, services, agents, etc. etc. But proactively? That requires multiple input devices/sources.

If you had a sensor to detect your heartbeat, and that was hooked into an app, that would still be passive.

If you are typing or clicking with a mouse or speaking into a speech recognition powered app, that's clearly proactive.

Let's take Star Trek for an example. You're the ship's navigator and you're all alone on the deserted ship... cue spooky music please... You're frantically typing/tapping things into the computer console to avoid some Klingons pursing you... All the while you're shouting commands to the ship's computer...

Are your voice commands active? Well, yes. But how much concentration do they take? Is that using multiple applications? Or is it using one interface (the console) and intermittently actively using another interface?

I think our powers of concentration are limited, and that is the absolute limiting factor. i.e. How much concentration does an application require to use as a percentage of the users available, productive attention/concentration amount?

I think that at the end of the day, we're mostly just quickly switching between applications and that we're never really using multiple applications, no matter what the interface. (Unless it's cybernetic, but then it's still passive...)

Kind of like how mobile phones are illegal to use while driving. People don't have enough concentration/attention to do both reliably.

wraith808 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 13, 2011, 11:59 AM »

But... (you knew that was coming)... If you have say a Word document and a PDF open, and you type in the Word document while reading the PDF, are you "using more than one app at the same time"?
-Renegade (October 13, 2011, 10:34 AM)

But other than for reference purposes, or sharing information by drag/drop, no one actually works in more than one program at the same time
-wraith808 (October 13, 2011, 10:19 AM)

I think that falls under reference purposes

I think that at the end of the day, we're mostly just quickly switching between applications and that we're never really using multiple applications, no matter what the interface. (Unless it's cybernetic, but then it's still passive...)
-Renegade (October 13, 2011, 10:34 AM)

I don't think it's even just computer use. When people say they're multi-tasking, they're really just spinning up and down (and taking the appropriate hit for spin-up/spin-down time). Right now, I'm on hold, typing this. But am I multi-tasking? No... when someone comes on the line, even though I have a headset, I won't be able to type this message and converse with the person on the phone about something different at the same time. That's true for most actions, though there are few complementary actions that can be reliably done at the same time.

Arguing against my point (schizophrenic much?), sometimes I'm on nefsis and typing notes at the same time on the same computer. But I guess that falls into the reference bit- just in a different paradigm.

Renegade · « **Reply #22 on:** October 13, 2011, 12:36 PM »

I think there are things that we can do simultaneously, but many of them require training to do. Some don't.

Like listening to music is a pretty good example. When you know something pretty well, you can pretty much listen and ignore at the same time. blah blah blah -- I expect other people have different takes on what they can do at the same time.

I think that we're each just wired/trained to be able to do certain things, and some things are just beyond our grasp. e.g. Editing in Photoshop while dictating mathematical lectures on the deeper lovelinesses of string theory and why time doesn't exist.

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #23 on:** October 13, 2011, 12:37 PM »

Example - I get lots of emails so open email app to download latest bunch of crap and then go and do something else while I am waiting - like surf the internet or read a book .....

Renegade · « **Reply #24 on:** October 13, 2011, 01:51 PM »

We only use the iPad at home, so there's no point in having 3G when the telcos have no sane plans for light usage.
-Renegade (October 12, 2011, 10:15 PM)

What do you class as 'light usage' ?

$1/month for 50MB, (150MB if you're with TPG - which you were), and 2.75cents per excess MB is hardly a deal-breaker - this is what I use in my Android phone when I want to look up something and don't have WiFi available.

TPG Budget Plan

And the phone/SMS charges are reasonable also.

It even says: Pay As You Go Plans - Recommended for your iPad
-4wd (October 13, 2011, 02:05 AM)

I didn't see any of that when we bought it. Other plans we saw were idiotically expensive. The device was far more, and the plan was the same as regular phone plans. I gave up there.