Author Topic: Pirate vs. Paying Customer illustrated (Read 51,451 times)

zridling · « **on:** February 25, 2010, 03:42 PM »

Yes, this whole thing really punishes the honest guy. <Insert cursing here>

[attach]

KynloStephen66515 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 25, 2010, 03:47 PM »

Hahaha, thats awesome, and also very very true, and pretty much the only reason I download some films

mrainey · « **Reply #2 on:** February 25, 2010, 03:53 PM »

Not so funny when you see your applications pirated.

KynloStephen66515 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 25, 2010, 03:59 PM »

Quote from: mrainey on February 25, 2010, 03:53 PM

Not so funny when you see your applications pirated.

This is about movies, but I do understand your point. I also never said I DONT buy the DVDs, I just download them cause I hate having to hunt through my collection just to put it in my computer, and it saves A LOT of time copying the DVD (if it even allows you to) then converting to AVI to save space.

Technically not pirating, due to the fact I own the original work anyway. Its along the same lines as downloading a no-cd or modified EXE so you don't need the CD/DVD for software/games, due to risk of scratching the disc, or playing that many games it just gets annoying locating discs.

Eóin · « **Reply #4 on:** February 25, 2010, 04:00 PM »

This just supports one of the long standing arguments why ordinary people pirate- even without taking price into consideration the pirates still offer a better product. As long as that continues to be the case I'll have little sympathy for the victims.

zridling · « **Reply #5 on:** February 25, 2010, 04:05 PM »

Btw, I found that unsourced photo here:
http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg

RedPillow · « **Reply #6 on:** February 25, 2010, 07:33 PM »

That is so true

It`s even easier to convert the pirated videos for example: PSP use.

f0dder · « **Reply #7 on:** February 25, 2010, 07:34 PM »

Illustration isn't entirely correct - pirated DVDs usually include menus, and sometimes the FBI warnings are kept as well - probably for the laughs.

It is pretty damn sad that legitimate users get the shaft... for audio CDs, you often can't (reliably) rip to a digital computer format. For applications and games you're often treated as a thief if you go legitimate, with ridiculous lock-downs and restrictions (can't have process explorer running? limited number of activations? have to be connected to the internet, even if playing a single-player game, and you get booted out without save if you lose your internet connection? et cetera).

If you pirate stuff, it's download-install-run... and in the case of games, sometimes at better performance, because you don't have a crap layer of obfuscated DRM code running in a VM.

RedPillow · « **Reply #8 on:** February 25, 2010, 07:35 PM »

You can also copy and paste CD-keys on pirated ones xD

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #9 on:** February 25, 2010, 07:48 PM »

The best illustration of this was the UK release of Charlie Wilson's War - there was a 10 minute film about UNICEF before the menu appeared (along with all the other crap mentioned above). Not only was the film unskippable but you couldn't fast forward it or even stop it (apart from ejecting the disk) - plus if you press title menu it played again before the menu!!! This was so irritating the only solution was to look for a ripped copy so that you can actually watch the film you bought without having to cook a four course meal, eat it, spend the eveing in the local pub getting pissed just to avoid the crap. Maybe the DVD designer was just saying get a life - in which case he is probably correct.

Don't get me wrong I think UNICEF is a great organisation but it had absolutely nothing to do with the film whatsoever.

The thing I love about UK releases are the hilarious 'Don't be a pirate' clips that come up. They are set in Hades with a red faced torturer and they blame video piracy for everything from the worldwide economic collapse, teenage pregnancy and drug abuse to funding terrorism.

I'm pretty sure terrorism would mange on their own without worrying about pirating Home Simpson DVDs! DOH!

nosh · « **Reply #10 on:** February 25, 2010, 07:59 PM »

It'll be interesting to see how the Assassin's Creed II release with its cloud-based DRM plays out. There was some loose talk about a DDoS being planned at 4chan but I wouldn't be too surprised if the shit really does hit the fan. *fingers crossed*

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/things_you_should_boycott_assassin%E2%80%99s_creed_ii_and_its_god_awful_drm

wraith808 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 25, 2010, 08:57 PM »

Quote from: mrainey on February 25, 2010, 03:53 PM

Not so funny when you see your applications pirated.

But if you watch out for your paying customer and keep him happy, and ignore the non-paying customer, you can be almost guaranteed that you are minimalizing the amount of sales that you are losing.

A really good example for me is the gaming DRM market. TAGES, SecurROM, and now UbiSoft's newest DRM scheme has lost them at least a few customers- I know friends who have always bought games that have either pirated or just not bought the games because of their heavy-handed approach. I hated even the lock to DVD stuff that was a replica of the lock to CD days, and it affected my buying. That's a direct relevance to their bottom line. I'd argue that DRM has made piracy *more* of a problem instead of less. By their inconvenience, they have brought awareness of piracy to the forefront- and awareness that people don't have to put up with the DRM if they just d/l a bittorrent client or limewire. If they had been satisfied with a minimal DRM scheme that's not an annoyance, but just made it so that the normal user would have to go out and get technical knowledge to have to bypass it, I would almost guarantee that they would have *less* problems now- not more. But the genie's out of the bottle, and heavy-handed tactics aren't going to put it back in.

There have been some killer games out that have had equally killer DRM schemes and though I've wanted them, the DRM has kept me away. That *never* happened in the old days- which tells you that at least in my case (though I'm sure there are other examples of it) their DRM-heavy approach is leading them in the wrong direction fiscally.

wraith808 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2010, 09:00 PM »

Quote from: Carol Haynes on February 25, 2010, 07:48 PM

The best illustration of this was the UK release of Charlie Wilson's War - there was a 10 minute film about UNICEF before the menu appeared (along with all the other crap mentioned above). Not only was the film unskippable but you couldn't fast forward it or even stop it (apart from ejecting the disk) - plus if you press title menu it played again before the menu!!! This was so irritating the only solution was to look for a ripped copy so that you can actually watch the film you bought without having to cook a four course meal, eat it, spend the eveing in the local pub getting pissed just to avoid the crap. Maybe the DVD designer was just saying get a life - in which case he is probably correct.

I had the same problem recently with a release of some film- I finally got around to trying to watch it, and wanted to watch the end of the movie because I had already seen it and only had a few minutes before I went to bed. 30 minutes later I *still* hadn't managed to get to the movie.

Kamel · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2010, 09:14 PM »

Piracy and theft are facts of life. There are proper ways of handling them and improper ways. This picture simply outlines the fact that a stolen product is actually superior to a purchased one. This doesn't make sense, and that's the operative thing here.

I don't support people going around and stealing things, but I (even more so) don't support the use of DRM or other crippling software to try and prevent something from being stolen (which is not preventing anything)

Deozaan · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2010, 11:06 PM »

Another classic illustration on DRM and how piracy is the "better" option.

xkcd.org

f0dder · « **Reply #15 on:** February 25, 2010, 11:29 PM »

I don't know what the proper solution is for single player games, for games that have mostly online appeal... drop DRM and simply rely on the server-side verified serial. If people choose to haxor the exe and use private servers, let them do it... but don't fsck your legitimate customers.

wraith808 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 26, 2010, 01:20 AM »

Quote from: f0dder on February 25, 2010, 11:29 PM

<snip />
...but don't fsck your legitimate customers.

QFE!

J-Mac · « **Reply #17 on:** February 26, 2010, 04:44 AM »

Quote from: mrainey on February 25, 2010, 03:53 PM

Not so funny when you see your applications pirated.

Well, though you don’t have that problem from me - and I am definitely software-poor; the money I've spent on software that is no longer even installed would feed some third-world countries! - I can say that it certainly does not help to make things as difficult as possible for your paying customers while the pirates are easily and happily able to do what they want without a bit of difficulty.

Jim

wraith808 · « **Reply #18 on:** March 08, 2010, 04:32 AM »

Classic! Ubisoft's DRM servers went down- making AC2 unplayable for many *paying* customers!

http://bit.ly/bNSXE5

RedPillow · « **Reply #19 on:** March 08, 2010, 07:00 AM »

It`s really sad, when Ubisoft announced that internet-connection must be on all the time when playing even singleplayer!
For pirates, it doesn`r really change anything - the protection will be cracked in hours.
For buyers thou, what if they don`t have internet-connection or it happends to lag-out @ Final-Boss?

Lawl, just think about checking your ping when playing Assassin`s Creed - so you wont lag out and quit without saving your game to the server

That would pretty much suck.

f0dder · « **Reply #20 on:** March 08, 2010, 07:40 AM »

Quote from: RedPillow on March 08, 2010, 07:00 AM

Lawl, just think about checking your ping when playing Assassin`s Creed - so you wont lag out and quit without saving your game to the server

Saves are still stored locally - you can put them "in the cloud" as well, but saves being cloud-only i FUD.

That still doesn't change my stance on protections like that being inherently evil & only hurting legitimate customers.

Deozaan · « **Reply #21 on:** March 08, 2010, 08:08 AM »

So I just watched a movie on Blu-Ray the other day, and the image in the first post here went through my head. The thing I don't understand is, before getting to the main menu of the movie, there was an advertisement about how awesome Blu-Ray is compared to DVD... on the Blu-Ray disc!

Thankfully most of the previews were skippable, but it really is crap having to go through all that junk just to watch a movie you've already bought.

nosh · « **Reply #22 on:** March 08, 2010, 08:20 AM »

Quote

Classic! Ubisoft's DRM servers went down- making AC2 unplayable for many *paying* customers!

It's hard to foresee every little problem when you have your eye on the money.

[attachimg=#]

RedPillow · « **Reply #23 on:** March 08, 2010, 08:21 AM »

"You wouldn`t download a car!"

- Fuck you!, I would if I could!

lanux128 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 08, 2010, 08:33 AM »

Ubisoft's new DRM system..

• http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkTZTzsYoZs