Author Topic: Torrent Giant, The Pirate Bay sold, will go legal (Read 44737 times)

Loki15 · « **Reply #25 on:** July 01, 2009, 07:33 PM »

That's still ridiculous.. 189.00 For photo editing software.. I just can't justify outrageous prices..

So Wraith are you saying every single music file on your computer that is being sold, you paid for?

Josh · « **Reply #26 on:** July 01, 2009, 07:40 PM »

Loki: Photoshop is NOT for everyone. They even make that clear on their website. There are various photo EDITING programs out there that are priced from the freeware range to 49.95 and beyond. Photoshop is well designed for the advanced photo manipulator and can do things that you simply cannot do in your 30 dollar copy of acdsee or ulead photo studio.

Loki15 · « **Reply #27 on:** July 01, 2009, 07:54 PM »

Yes I understand this, but the best free alternative, is gimp, which can't hold a candle to photoshop..

Josh · « **Reply #28 on:** July 01, 2009, 08:03 PM »

Then is that a problem with photoshop or with gimp? I really don't think you can say that photoshop isn't worth the price asked simply because the freeware alternative isn't as sophisticated.

wraith808 · « **Reply #29 on:** July 01, 2009, 08:45 PM »

So Wraith are you saying every single music file on your computer that is being sold, you paid for?
-Loki15 (July 01, 2009, 07:33 PM)

Yes. Is that so hard to believe? No matter what you believe, two wrongs don't make a right, IMO.

Loki15 · « **Reply #30 on:** July 01, 2009, 09:00 PM »

No, but why should people be charged for wanting to learn? There are plenty of people who sit on their asses their entire life and never intend to learn a thing. So why should someone who wants to learn be charged $189.00 for an educational photoshop? Why can't they make it an option to where you can learn, yet can't save the image as a .jpg, or .png? I mean.. Little things like this would really help the world out.

Once again, Wraith, and Josh : I mean no dis respect to you at all. For the most part I believe pirating software is wrong. Yes, I do download music every now and again. But lately its been acapellas and instrumentals to try to mess around and make little mixes here and there.

Ehtyar · « **Reply #31 on:** July 01, 2009, 09:20 PM »

Just quickly, I don't appreciate the hijacking of this thread, nor do I imagine anyone else does. Unless your replies directly relate to the subject of this thread, please take them elsewhere.

Paying for content from TPB would be like buying a pound of apples at the market when you could walk down the road, and pick the apples from a tree, that are of the same quality.
-Loki15 (July 01, 2009, 01:26 PM)

Of better quality in many cases. It's as though the apples down the road were organic, and the kind you buy were sprayed daily with pesticides, and you were a pest. No matter, eventually the content-controlling corporations will realize that if they don't adapt they will go out of business.

Ehtyar.

Loki15 · « **Reply #32 on:** July 01, 2009, 10:56 PM »

Ehtyar very well said. I hope you don't mean I am hijacking the thread. I'm just putting in my opinion to what has been said.

J-Mac · « **Reply #33 on:** July 01, 2009, 11:46 PM »

Just quickly, I don't appreciate the hijacking of this thread, nor do I imagine anyone else does. Unless your replies directly relate to the subject of this thread, please take them elsewhere.

Paying for content from TPB would be like buying a pound of apples at the market when you could walk down the road, and pick the apples from a tree, that are of the same quality.
-Loki15 (July 01, 2009, 01:26 PM)
Of better quality in many cases. It's as though the apples down the road were organic, and the kind you buy were sprayed daily with pesticides, and you were a pest. No matter, eventually the content-controlling corporations will realize that if they don't adapt they will go out of business.

Ehtyar.
-Ehtyar (July 01, 2009, 09:20 PM)

Sorry Ehtyar. I won't even post my thoughts here other than to say that this is possibly the most baffling thread I have read on DC. { Shaking my head... }

Jim

nosh · « **Reply #34 on:** July 02, 2009, 02:27 AM »

I wonder who's next on the hitlist...

Or how soon a compromise will be reached for all kinds of media - something like Spotify has (apparently) done for music. Any Spotify users here who can vouch for how good or annoying it is?

Please don't forget most megacorps wouldn't bat an eyelid before squeezing every last drop out of their legit users, regardless of the inconvenience caused. Like when I pay extra to get a worthless POS TV channel which has acquired the rights for a single worthwhile event, and end up watching more ads than event.

IMO, to think of TBP and the like as long term players would show a lack of vision. And what they're doing isn't "right" but this wasn't a clean fight to begin with. In the long run the TPBs of the world will have played a significant role in leveling the playing field and for that they have my gratitude. RIP TPB!

johnk · « **Reply #35 on:** July 02, 2009, 06:20 AM »

Just quickly, I don't appreciate the hijacking of this thread, nor do I imagine anyone else does. Unless your replies directly relate to the subject of this thread, please take them elsewhere.
-Ehtyar (July 01, 2009, 09:20 PM)

With respect to Loki15 and Ehtyar, I don't think the thread was hijacked -- I think all posts were on topic.

Loki15's original post was about TPB "going legal", and how sad that was because it is the best torrent site.

Some of us disagree, and will be glad when all the torrent sites go legal. Perhaps the most worrying thing about the internet (for me) is the fact that millions of young people now seem to think that stealing is acceptable. It's not, and never will be. Stealing films is not acceptable, stealing Photoshop is not acceptable. It is a crime. That needs to be said every time someone defends torrent sites (excluding the small percentage of people who only use torrent sites for legal purposes)

I think I'll bow out of this thread now.

Loki15 · « **Reply #36 on:** July 02, 2009, 06:27 AM »

John, I never implied stealing was okay. Especially stealing for ones own gain. Not everything on a torrent site is illegal, you can find legal things as well. TV shows, not sure if they are legal? Ubuntu, little things like that.

I respect your opinion and you raise a valid argument. I mean absolutely no dis respect towards you at all. I thank you for your intellectual opinions, I wholeheartedly do.

johnk · « **Reply #37 on:** July 02, 2009, 07:00 AM »

I mean absolutely no dis respect towards you at all.
-Loki15 (July 02, 2009, 06:27 AM)

Likewise, Loki. No disrespect intended to you either. I think this thread has actually been in the best DC traditions -- posters have been polite and respectful to other members.

Lashiec · « **Reply #38 on:** July 02, 2009, 09:35 AM »

Or how soon a compromise will be reached for all kinds of media - something like Spotify has (apparently) done for music. Any Spotify users here who can vouch for how good or annoying it is?
-nosh (July 02, 2009, 02:27 AM)

I'm completely sold on Spotify. I no longer have to hit the torrent sites to hear new music, since their catalogue is enormous, although it still lacks (and will probably lack forever) certain groups (The Beatles, Metallica, Pink Floyd...), as well as many independent groups (local efforts, mind you), and certain albums or artists due to regional restrictions (just off the top of my head, this includes Foo Fighters "In Your Honor", Katie Melua and Lady Gaga. A great loss not to be able to hear the latter, for sure :-P).

The sound quality is outstanding (Vorbis at q5, ~160 kbps, for all effects completely transparent), and premium users (10 € per month) can go up to Vorbis at q9 (~320 kbps). Spotify runs almost unnoticed by me, while the free accounts are ad-supported (using banners in the program interface, and sound ads roughly every 20 minutes between songs), you can minimize the program in the system tray and thus only have to suffer through the sound ads. The only thing that you could call annoying is its reliance on the BitTorrent protocol to ease the load on their own distribution servers, since it's non configurable, a while ago I had several speed problems with web browsing probably due to high use of my upload bandwidth, though I've not experienced anything similar in a while.

Plus it has has some nice perks included. Volume normalization and Last.FM scrobbling included in the program for all users, and certain niceties for paying users (albums available before they are released, just like any torrent site :-P, and ticket giveaways for concerts). While is not enough for me to consider paying for it (with 120 € a year I can easily buy more than 20 albums with no restrictions included), it certainly is pretty nice. I mean, the first time I heard about it I signed up without giving it a second thought, which hardly is a normal thing for me :-D

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nosh · « **Reply #39 on:** July 02, 2009, 10:09 AM »

A great loss not to be able to hear the latter, for sure :-P

Awww! Poor you!

Thanks for the feedback.

Gothi[c] · « **Reply #40 on:** July 02, 2009, 11:09 AM »

First of all, below is personal view, I don't claim any as fact, which is something that should be stressed more often I think...

Piracy (at sea) is a crime.
Depending on where you are, I think downloading copyrighted stuff is not. It's a felony at most, unless something changed recently... (ianal)

Does that mean infringing copyright OK all the time? no.
Does that mean it's OK sometimes? probably.

There's no black and white in this. Only gray. With lots of propaganda from both sides. Gosh, it's just as bad as politics. Then again, most of it IS politics. Stay clear!

I'm just saying it's way too easy to adopt terminology that is carefully inserted by the big players with marketing money to mold opinions of the masses.

It is quite obvious that copyright law as it is, is not in sync with the real world. And the playing field is corporations with big bucks versus people without big bucks (after all, if they had the money, they'd be more likely to pay for the software). It's also quite obvious that there's something wrong with never paying for software by a small independent starving lone developer if you DO have the money to support them (which goes for BOTH payware AND Free software!).

We need people like TPB who, eventhough they might be on the other extreme of the argument, at least stand up for their rights against the giants for the sake of all of us.

And more on topic, the fact that they are donating the money exactly for that cause is probably way better than them getting sued into oblivion.

wraith808 · « **Reply #41 on:** July 02, 2009, 11:29 AM »

Piracy (at sea) is a crime.
Depending on where you are, I think downloading copyrighted stuff is not. It's a felony at most, unless something changed recently... (ianal)
-Gothi[c] (July 02, 2009, 11:09 AM)

Ummm... isn't a felony a crime?

And while I do agree with civil disobedience, the conscience that drives that should be so that obviously criminal actions aren't enabled or condoned. I just hope that this step wrt TPB allows them to get some semblance of their lives back, and perhaps sparks them to try a more legal direction towards changing DRM. You don't really change legal statutes by going outside of the law in the arrogant way that they did, but I also recognize that obsequious acquiescence isn't going to get us anywhere either...

It's definitely a pickle...

40hz · « **Reply #42 on:** July 02, 2009, 01:49 PM »

It's definitely a pickle...
-wraith808 (July 02, 2009, 11:29 AM)

The sad part is, regardless of how it all plays out, it will still be "business as usual" for the musicians out there.

The only difference will be who ends up burning them this time around: the record companies-or their fans.

Maybe that's why most bands have flat-out declined to be drawn into this debate?

And so it goes... $:-\$

Loki15 · « **Reply #43 on:** July 02, 2009, 02:16 PM »

Im trying to understand how they can go legal.. Like, yeah maybe 2$ (Idk the actual price, but I'm just guessing) for an album is fine. But if Adobe Photoshop (and other software) torrents exist, how can it be worth the companies time? Why would Adobe want the small small cut of what TPB gets preferred to the large cut (pure profit) they get from their sale?

40hz · « **Reply #44 on:** July 02, 2009, 03:01 PM »

We need people like TPB who, eventhough they might be on the other extreme of the argument, at least stand up for their rights against the giants for the sake of all of us.
-Gothi[c] (July 02, 2009, 11:09 AM)

Except they didn't, really. $:-\$

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #45 on:** July 02, 2009, 03:50 PM »

Im trying to understand how they can go legal.. Like, yeah maybe 2$ (Idk the actual price, but I'm just guessing) for an album is fine. But if Adobe Photoshop (and other software) torrents exist, how can it be worth the companies time? Why would Adobe want the small small cut of what TPB gets preferred to the large cut (pure profit) they get from their sale?
-Loki15 (July 02, 2009, 02:16 PM)

The other question to be answered is how are they going to vet all of the torrents (assuming they are going to keep it a torrent site)? Currently the website doesn't actually have any copies of the files available for download - are they really going to vet every single file that gets posted? If so are they going to be legally liable for any malware that is propogated via a commercial site - surely if they are a commercial entitiy they will have a duty of care to their customers?

Loki15 · « **Reply #46 on:** July 02, 2009, 05:08 PM »

The other question to be answered is how are they going to vet all of the torrents (assuming they are going to keep it a torrent site)? Currently the website doesn't actually have any copies of the files available for download - are they really going to vet every single file that gets posted? If so are they going to be legally liable for any malware that is propogated via a commercial site - surely if they are a commercial entitiy they will have a duty of care to their customers?
-Carol Haynes (July 02, 2009, 03:50 PM)

Very very true. Since people will pay for the downloads, the company is held liable for them to be clean. I don't think the company who bought them out know what they are getting themselves into.

Carol Haynes · « **Reply #47 on:** July 02, 2009, 05:21 PM »

I suspect all they really bought is the name. I can't see how they could begin to adapt TPB's business model into a legitimate commercial enterprise.

Loki15 · « **Reply #48 on:** July 02, 2009, 05:30 PM »

There's no way they will, with sites like Mininova, and Demonoid out there, it will be nearly impossible to charge for torrents. If a big company with high funding, and bought all the torrent sites, then I think they could. But no way, even with knocking the top of the pyramid off.

Dormouse · « **Reply #49 on:** July 02, 2009, 06:07 PM »

Any Spotify users here who can vouch for how good or annoying it is?
-nosh (July 02, 2009, 02:27 AM)

Pretty wonderful really. No noticeable lag, huge choice (though not complete by any means, and especially light on some types of music). Certainly made me wonder how much point there is in having hard drives devoted to storing music. You're not supposed to record it, but you can and programs like Replay Music will name most tracks accurately as they do it.

Not sure how well the business plan will work out in the end or where the income will come from (enough people paying, lots more ads, addon benefits?), but if there is enough music, and I can put it on my players when I want (ie recording allowed), and can use it on my phone etc, I'd be happy to pay a subscription. And I probably wouldn't keep huge amounts of music stored long-term (easier to get it again from Spotify) ... and I had thought I was a hard core supporter of actually owning CDs etc (never really saw the attraction of buying tracks from iTunes etc)