Where to start with computer programing

[CWuestefeld]

i have decided to learn java and go from there.

-josephus (October 13, 2008, 02:45 PM)

Not what I'd do, but that's what makes the world interesting. Java is certainly an acceptable starting point.

I mentioned Design Patterns in between my flaming. This is a means of cataloging and documenting the lessons that others have learned. It saves us from having to reinvent the wheel when we run into a similar problem, and it gives us a better likelihood of success because their downfalls are documented as well.

It's also a little bit like getting ready-made experience in a can: if you know this stuff, it's almost as if you'd solved these problems on your own. They also provide a common vocabulary so that developers can communicate these ideas succinctly: "you might do this by defining an interface and a Factory Method to return the appropriate implementation".

People have developed these in many languages, now. Here's one catalog for them in Java; you can easily find other java sources, as well as for other languages.

[mahesh2k]

You can try out Comeau C/C++ Online here :http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout/

You can use http://www.compilr.com/ for C#

For Java you can try :http://www.innovation.ch/java/java_compile.html

Java Practice problems are here :http://javabat.com/

I hope these sites help beginers 

[PaladinMJ]

josephus:since no one else has said this, you might also want to look at visual basic to get you started. It does have its flaws, but it is object oriented and I have found that some people are able to understand "basics" better when they were presented thru VB. There are many people who will say that it is a terible language, but really which ever language helps you "get it" the easiest is the one to start with. You'll only know that from fooling around with them a little.
As for the making your own os binary or assembly is probably the language you want there but they aren't the easiest to start wit. that being said I started with assembly...

every language has strengths and weaknesses, find the one that speaks to you.

[Ehtyar]

I also started with assembly. The only reason it's fallen out of favor with me is that assembly is not of a cross platform nature, and since I intend to use Windows only for as long as necessary, I would've had to entirely recode everything I've written after I make the switch. I also agree with PaladinMJ about going with which language helps you 'get it' (though I would definitely recommend C# over VB).

Ehtyar.

[CWuestefeld]

though I would definitely recommend C# over VB

-Ehtyar (October 22, 2008, 03:14 PM)

As would I. Older VB has problems with consistency -- retrofitting the idea of "default property" made things complicated. And the fact that the "&" operator can change meaning depending whether there are spaces around it or not is just evil. But that's fixed in VB.Net.

However, once we get to the .Net 1.1 platform, C# and VB are almost equivalent. I'm pretty sure that you could port from one to the other just using some clever regular expression substitutions. So there's no reason you can't get on board with C# as easily as with VB.Net.

But moving on from there (.Net2 and forward), C# has really grown as a language, and VB not so much. So if you take the C# branch, you'll find that the language is better able to progress with your abilities and demands.

[PaladinMJ]

though I would definitely recommend C# over VB

-Ehtyar (October 22, 2008, 03:14 PM)

As would I. Older VB has problems with consistency -- retrofitting the idea of "default property" made things complicated. And the fact that the "&" operator can change meaning depending whether there are spaces around it or not is just evil. But that's fixed in VB.Net.

However, once we get to the .Net 1.1 platform, C# and VB are almost equivalent. I'm pretty sure that you could port from one to the other just using some clever regular expression substitutions. So there's no reason you can't get on board with C# as easily as with VB.Net.

But moving on from there (.Net2 and forward), C# has really grown as a language, and VB not so much. So if you take the C# branch, you'll find that the language is better able to progress with your abilities and demands.

-CWuestefeld (October 22, 2008, 03:54 PM)

ahh see i haven't coded in over 8 years, C# was just coming out and I have no real knowledge of it. I really should pick it up an have a peek. I've been hankering to hack code lately...

[tinjaw]

However, once we get to the .Net 1.1 platform, C# and VB are almost equivalent. I'm pretty sure that you could port from one to the other just using some clever regular expression substitutions. So there's no reason you can't get on board with C# as easily as with VB.Net.

-CWuestefeld (October 22, 2008, 03:54 PM)

You can do that online.

Where to start with computer programing

Oh! I suggest you learn to program here.

[Ehtyar]

Good lord, have you been sick Tin Man? I was starting to wonder what python-related song we could play at your funeral... *cough*getyourarseintotheircchannel*cough*

Ehtyar.

[jgpaiva]

Ehtyar: Here's the answer to your question

[Ehtyar]

OH
MY
GOD
Tin Man got a life. I don't recall issuing permission for that *cough*i'mnotjealous*cough*

Ehtyar.

[Shades]

@Ehtyar:
At some point in time Tinjaw posted a picture of him together with his girlfriend...which I saw back then (you know...that inquiring thingy  ).

Unfortunately I cannot recall the link anymore and it will very likely be removed (one's inquiry is opposed to others privacy).

Let's just say that if you are jealous now, you definitely should not have taken a look at that picture. Not only would you give Tinjaw permission, you would gladly your blessings as well. I for one totally understand why we don't see so many Tinjaw posts here anymore.   

@Tinjaw:
My best wishes for you and your loved ones. Hope you can forgive me for being so liberal. 

[tinjaw]

Thanks for the compliment Shades. I don't want to hijack this thread, so maybe I'll post to the Living Room.

Back to talk of programming...

I have preordered a copy of IronPython in Action and am looking forward to playing with IronPython -- especially if it ends up with official support in Visual Studio.

The other piece of advice I would like to give josephus, is one that I have given to others before on this topic. Pick something you like to do, a hobby, and build a *complete* program for something related to it. Complete shouldn't imply large or comprehensive. Small is good. But *complete* it. It will help you learn how to program while still keeping your interest. Something book example don't always do well at. That means to do the boring stuff like adding comments, aligning stuff in the correct columns on output, using the proper text color on output, etc. All the nitpicky stuff that turns out to be 80% of what a programmer needs to do in any given programming language.

[Armando]

Interestingly, most universities here (Montreal -- Quebec, Canada) start to teach programming by teaching Java. That's what I'm doing right now (errr.... not teaching Java, but... learning Java...  ). I must say that I like Java. Of course, I lack perspective, but... since I'm not a complete life newbie, I think I'm at least partially able to recognize nice structures...

Anyways. I was actually going to start with Python (very attractive language, if I may say so), but had to switch to Java for my first programming course. It's okay, I don't regret it : Java is fun and, like f0dder said, it's got a pretty well furnished library to keep you busy for a while... Also, as (still) others have said (Ethyar?), Java (and also C#) is a good language to get a job (well... it is here... might be different elsewhere). Must say though that I'm not into getting programming a job at the moment (more having fun) -- but who knows... in the future, maybe.

(So you see, I got contaminated...  . Damn.)


PS : Edit : I believe mouser  said something ( somewhere) I strongly believe in : you need to have fun and work on projects that keep you motivcated. And a good "book" (ebook or paper book) is a good friend.   

[Fred Nerd]

I'm learning/trying to learn programming. And was going well in AHK Programming School until SOMEONE put in a killer question which effectively killed me.

But I want to keep going, however I'm one of those people with so little time that if it isn't useful, I won't bother.
I want to make add-ons for web bowsers. Things like blockers, form filler in'ers, and whatever else I can think of.
Cloud computing means browsers will be as important as OSs.

So where do I start, and am I biting off more than I can chew (as usual)?

[mouser]

Great idea to focus on this area -- i think you'll find it's a bit of an initial learning curve but that you'll have the advantage of being able to start out modifying example code.

I think what i'll do is add a new section to the Programming School on Firefox Extensions.  We can start out slow.

FireFox Extension Programming School Section is now Live:
https://www.donation...ndex.php?board=252.0