Author Topic: bigger screen area than monitor size - with quick scroll features (Read 57989 times)

nudone · « **Reply #25 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:16 PM »

not sure what's happening but the 'ctrl' + click feature isn't working for me with the latest version. i'm not too sure what's happening with the move focus window too.

sorry. just seen that it's using the win key now and not ctrl.

jgpaiva · « **Reply #26 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:20 PM »

I just uploaded another version, with the "keep focused window on screen" thing working... Well, sort of.

I'm finding it to be quite anoying, to say the truth. What do you think? I'm having trouble moving windows around (the damn screen follows the window) and it's constantly moving the screen, becoming more of an anoyance than a feature.

nudone · « **Reply #27 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:27 PM »

have you uploaded a screengrab by mistake?

the keep focus window i don't quite understand - or perhaps what is happening on my screen is hard to understand.

it looks to me that it would be best to just keep windows fixed in there place unless the user manually moves them.

at the taskbar will flash to indicate a program window requires attention the user can quickly just use the drag feature to get to the correct area location.

if the 'jump' feature is implemented then i don't think it will be a big deal to do a quick 'short drag jump' action.

hmm. i think i've only just realised something. when you wish to navigate through the extended screen area without using the mouse, i.e. using alt+tab. that's what you were trying to figure out i see. i didn't quite appreciate that but now i do.

jgpaiva · « **Reply #28 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:31 PM »

have you uploaded a screengrab by mistake?
-nudone (February 15, 2008, 12:27 PM)

I did, sorry

I just uploaded yet another version, and this time it looks VERY good, probably the best solution found. (still isn't detecting the taskbar and thus it's moving to the wrong place, but it works fairly well).

Now.. on to the "move by a screen" feature.

nudone · « **Reply #29 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:51 PM »

i notice that 'alt+tab' and taskbar click sometimes works and sometimes does something unexpected.

other than that, i must say i'm very impressed with how it's behaving.

i can already see when laying out two large windows side by side it is good to navigate between them using dragging instead of alt+tabbing as you would normally. like if you are coding in one window and checking something in the next window. it is pretty much like using dual monitors.

i think this must be because there are a lot more visual references for your eyes to fix onto as you drag the windows about. when you simply alt+tab (or use virtual desktops) you have to readjust your view and quickly figure out where you should be looking within the program window. doing the dragging method is more natural and gives your eyes time to work out where things are within the program window.

in fact, i think it's brilliant. just messing about doing it now dragging left and right between two large windows full of text side by side.

this program will, of course, allow you to have a program window opened up beyond your physical monitor screen, i.e. you could be working/searching within an editor with long lines of code and you could stretch the window out to be double it's normal width and height. then you could quickly drag around within this window seeing how code is arranged without having to collapse the line lengths like you normal have to do.

that is also a potentially fantastic way of working i think.

this util is set to revolutionise computer and human interaction from this moment on

jgpaiva · « **Reply #30 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:06 PM »

Ok, i just implemented the "jump" feature and i'm not sure about this... It's just counter-intuitive for it to jump like this.

How about if we added a "pan speed" feature? Something that when set to 2, would make the screen move in a rate of 2:1 to the movement of the mouse (currently it's 1:1). This'd make it really fast to pan without making these strange jumps. (possibly i'm not enjoying this feature much because it isn't really that well implemented, though

).

See the other post for the new download.

jgpaiva · « **Reply #31 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:49 PM »

I just tested this setting the "MaxVerticalScroll" to 0, and i think it's the best way to use it. It implies more dragging, tough, so, i added the 2:1 movement, and things are better now.
(i disabled the "jump" feature, i was finding it WAY too anoying)
Check out the new build!

jgpaiva · « **Reply #32 on:** February 15, 2008, 04:03 PM »

And another update... It doesn't ignore the placement of the taskbar anymore! (this is REALLY turning into something very useful

)

jgpaiva · « **Reply #33 on:** February 15, 2008, 05:29 PM »

Ok, and updated again. Added the "move everything other than the window under the mouse" feature, on win+rbutton drag.
I also changed the window setup to a 2x2 square, looks like the best size.

nudone · « **Reply #34 on:** February 16, 2008, 03:18 AM »

i like how the current version is working. the speed of the scrolling, etc.

i have some weird things happening like maxthon vanishing off screen never to be found - so i have to close it from the taskbar. perhaps this sort of thing will suddenly fix itself as you get further on with the code - or maybe it's a conflict on my machine.

the 2x2 screen area feels about right - it would still be nice to have a border to indicate where the edge is.

perhaps it would also be useful to prevent a window from going outside of the boundary so that you know you've reached the edge of the work area.

that .ini file you mentioned would be good too.

edit:
forgot to say that i never got to try the 'jump' version as i was offline whilst you were playing with it.

edit:
i also forgot to say that perhaps it could be an option to just use the mouse buttons to drag rather than use a key press. right button drag on it's own should be okay shouldn't it? and maybe instead of win + click it could be left mouse button + right mouse button click. my reasoning is just to make it as fast to use as possible - just using mouse buttons requires even less effort by the user than having to hit the keyboard.

jgpaiva · « **Reply #35 on:** February 16, 2008, 05:03 AM »

About maxtron: yep, that has happened to me, still figuring out what it is.

Edge indication: currently i'm working at the functionality level, i'll add that after

perhaps it would also be useful to prevent a window from going outside of the boundary so that you know you've reached the edge of the work area.

Unfortunately, preventing windows from going outside the boundary isn't something i know how to do at the moment.

forgot to say that i never got to try the 'jump' version as i was offline whilst you were playing with it.

Yes, i noticed. I'll restore it in a future version (with a decent implementation)

Now.. About the hotkey. There are a few problems here. Dragging with rbutton isn't a good option, because there are browsers that use right-mouse dragging for mouse gestures, and lbutton+rbutton can't be used either because it interfeers with normal usage of the mouse.
I could set it to use a combination of the other mouse buttons,but not all mouses have those

nudone · « **Reply #36 on:** February 16, 2008, 05:09 AM »

ah yes, i use maxthon with mouse gestures ALL the time, so the right button wouldn't be good for me either.

it looks like the win key is all there is. maybe middle mouse button but i think i probably prefer the win key method.

ThalSwe · « **Reply #37 on:** February 16, 2008, 05:46 AM »

Started playing around with this and really liking it. Started using a single 22" LCD recently instead of my old 2x 19" CRT's and sometimes missed that extra space you get with dual monitors but this can make up for the lost space in a convenient way.

It feels really quick and responsive with the dragging and alt-tabbing as far as I have experienced but not really stressed tested it with other then some basic explorer windows open along with Opera and Thunderbird.

Maybe could be nice with a hotkey that jumps a certain distance sideways (of your choice, WIN+(directional keys?)) so you can access or simply look at the items out-of-view without using the mouse. For example I used to have all my IM programs on my second monitor so I could see who was online etc at all times without the contact list stealing space from the primary monitor. Will use this in a simular fashion by putting them out-of-view and checking them now and again. Just think it would be convenient to "jump" sideways by hotkey (the needed distance, maybe changeable through the .ini yourself), check what you want and then jump back with the hotkey without ever letting your hands leave the keyboard (dont always have a hand on my mouse).

nudone · « **Reply #38 on:** February 16, 2008, 06:01 AM »

i think jumping a whole monitor screen (or whatever) makes sense using something like win key plus arrow keys. or what about win key plus the keys under the right hand in touch typing. so something like 'win + i' goes up, 'win + ,' goes down, 'win + j' goes left and 'win + L' goes right. well, something like that as i see that 'win + L' currently goes to the log on screen.

ThalSwe · « **Reply #39 on:** February 16, 2008, 06:11 AM »

Yeah, I like that implementation. Didnt consider the placement of the keys until you mentioned it but it makes perfect sense as your fingers will be placed there automaticly (if you have a correct finger placement when it comes to typing

).
Was thinking that a modifier key could be used to get around the WIN+L problem (as that hotkey can be useful and wished to be maintained) but that would ruin the simplicity of setting up the keys and learning them. Much more smooth with just WIN as the only modifier throughout the script.

(I am just rambling on random I think but hopefully I make some sense and perhaps adds to the general brainstorming you two have going

)

nudone · « **Reply #40 on:** February 16, 2008, 06:22 AM »

well, win + k doesn't seem to do anything. providing the keys are easy to access AND easy to remember i wouldn't mind what they are over in that area of the keyboard.

jgpaiva · « **Reply #41 on:** February 16, 2008, 08:34 PM »

I'll add customizable keyboard shortcuts to jump one screen on the next build. (for me, the best is win+h, win+j, win+k and win+l for left,down,up and right respectively: that's what VIM uses and i've configured that in opera like that too

)

nudone · « **Reply #42 on:** February 17, 2008, 03:03 AM »

excellent. looking forward to it.

ThalSwe · « **Reply #43 on:** February 17, 2008, 04:13 AM »

Looking forward to it.

nudone · « **Reply #44 on:** February 18, 2008, 03:35 AM »

just a quick suggestion for when things are finished - does a name with the word 'drag' in it sound more fitting than the word 'scroll'?

maybe 'desktop' might give the wrong impression also - as it is the open windows that move but not the desktop itself.

maybe something like 'dragwindows' or 'screendrag' fits more? any thoughts?

tomos · « **Reply #45 on:** February 18, 2008, 08:54 AM »

or dragscreen as opposed to -queen?

ThalSwe · « **Reply #46 on:** February 18, 2008, 09:53 AM »

Skrommel already played on the dragqueen name with his "dragking" auto-copy script. Kind of like the idea as it will be easy to remember (above dragscreen that is). WinDrag (or flip the words) is an option as well. Indicates that you drag windows AND use the win key to do so.

nudone · « **Reply #47 on:** February 18, 2008, 10:27 AM »

i like the dragqueen/screen joke so i'd pick that at the moment - screen might be a better description of what happens also as it is a 'screen' of windows that you drag - not just a single 'window'.

PhilB66 · « **Reply #48 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:27 AM »

Interesting stuff. DragScreen is good.

BTW, I went hunting for a name and came across ScreenScroll. Have you tried that one before? This tool is also mentioned on http://www.virtualplastic.net/.

nudone · « **Reply #49 on:** February 18, 2008, 12:03 PM »

that screenscroll program appears to be a command line thing - i don't quite understand the point of it.