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Recent Posts

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1401
1: Agreed, a thread split is probably advisable. Incidentally I did take advantage of the "pay what you want" sale - $20 - mostly on the basis of how nice and informative the dev is. :)

2: Jibz, that's a good idea. I'll add it to my project tracker.

- Oshyan
1402
Living Room / Re: Which prize would you choose?
« Last post by JavaJones on April 15, 2010, 07:06 PM »
Well, I thought at first "most people will choose the $1000, so I'll get better odds with the $250", but then I realized $250 isn't really that much money, so I might as well go for something that I'd actually appreciate. Does that make me greedy? :D

- Oshyan
1403
Yeah, I think there are a couple things to consider with voting.

First of all this would theoretically be a community of serious RAW enthusiasts, so they'd know what they're looking for. Seeing blown highlights, clipped shadows, etc. would theoretically make them rate something down, even if the overall contrast and tone were "pleasing".

I think it would also be good to have at least a few categories for rating, perhaps with the final score an aggregate or something. So for example rate on the following attributes that are particular to RAW conversion: Range Preservation, Detail, Overall Appeal. Careful selection of the rating criteria should help ensure reasonably reliable results.

Methods to discourage favoritism might be necessary as well. It would be important to consider whether votes should be anonymous. Votes might also include comments (optionally). It could be like ratings/reviews on e.g. Newegg or Amazon for example (Newegg perhaps more applicable as the review there are generally short).

The idea of the site continues to evolve in my mind, but the core concept is definitely consistent, and remains appealing to me. I still don't hear a lot of interest from others, though I certainly appreciate the feedback, ideas, and constructive criticism. But, would you use the site? ;)

- Oshyan
1404
That's the one I just linked to. ;)

- Oshyan
1405
Just to clarify as I think my last post was not totally solid on this: Part of the idea here is that multiple users of a given app would learn from each other using specific and easily comparable examples. This is a system designed for image comparison and differentiation. So it's not just that you'd find out whether DxO handles Sony RAW files better than Capture One, you'd also find out how other Sony users use DxO to process their RAW files.

If voting were involved, imagine a statistics are that shows the most highly voted processing results, and aggregates them across RAW processors, taking numerical result representation into account (i.e. if one app does not have as many processed results as another it is noted as a less accurate result, but is not "punished").

I think it could be a very powerful learning and product comparison tool. I'd call it "RAW Spot", or maybe "RAWsome". ;)

- Oshyan
1406
Site/Forum Features / Re: NANY 2011 :: A New Concept -- Have your say!
« Last post by JavaJones on April 15, 2010, 01:17 PM »
I think what I am objecting to here is that it feels a bit like you are insinuating that first class apps will be better or more useful, while it sounds like they will just be better documented and easier to install.

I would say that's probably more an issue of how it was stated than an actual reality. And perhaps it's all just about figuring out how to communicate this to people so that the spirit is maintained, while also allowing room for the growth and improvement that is desired.

I think it might be valuable in the discussion to reference some of the statistics that informed the original admin discussion that led to these potential changes. These ideas didn't just come out of the blue, as far as I know there has been decreased involvement, and more and more rushing as the event has aged through the years, so changes seemed necessary. That's my understanding anyway.

I agree also that if NANY is not considered a partly promotional event, then these changes are less necessary, and it alters the goals a lot. At the same time perhaps we could also consider a half measure, removing the *result* promotion and simply promoting the contest participation as a way to get people into DC. It's really the post-event results that have the potential to get outsiders using apps that might not be ready for "prime time". As far as I have seen the most useful and interesting apps tend to get their own unique and specific publicity from the "usual suspects" sites. Word of these apps' existence may have been spread through the NANY result announcements, I'm not sure, but it does seem like other popular DC software gets the word out there without NANY promotion. So perhaps the results should not be a focus at all, and just trust that the apps that shine the most will, er, shine and become popular. :D

- Oshyan
1407
General Software Discussion / Re: Vpn folders, file operations and speed
« Last post by JavaJones on April 15, 2010, 01:10 PM »
HFS can do a limited form of file upload/download over HTTP. Might be workable over VPN?
http://www.rejetto.com/hfs/

- Oshyan
1408
But also "best result" settings with different programs, so someone could post an image from Adobe Lightroom that looks great and they'd provide the settings "Sharpen 33%, noise reduction 10% chroma, 5% luma, reduce black level by 5", etc.

For me, the problem with the idea is that the "best settings" will be specific to both the program and the photo. And, when you are looking at any "best" result, you will probably be looking more at the user's preferences and skills than on the program's capabilities.

Since I mostly use DxO, an extra problem would be that I only have the modules relevant to my cameras & lenses. I can't remember if I can download others free (I think I can) but I'm not  massively keen on loading my computer with lots of extra stuff when DxO has a fairly convoluted update/upgrade system.

Granted that the settings would be specific to the image and the program, but that's kind of the point. Given A: a common image and B: a piece of software how do you C: obtain the best result? It will vary from photo to photo, but I am quite certain that patterns will emerge over time that can be extrapolated across many photos. It is not so *totally* different from image to image, in fact there is a lot of overlap. It also has somewhat to do with personal taste of course, but this could potentially be reflected with votes, e.g. vote for the favorite processed image in a comparison. So let's say 10 people process the same photo with DxO, and one person manages to get a lot more clarity out of it, while still maintaining the "dreamlike" quality of the original image. That person's image gets voted up, and people can examine their settings to get an idea of what they've done.

Seems like an interesting way to share processing knowledge to me, while at the same time helping to determine what the best RAW processors are, and also what are common problems for RAW processors. It could he helpful and informative to the software developers too, giving them a crowd sourced repository of challenging RAW processing scenarios (images).

- Oshyan
1409
I'd be responsible for finding and hiring (or coercing :D) a coder. I'm more interested in whether anyone else likes the idea and would contribute both source images and conversion test results.

The intention would be to compare anything and everything. Certainly I'd like to see default settings compared since this is the first thing many people see and without knowing a product many people will judge on that. But also "best result" settings with different programs, so someone could post an image from Adobe Lightroom that looks great and they'd provide the settings "Sharpen 33%, noise reduction 10% chroma, 5% luma, reduce black level by 5", etc. To make it easier there should probably be fields, maybe application-specific (so templates for each app would have to be made in that case - maybe a later addition to the site).

Anyway the focus would be on image comparison functions, plus making it easy to upload and group images for comparison.

- Oshyan
1410
This just in: a high-end editing solution (which I've never tried due to it being... high end) is going to be open sourced soon:
http://www.prlog.org...source-platform.html
Sounds very powerful. Here's the product page and a promising screenshot of the UI:
http://www.editshare...d=155&Itemid=203
Note that I have read it used to be a hardware-based solution, which often means a proprietary, clunky UI and/or workflow, or at the least some odd holdovers from the days of being on a more purpose-built hardware platform. So be prepared for that. Still, a promising option, and perhaps the first real professional-level choice that the open source market has had...

- Oshyan
1411
Do you have shell access? I reckon you could probably setup a CRON job to make MD5 hashes of all files uploaded to a specific directory/tree if said files did not already exist. Then you could just make local MD5s and download the ones from the FTP to compare if there was ever any doubt.

- Oshyan
1412
Would anyone be interested in a website setup specifically to share source and output comparisons for RAW conversion? For example you would register, then upload a RAW file that you took for others to convert using their software of choice. Others would then upload their conversions, with e.g. details of program, version, and settings used. Then you could run a side-by-side or maybe a mouse-over flip comparison to judge the differences, as well as maybe download the full-size result files for better comparison.

This is something I've been thinking of doing lately, and I'm curious if anyone else would actually be interested not just in the results, but in contributing to it. Lutz, it looks like you'd have something to contribute. ;)

- Oshyan
1413
There has been a break in the posting stream in this thread, so I expect we now are done with the zillion dollar programs, or what? Why must I come here for a free or low cost editor and be told that a $600 editor is what I need?

What about a $72 editor?
http://www.amazon.co...atinum/dp/B001CPFWI2
Same root technology as Vegas Pro as far as I know, but made for the home market (like Photoshop Elements). The sad truth is this is one area where the free and open source options are sorely lacking.

- Oshyan
1414
N.A.N.Y. 2010 / Re: NANY 2010 Release: Twigatelle
« Last post by JavaJones on April 14, 2010, 03:10 AM »
New = lightning bolts that don't do anything and ball INSANITY? Thank god for Ball INSANITY on level 10, it helped help me *barely* win finally. I swear that's the hardest level. :P

On another note, I think "pong mode" is too "stable" sometimes and the "catcher" should move randomly a little (while still being there to "catch") for each bounce, thus avoiding "steady state". I had it happen just now where the ball literally bounced in a precise vertical line 20 times, blowing 90% of the "pong mode" time. Also, it's more like "breakout" than pong I think. ;)

So what do the lighting bolts do...?

- Oshyan
1415
Really? Hmmm. Lame. Well, maybe he can just tell someone else and they can publish the results themselves as "verification". :D

- Oshyan
1416
Living Room / Re: Weekly TechNews Appology for 10/04/2010
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 04:39 PM »
Congrats on the new job. All will be forgiven if the next update includes kittens. :D

- Oshyan
1417
Living Room / Re: UK amateur photographers: if you're good, don't use Boots!
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 04:37 PM »
And I disagree with your disagreement. ;) How do the store employees distinguish between "child pornography" and a parent taking pics of their kids having fun swimming, which just happens to be naked (as kids often are), or in the bath, or whatever? Not to mention, do you really think a child pornographer would be stupid enough to go and print something at a shop like that? How many people doing malicious things are really going to use a public service like that and risk getting caught? Do you think more criminals would be caught than innocents? Do you want the FBI knocking on your door one morning with a warrant after you drop off photos of your kids at the local printer? Sure it's an "innocent mistake" and you would eventually be cleared of any wrongdoing, but is it reasonable to go through that kind of ordeal just on the outside chance that it might possibly catch someone who could be doing something illegal? Surely there are better ways of finding and incriminating these people that will have less "collateral damage".

- Oshyan
1418
Living Room / Re: How do you rip your DVD collection? (I want to know)
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 03:35 PM »
Yes, it's definitely a better container format than AVI (which is very outdated at this point). I think it's not used more often for the same reason Ogg Theora isn't used more often. Whatever that reason is. ;)

- Oshyan
1419
Living Room / Re: Hidden Netflix Marathon Gems to Watch Online
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 03:31 PM »
Ok, you've got a lot of good points there. :D Perhaps I spoke too harshly in saying that it was put there for "shock value". Of course I expected that many such events would happen over the course of the series, but "telescoping" them, as you say, into a 2 hour movie is where the problem comes in. It makes it *seem* like it's for shock value. I understand it wasn't, and I wasn't even necessarily assuming it was, more - as you said - that he was forced to compress everything down. I just kind of felt like maybe he should have left room for a sequel, since he had so much more story to tell. Of course that would have been a gamble on him getting a chance to even do a 2nd movie which, given the axing of the original series, probably wasn't a safe bet. So he was probably right to do what he did. But still, so sad. If I had a couple million, I'd throw it his way just to finish it.

- Oshyan
1420
Living Room / Re: UK amateur photographers: if you're good, don't use Boots!
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 03:28 PM »
I've heard of lots of other cases of this in the US as well, Walgreens or Walmart was one example I think. One of those "Wals". ;)

Anyway it's definitely a ridiculous thing. The zealotry and misplaced responsibility over copyright protection is quite frustrating. The store should not be responsible for policing their users, just as Google should not be responsible for policing YouTube (current Viacom suit) or ensuring that photos uploaded to Picasa are not violating someone's copyright. These are just "dumb" services, and in order to work properly in the *majority* of situations, they need to take no responsibility for what their *users* do with the service. Taking any copy protection burden will inevitably hurt real users more than possible infringers.

- Oshyan
1421
Before that blog post I honestly had little interest in Sagelight. Now I'm definitely going to try it when I get home.

If you're happy with what you have and know how to use it, then I'm not sure it's worth changing your workflow. What Rob talks about is applicable whatever software you use. That said his plans for Sagelight are very promising.

That's just it. I haven't settled on a package yet, and my absolute biggest priority is *proper* RAW processing. Which is why it's so important to me that he names the packages he tested, so I know A: how to reproduce the tests he's done with my own files and B: potentially what products to avoid or at least be wary of due to improper RAW processing. There is also the possibility that he accepted the program's defaults but that there are ways to get more "baseline" RAW output from a given tool and he just didn't use it, in which case naming the software would allow users of it to point out how the test might be made more fair.

- Oshyan
1422
For those interested in RAW conversion, there is a very interesting post on 11th April in the Sagelight BLOG.

Wow, that *is* an interesting blog post. But FFS why doesn't he mention the names of the programs he compared to? What does he have to lose? It's a factual comparison. There shouldn't be any legal or other problems, should there?

Before that blog post I honestly had little interest in Sagelight. Now I'm definitely going to try it when I get home.

- Oshyan
1423
Living Room / Re: Hidden Netflix Marathon Gems to Watch Online
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 01:30 PM »
Fair point. I'm glad they were able to have one last hurrah. Just wish they could have done it over several seasons, instead of one 2 hour movie with "big stuff" thrown in for shock value and emotional impact. But I still love the movie. :D

- Oshyan
1424
Living Room / Re: Hidden Netflix Marathon Gems to Watch Online
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 01:22 PM »
Yeah, but because it was a movie, they had to do lame things like kill off characters to make it "epic". :P

- Oshyan
1425
Living Room / Re: Hidden Netflix Marathon Gems to Watch Online
« Last post by JavaJones on April 13, 2010, 12:05 PM »
I'll second Firefly. Love that show. Such a shame it only made it 1 season.

- Oshyan
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