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Author Topic: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)  (Read 2621 times)

Steven Avery

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BASIC CALENDAR "OVERLAY" NEED

Talking about single person calendars. 
Yet multi sub-categories, like this:

Internet-Radio-TV
Christian Conferences
Financial
Auto
Business
Local Events

Input through Windows mostly.

And I just tried out Zoho, I actually was impressed with its sub-calendars that are all on the one screen, in the upper-left, with their own colors. You can check-mark which ones are active for the overlay aspect, which is what this post is mostly about.  One limitation, I don't think you can "Save" a view of say 5 of the 10 calendars you set up.  Nonetheless it is fine, easier than most I have seen.

==========================

EXTRAS

Possible +, not fundamental

shows on iPad  (ok, Android too)
groups of people, good for BIZ - (Zoho has that)
integration with email, task, notes etc. (not that important for me, since I am Rightnote and Eudora/TheBat! oriented)

A calendar entry is quick enough to enter. the 3-second saving from a Gmail is not important, since you always tweak them anyway.
 
=======================

TYPES OF CALENDARS

Different types of Windows-capable entry calendars, I think they go into 3 basic categories, although some may be hybrid. Free or pay is okay, but not a monthly fee above about $3. Some good calendars are embedded in PIMs (Efficient apparently broke theirs out) and some programs in the RightNote genre might surprise you with a good calendar implementation.  I'll make any adjustments to this as we go long. And I don't care much about importing or even exporting, this is meant to be the master that makes the rules. (Well, Facebook Events might be an exception, OneCalendar, not included, too simple, mentions that.)

==========================

Many of these are likely just too simple for the overlay requirement.

1) net-web online based 
   Google, Zoho, Outlook, 30 boxes, Timetree, Fruux, SmartDay, Jorte, Cozi. DakBoard, MineTime

2) windows home-base - Vueminder, Thunderbird, Efficient, Rainlender (literally on the desktop)
   -- embedded in PIMS (Essential, Time&Chaos)

3) mobile-centric - Fantastical, Pimlical, Pocket Informant, PocketLife, Any.do, Business Calendar 2
  (I am not checking if they are Windows capable yet, however, these are more for Tablet Thinking)

==========================

So what works well? 
Is Zoho one of the leaders from my requirements?

This is sort of a follow-up on an earlier 2016 thread that was a bit more tablet-centric.

calendar that is happy in Windows and on tablet
http://www.donationc...ex.php?topic=42984.0

I've decided that for me data entry should be Windows based, either web or Desktop 

Thanks!
« Last Edit: April 03, 2019, 08:54 AM by Steven Avery »

Steven Avery

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2019, 08:04 PM »
My Calendars.jpgcalendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)  

This is how Zoho handles your creation of what I will call sub-calendars, or component calendars.  Whatever you have checked will be showing its entries, and you essentially can combine them any way you want, but you cannot save what we would call a "combined calendar View"

I like this better than tags or categorys or keywords.

Who does similar or better ? Perhaps Vueminder and a few others?  How does Google compare? 
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 08:15 PM by Steven Avery »

tomos

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2019, 02:32 AM »
This is how Zoho handles your creation of what I will call sub-calendars, or component calendars.  Whatever you have checked will be showing its entries, and you essentially can combine them any way you want, but you cannot save what we would call a "combined calendar View"

[..] How does Google compare? 
-Steven Avery (April 04, 2019, 08:04 PM)
pretty much the same thing with google, you can combine calendars, but it does not save combinations.
Tom

Deozaan

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2019, 05:18 PM »
That said, if for some reason you wanted to combine separate calendars into a single one, you can do that. Google allows you to export your calendars (separately) and then you could import all the separate calendars into a single combined calendar.

Steven Avery

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2019, 08:10 AM »
Ironically, one thing that is a bit of a hindrance with Google is the ease of having multiple accounts. While they make it pretty easy to switch, it still is an extra step or two.  I have at least 2 or 3 accounts that I am likely to be signed in on,  one handles biz stuff, one bible stuff, one personal finances (they all forward to my email client.) There are another dozen accounts, but those I am unlikely to sign in.

So if I want to pin a calendar page to the browser or taskbar, or an easy bookmark, right now I am leaning towards continuing with Zoho.

Putting aside integrations (I prefer to hand put every entry in one central spot) any major advantages or disadvantages considered.   

All suggestions welcome.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2019, 08:21 AM by Steven Avery »

Steven Avery

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Now I want to talk about Alarms, which are the critical element of calendars.

I use a free alarm app called Alarmy, which on my Ipad advertises itself as the most annoying, it has a method of increasing volume, and unless you go into some special sleep modes, it will remind me of anything.  (There is a professional version, but I don't think it is structurally different.)

The problem is that it is not linked to a calendar, and the only repetition it has is weekly, you can not simply pick a date a month away without it ringing 4-5 times. It is good for meetings in the next week or so, daily reminders (e.g. house alarm), weekly reminders (e.g. Friday garage sales), but it does not do well calendar events like a Hudson River festival two months off. You will have to endure 8 'false alarms',

I'm looking for a loud-annoying pushy iPad-PC alarm that works as part of a calendar setup.

In a pinch, I will take iPad only.

Your thoughts? 

Steven 

superboyac

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totally with you steven.

I have gone round and round with calendar software over the years (and contact management too, but i'll leave that out for now).  Here are my results...

syncing:  this is the heart of any calendar decision as i have multiple devices (android, windows, web) and they gotta work good together.  so, there was a facebook calendar that i tried to sync with all my other calendars, and it turned out to be literally impossible.  none of the big companies are cooperating with each other as far as syncing.  facebook, google, outlook, apple...good luck syncing with them all seamlessly.  I gave up on facebook...they are SHIT for trying to work with other programs.  i dont care what ANY of the tutorials or links out there say.  there is NO WAY.  go ahead and try.  i spend i wont even say how long looking and trying to make things work.

then, i eventually just realized this.  outlook has the best calendar features.  no other program will do it.  whatever it is, you will eventually see that calendar functions in outlook just are better than other software or companies.  so you say you dont want a two-step middleman process, but if you want syncing, i would say go with outlook.  i use a free account on the web literally just for calendar syncing.  i enter calendar details through desktop outlook or mobile usually.  one of the things to pay attention to is notifications/reminder features and recurrence features.  other programs will screw this up, not outlook.

you can also setup your own calendar like a radicale etc.  (I have done this).  problem is, none of the self-hosted solutions are very nice.  they are difficult to setup (speaking from a non-programmer windows user).  again, i have LOTS of notes on all this.  so using a free outlook account is still the best for me as far as calendars.

there are a couple of standalone calendar software i have somewhat high praise for.  Vueminder, and Calendarscope.  i hate calendarscope license policy, it will be expensive in the long run, and vueminder is somewhat bulky but pretty nice.  THE PROBLEM is the entry of items...it still is best to do it in outlook for more reasons than im willing to write right now.  but VIEWING the items on windows is infinitely better on these two programs.  calendarscope is very lightweight and just beautiful interface.  vueminder is a bulky bloated app, also pretty beautiful.

then i found another free thing that would overlay calendars with colors on the desktop wallpaper.  that was nice, but not as useful as i thought.

then there's mobile/android stuff.  i currenlty use digical.  not perfect, but best ive found so far.  the mobile experience is tolerable at best to me.  as long as things sync im ok, and if i can enter things nicely.  but nitpicking the beauty or the intricate functionality of it...not great...i have so many suggestions. 


Steven Avery

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Thanks superboyac!

And have you any success with making a nice annoying loud tablet Alarms?

CalendarScope is a free 30-day trial, then $30 + $20 for HandySync to get to iPad, or others like Android. 
Have you tried this method?

And I own a seven year-old Vueminder license. I doubt it does any easy sync. So we again have a 30-day trial, on a product that is likely the $80 Ultimate version.  If that is one-time for the version, without a yearly subscription, it is worth a trial. However, to sync with an iPad it looks like it is based on Google calendar or "Microsoft Exchange and Office 365".. I have a sense that could be messy, since it is two steps to the iPad.

However, you say the plus is VIEWING, after entering from Outlook.  Can I justify the cost for that purpose? Maybe I can use my old Vueminder, if I have the 9.x file.

Radicale looks like too much.

In a few minutes I will try to see what Outlook Calendar account I should be using.

superboyac

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I'm not exactly sure what you're asking regarding alarms and tablets...but if its Android, the app i use for alarms is called "Alarm Clock Xtreme".

Your vueminder license will probably not work, unless you got the lifetime option at some point. 

I would probably choose calendarscope if it were me.  Its the best looking and extremely lightweight.  BUT...i dont like their licensing policy and all these additional things like syncing you have to buy...all these you have to renew every year.  And like you said, just to make it look good?  I don't think its really worth it...it would be like $100 a year.  and it might not be so seamless either...for example, outlook doesn't have many colors to choose from for stuff in their calendar items.  but vueminder, calendarscope have any color combo you want.  how do those colors sync?  they don't.  so whatever app you use on your phone will show different colors than your computer, and outlook will show different colors altogether.  and outlook colors "categories" whereas these other programs can do more than just categories.  but again, how do they sync across pc/web/phone?  they do not.

so that's why, after over a decade of trying calendar software out, now i'm just entering them in outlook straight.  i dont mess around too much with colors.  i use "digical" on my phone and the colors are all different on phone, pc, web, etc.  i dont care anymore, i cannot control it, and its not worth it.

superboyac

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I'll answer your original question in detail here:

BASIC CALENDAR "OVERLAY" NEED

Talking about single person calendars. 
Yet multi sub-categories, like this:

Internet-Radio-TV
Christian Conferences
Financial
Auto
Business
Local Events

Input through Windows mostly.

-Steven Avery (April 03, 2019, 08:15 AM)
If you are going to input through windows, i highly recommend inputting directly through outlook.  Full paid-for outlook on windows desktop.  Why?  things like recurrence work better on outlook (especially something that has no end date).  Outlook can do multiple calendars, and multiple categories...both will allow you to color it independently.  What's the difference?  Not much, really.  Depends if you want one calendar, multiple categories....or multiple calendars, one category.  I suggest multiple calendars, forget categories...why?  because the colors you choose for the categories will not transfer to different apps (like android or ios), but you will usually be able to custom color each individual calendar.  also, you dont have to worry to choose a category when entering a task...just pick the calendar you want.

EXTRAS

Possible +, not fundamental

shows on iPad  (ok, Android too)
groups of people, good for BIZ - (Zoho has that)
integration with email, task, notes etc. (not that important for me, since I am Rightnote and Eudora/TheBat! oriented)

A calendar entry is quick enough to enter. the 3-second saving from a Gmail is not important, since you always tweak them anyway.
-Steven Avery (April 03, 2019, 08:15 AM)
any outlook calendar will show up on ipad or android or mobile.
contacts management is a different issue and headache altogether.  i can post more later, and i also have several good posts here over the years regarding contacts.
integration...i use the bat also.  and rightnote (although i have now moved to onenote almost exclusively).  for contacts, i have my own cardav server....the bat cannot sync with it, it has issues.  i dont think the bat has good contact/calendar syncing features.  it doesnt even have a real calendar.
rightnote has good features, but difficult to make part of this workflow.  you must be doing something very specific.

your OVERLAY requirement...
If what you mean is multiple categories/calendars showing on one display with different colors etc.,  I'd stick to outlook.  Use multiple calendars.



ultimately...i would get something like calendarscope or other 3rd party software (like i used to), but only outlook's features are reliable for me, so i use it alone now, and just apps on phones.  I VIEW my tasks on outlook on the pc, and on Digical on the phone.  Alarms would be something you setup on the phone and should be independent of the app.  Outlook or most calendar apps dont have specific ALARM functions....if that's important you probably want yet another 3rd-party pc software or app to do that.  That should be fairly easy to find I think.

I'd stay away from committing to suites like EssentialPIM or something.  Think about syncing.  Facebook events are terrible and will have many many problems syncing with things.  It's all been a frustrating experience for something so common, old....i've been doing this for so long.  For years, the big three google apple facebook kept fighting and pulling their sync tools away from each other and now none work all that well unless you pay for extra services. 


there is one tool i am looking into committing too once again, Mylifeorganized.  It has a nice workflow and can do a lot.  Not really a true calendar software as it has no calendar view, but has some very interesting features to organizing tasks and integrations.

Steven Avery

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2019, 07:22 AM »
"i use a free account on the web literally just for calendar syncing.  i enter calendar details through desktop outlook or mobile usually.  one of the things to pay attention to is notifications/reminder features and recurrence features."

"If you are going to input through windows, i highly recommend inputting directly through outlook.  Full paid-for outlook on windows desktop."

==============

Desktop - $129 for one puter
https://www.microsof...=pivot%3aoverviewtab

Download for free? (trial only)
https://www.lifewire...010-download-1173343

Seems to be too much for me for just the ease of 1 puter entry.

===

Would the Online free calendar (which is nice, I did not really know it was available.)
https://outlook.live.../calendar/view/month - when you are signed in,
have many pluses without the Desktop?
Compared to Google or Zoho, including the iPad integration issues.

Maybe it has more overlay flexibility (calendars and/or categories.)

=============

MLO looks nice, I have an ancient license (again) however it is too task oriented.
I am not a fan of highly structured personal tasks. (In biz, sometimes.)

=============

And I am moving more towards Protopage combined with Rightnotes.  Protopage allows a many column view which is a feature that is incredible. (Like Google Keep, but with lots of extra Herbal Iron). Its big weakness is the lack of a real solid all-points-bulletin search function. I even suggested to them how to do it.  However, it is very good on having a master page with a top-down hierarchy (One URL-MultipagePages(Categories)-Tabs within each page-versatile widgets, including RTF and pics.) Moving a bit away from Evernote.

============

Synchronizing a calendar to a loud annoying alarm (like Alarmy, but with Calendar thinking months ahead) is still a major search item.

============

Right now, I am simply using TheBat! for my contact list. In biz, we might use Hubspot. For awhile I though of an Airtable type online program.

I shoud research the cardav server (Radicale?).

superboyac

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2019, 11:12 AM »
if you dont want to pay, yes, you can use the free online web outlook.com, and that will work totally fine.  That's what i do.  If you want, you can pay like $6/month for office 365 and that will get you the desktop app.  but you're right, no need to pay just for the ability to enter through the desktop.  you can still enter directly through the web and phone.

yes, mlo is heavily task stuff, no calendar.

protopage looks cool.  ill have to play around with it.

you are doing contacts in the bat??!  wow.  i cant stand the bat's contact module.  best of luck!  i actually manage my contacts with my on radicale server and emclient.  why emclient?  ill tell you...its the only way i found where i could sync contacts to my phone and elsewhere WITHOUT losing quality on the contact photos.  this has been a painful setup also.  why do i do this?  if you let google/android do your contact syncing, as soon as it syncs, all your nice contact photos will be lowered in resolution to something like 200x200pixels.  if you do what i do, you will be able to keep about 700x700 or around there.  i bet all of you who have contact photos have them crazy pixelated and horrible quality (unless you use ios then it may be ok).  AND to make the syncing work on the phone, i use a third party sync called ContactSync, another powerful hard-to-configure app.  i got through ALL this to keep high quality contact photos on my phone.  ridiculous.

Steven Avery

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Re: calendars and sub-calendars - overlays - (tags and categories)
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2019, 05:43 AM »
I tried

Last Alarm Clock/Wake Up Music
https://apps.apple.c...p-music/id1191086152

In the picture you can see the "Specify Date" which is missing in Alarmy and

Apple's Alarm app
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207512

The alarm was a little pip-squeaky, I will check that, it did work ok otherwise.

Steven