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Last post Author Topic: Want to make some extra coin? Like a LOT of extra coin? BIG BOUNTY!  (Read 9315 times)

Renegade

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Want to make some extra coin? ;D

http://www.reddit.co...e_platform_that_can/

Quote
$100,000 bounty for software platform that can replace the Bitcoin Foundation

Hi Everyone,

My name is Olivier Janssens, early adopter and Bitcoin millionaire. The Bitcoin foundation has had its role in the last 2 years. Unfortunately, it is internally recreating the same archaic political system that fails to work for society. Bitcoin is the currency of the internet generation. It puts the power back into the hands of the people. You cannot expect its main representative organisation to be exactly the opposite: A non-transparent, political and secretive elite. We have been trying to push the BF for transparency and clear communication for years, without result. Meanwhile they started creating even more political structures inside, such as committees, which can only be accessed by knowing the right people. At the bitcoin 2014 conference, organised by this same organisation, I expected to see full internet participation + live streaming of their events. Especially of the BF member meeting, where they are supposed to get input from their members and disclose what they have been up to. Instead, the board decided that the event is not to be recorded or broadcasted. We have also no idea or say on how our money is spent. Half of their board gets elected by industry members (a group of about 100 companies), and recently lead to another extremely controversial election of Brock Pierce, which has a history of being connected to cases involving fraud and pedophilia. This needs to stop.
We as an internet community, don’t need public figures to decide what’s good for us. We need to stop politicking and start focussing on the projects directly. For example, we need a project to fund the core development of bitcoin, and put our money straight to that. We need a project to have lobbyists in Washington, to fight the anti-bitcoin lobbyists from Mastercard, and to prevent the government from destroying the currency. Basically, we don’t need another intermediary. We can do this ourselves. Therefor, I want to announce today that I am organising a contest and giving $100k USD in BTC, to the group that can come up with the best platform to make this happen. I am thinking of a system where prominent people can voice their opinion, where people can propose projects, and where the core devs can actively show their roadmap with detailed features + costs, and where we can vote on the features being implemented by sending bitcoins towards the feature of our choice. This will allow the core dev team to expand by being able to add/pay more devs for feature requests which are fully funded. Maybe we can even evolve to a system later where anyone can work on a feature, which, when programmed properly (approved by the core team), will receive the bounty. The same applies to lobbyists, we just send bitcoins towards the one that we consider the most competent for the job. This will allow Bitcoin to grow and expand at a rate it deserves, a rate that a political organisation such as the foundation can never accomplish.

Let’s liberate bitcoin.

Olivier

Rules of the contest:
  • Anyone can participate
  • Software will be open sourced
  • I will cover the initial hosting costs, until it can be self funded and created as a DAO
  • Reddit community can help by voting on the platform submissions they like the most
  • Ultimately I will decide who wins, but I will take all votes and feedback into account
  • Deadline for submissions is 1 month from now: 17 june 2014 at 12:00 UTC
[/size]

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

40hz

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While I respect the hope behind the offer, I can't see where anything like this (should it really take off) will remain immune to the same problems and malevolent forces that are besetting Bitcoin right now. Any time the potential for huge amounts of money and power gets put on the table, it's only a matter of time before the less noble element shows up to exploit it - with government and criminal interests arriving close behind.

So while I think it's great that Mssr. Jannsens has proposed this (hopefully with the most noble of intentions) I don't think it will ultimately turn out much different than what has gone before it.

Still, I wish this endeavor the best of luck. Because it's going to need it. :huh:
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 06:15:49 PM by 40hz »

wraith808

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So while I think it's great that Mssr. Jannsens has proposed this (hopefully with the most noble of intentions) I don't think it will ultimately turn out much different than what has gone before it.

In short, people suck.  And the more power they have, the more they suck.  So, it's just the option of the person that's doing the sucking.

TaoPhoenix

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Even playing it "straight up" there are many other types of problems with this offer not counting tinfoil hats.

- Where is he located and under what fiscal laws govern him? The U. S. Treasury / IRS just ruled that Bitcoin counts a lot like "stocks" so I'd bet $100k is a big enough "public" amount for them to send at least a middle manager around to make sure they got their cut! (So is that $100k raw, meaning the recipient is really only keeping some $55k of it before the state level?

- I'd want a CPA/Other kind of professional to certify this guy. Coming from my position of know-nothing, this could dangerously be copied as text to become Phish V3.0, way nastier than any Nigerian! And even from him, "Hi, I'm running a huge contest, so send me a month's worth of work" leaves a lot of holes. I'd want to see a "contract/bond to pay the prize money already in escrow" for something like this.

- He lists "projects" each of which themselves would cost several millions! This is just for a "platform". Where is all *that*  funding coming from? Him?

« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 05:44:40 PM by TaoPhoenix »

40hz

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So while I think it's great that Mssr. Jannsens has proposed this (hopefully with the most noble of intentions) I don't think it will ultimately turn out much different than what has gone before it.

In short, people suck.  And the more power they have, the more they suck.  So, it's just the option of the person that's doing the sucking.

No. It's not so much people suck as they get weird - and do weird things - around money.

And the bigger the amount of money up for grabs, the more (and sooner) they get that way.

I don't know if it's "human nature" or "the odds" or "original sin" or whatever. But it works out that way often enough that it might as well be whenever people and money go out dancing with each other. ;)

Renegade

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- I'd want a CPA/Other kind of professional to certify this guy. Coming from my position of know-nothing, this could dangerously be copied as text to become Phish V3.0, way nastier than any Nigerian! And even from him, "Hi, I'm running a huge contest, so send me a month's worth of work" leaves a lot of holes. I'd want to see a "contract/bond to pay the prize money already in escrow" for something like this.

There you're missing one of the beauties of cryptocurrency - trustlessness. With multi-sig transactions you can effectively have an escrow and you don't need any certification or trust in the original person paying.

While the mainstream is blathering on about the "next big thing" being "trust" (e.g. web of trust), cryptocurrency is eliminating the need for trust.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

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So while I think it's great that Mssr. Jannsens has proposed this (hopefully with the most noble of intentions) I don't think it will ultimately turn out much different than what has gone before it.

Read more through that thread. Some people have already pointed out projects that are similar.

This all goes towards the DAO - Distributed Autonomous Organisation. They're coming...
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

wraith808

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No. It's not so much people suck as they get weird - and do weird things - around money.

I don't think that it's money.  I think it's the same thing that everything has been rooted to before money even existed as a concept- power.  All else is just an expression of this.  Power corrupts- and all of the expressions of it also.

TaoPhoenix

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- I'd want a CPA/Other kind of professional to certify this guy. Coming from my position of know-nothing, this could dangerously be copied as text to become Phish V3.0, way nastier than any Nigerian! And even from him, "Hi, I'm running a huge contest, so send me a month's worth of work" leaves a lot of holes. I'd want to see a "contract/bond to pay the prize money already in escrow" for something like this.

There you're missing one of the beauties of cryptocurrency - trustlessness. With multi-sig transactions you can effectively have an escrow and you don't need any certification or trust in the original person paying.

While the mainstream is blathering on about the "next big thing" being "trust" (e.g. web of trust), cryptocurrency is eliminating the need for trust.

Well, maybe we're talking about different dictionary definitions of Trust.

I meant at a much more human level of "do you believe this guy will actually shell out the money?"

"So Ren, if you send me a nice picture of a space alien from DeviantArt, I'll send you a dollar!"  *

*Some conditions apply.

 ;D

Renegade

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"So Ren, if you send me a nice picture of a space alien from DeviantArt, I'll send you a dollar!"  *

*Some conditions apply.

 ;D

http://wafflesmccoy....-Bunny-Babe-34186316



Thanks! You can send your dollar to me in bitcoins here:

1LoZLVjjzJp6Vt3Q4AaTkVHuM8i3obhw7Y

;D


Well, maybe we're talking about different dictionary definitions of Trust.

I meant at a much more human level of "do you believe this guy will actually shell out the money?"

And that's the point. You don't need to trust anyone as you can eliminate trust through escrow and multi-sig sending.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

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No. It's not so much people suck as they get weird - and do weird things - around money.

I don't think that it's money.  I think it's the same thing that everything has been rooted to before money even existed as a concept- power.  All else is just an expression of this.  Power corrupts- and all of the expressions of it also.

+1
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Stoic Joker

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No. It's not so much people suck as they get weird - and do weird things - around money.

I don't think that it's money.  I think it's the same thing that everything has been rooted to before money even existed as a concept- power.  All else is just an expression of this.  Power corrupts- and all of the expressions of it also.

+1

+2 - I gotta go with wraith on the power corrupts/people suck assessment also. Humans are the most savage animal on the planet, we also suffer the most self-righteous desire to inflict our will on our surroundings. So regardless of how sophisticated a machination may be orchestrated - rules and guidelines get woven into ropes - by those in the know (e.g. control). Making it at its core (intent...) simple savagery as the weak get consumed to achieve a goal.

40hz

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Man! What an ugly world some of you are living in. Sure glad I don't live there!  ;D

wraith808

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Man! What an ugly world some of you are living in. Sure glad I don't live there!  ;D

Not an ugly world.  Just one in which most people will act in their own best self-interest.  There are some that can resist the lure of power, but it is a rare person.  And usually those people are chosen by circumstance, rather than seekers of the post.  The key to resistance, IMO, is the idea of servant-hood rather than control.  And too many people in power don't realize that noblesse oblige is not just for nobles- or more simply, with great power comes great responsibility.  If you take that responsibility in the way intended, i.e. to serve and not to control, to be wielded by and not to be wielded, then you can end up with a very good leader.

Pretty alien, these days.

Stoic Joker

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Man! What an ugly world some of you are living in. Sure glad I don't live there!  ;D

That's life in the big city, the law of the jungle, life on the streets, or just me being wordy and pragmatic at the same time. You yourself have said not to try solving a people problem with technology ... And that too agrees with the other. Because the problem lies with the wanton desire to circumvent the system...not the system itself. Sure it's human nature to be curious and explore the limits. I just think it's incredibly foolish to keep trying to gloss over and ignore the existence of the predatory aspects of human nature.

Kind of like C. S. Lewis' famous quote:
Quote from: C. S. Lewis
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. Their very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be ‘cured’ against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.

...Now why do you recon that keeps happening? Is/was it a flaw in the "system" ... Or maybe was it (human nature) just us?

tomos

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Dont want to take the thread too much off-topic, but chewing on these:

Kind of like C. S. Lewis' famous quote:
Quote from: C. S. Lewis
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. Their very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be ‘cured’ against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.

...Now why do you recon that keeps happening? Is/was it a flaw in the "system" ... Or maybe was it (human nature) just us?

ties in very much with your earlier brilliant comment:

... we also suffer the most self-righteous desire to inflict our will on our surroundings.

I dont believe it's human nature, but, along with the whole idea (or abuse of the idea) of power over others - hmm...
I think all of our current problems go back to two things:
   # the 'scaling' of society - a family/small-tribal group probably originally worked much more effectively than any of todays societies/states - I think we're still struggling with that evolution of scale.
   # language: language is a huge (and wonderful) development, but allows us to kid ouselves about an awful lot of things...
Tom

40hz

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That's life in the big city, the law of the jungle, life on the streets, or just me being wordy and pragmatic at the same time. You yourself have said not to try solving a people problem with technology ... And that too agrees with the other. Because the problem lies with the wanton desire to circumvent the system...not the system itself. Sure it's human nature to be curious and explore the limits. I just think it's incredibly foolish to keep trying to gloss over and ignore the existence of the predatory aspects of human nature.


I didn't so much say not to try to solve people problems with technology as I said not to confuse or conflate a technical problem with a people problem. It's a small but important difference. You can always "solve" a people problem with technology through the simple expedient of using technology to eliminate "the people." There's been enough cases of deliberate genocide in the last thirty years to indicate it's becoming a popular option in some places.

I don't see "animal" instinct or cosmic levels of "evil" when I look at most of what is going on. What I do see is a lot of laziness, refusal to take responsibility, lack of civility, fear (as in angst), impatience, and sloppiness in our own behavior, and our behavior towards each other. I think we sometimes wish it were a "law of nature" that we be that way - because that would provide a convenient excuse for all sorts of bad behavior - and a justification for all sorts of pre-emptive and repressive responses on the part of those in power to prevent or mitigate them.

To my mind, that's a setup - a blatantly rigged no-win game - and one I choose not to play.

So I don't think I'm glossing over bad behaviors or certain people's proclivity to indulge in them. People do bad things. No argument from me on that point. But what I do disagree with is that any of this is beyond our personal ability to control when it comes to our own behavior. To say "it's human nature" means it can't be changed. And I don't see that. The human brain is like a piece of putty. People change their thinking all the time. And other people often change (or at least try to change it) for them.

And I don't think that "will to power" thing that gets tossed around is all that real for the vast majority of the population. Very few people want power as in "power for the sake of power." What they do want is to not have to feel afraid... or feel pain... or suffer want. Most just want a high level personal security as far as I can see. And it's the actions they take to get there which often bear strange fruit. But that's more a side effect or "unintended consequence" rather than an 'end' - or "the original plan."

So no...I don't think we're animals, or monsters, or rabid rabbits that need to be penned in and watched lest we all kill each other. I just think we get lazy, and tired, and impatient, and afraid - and we do counterproductive things to ourselves, and each other, as a result.

It'd be nice if it were all more "cosmic." But it's incredibly banal from where I'm sitting. And easily dealt with if you want to fix it.

The real problem is the excuses we make for it, and the psychological difficulties we encounter any time we try to change what we're currently doing. Because feeling secure is what we seem to want more than anything. Even if that security is based on feeling insecure - because at least that way you've established something (i.e. paranoia) as a given.

Just my :two: anyway. 8)
« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 04:47:58 PM by 40hz »

tomos

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I don't see "animal" instinct or cosmic levels of "evil" when I look at most of what is going on. What I do see is a lot of laziness, refusal to take responsibility, lack of civility, fear (as in angst), impatience, and sloppiness in our own behavior, and our behavior towards each other. I think we sometimes wish it were a "law of nature" that we be that way - because that would provide a convenient excuse for all sorts of bad behavior - and a justification for all sorts of pre-emptive and repressive responses on the part of those in power to prevent or mitigate them.

a big +1 there :up:
Tom

Stoic Joker

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I didn't so much say not to try to solve people problems with technology as I said not to confuse or conflate a technical problem with a people problem. It's a small but important difference. You can always "solve" a people problem with technology through the simple expedient of using technology to eliminate "the people." There's been enough cases of deliberate genocide in the last thirty years to indicate it's becoming a popular option in some places.

I aware of the distinction, I was just having a bit of fun poking you with a stick. :D


I don't see "animal" instinct or cosmic levels of "evil" when I look at most of what is going on. What I do see is a lot of laziness, refusal to take responsibility, lack of civility, fear (as in angst), impatience, and sloppiness in our own behavior, and our behavior towards each other. I think we sometimes wish it were a "law of nature" that we be that way - because that would provide a convenient excuse for all sorts of bad behavior - and a justification for all sorts of pre-emptive and repressive responses on the part of those in power to prevent or mitigate them.

I'm not implying it is a copout/excuse for anything. I'm simply pointing out that the societal tendency as of late to sweep it under the carpet is destined to backfire.


So I don't think I'm glossing over bad behaviors or certain people's proclivity to indulge in them.

Didn't say you were ... But society is.


People do bad things. No argument from me on that point. But what I do disagree with is that any of this is beyond our personal ability to control when it comes to our own behavior. To say "it's human nature" means it can't be changed. And I don't see that. The human brain is like a piece of putty. People change their thinking all the time. And other people often change (or at least try to change it) for them.

...

So no...I don't think we're animals, or monsters, or rabid rabbits that need to be penned in and watched lest we all kill each other. I just think we get lazy, and tired, and impatient, and afraid - and we do counterproductive things to ourselves, and each other, as a result.

...And that result is a tendency to fall back to our baser instincts.


Here's the thing. You are equating "animal" with "Monster" ... Which has abso-freakin-loutly nothing to do with my usage of 'Animal'. Animals do not kill for sport, humans however do. And that is simply because of our delusion-ally arrogant assertion that we humans are somehow superior to these lessor beings ... So it's somehow ok. In the bad behavior department, humans are by far the stupidest parasitic infestation this planet has ever suffered.

Animals OTOH, have a much better understanding of the usage of a measured response when it comes to the fighting half of the fight of flight reflex. An animal will kill in defense of family, territory, or survival (e.g. food) and there is nothing wrong with that. As will we, except that in the interest of maintaining a thin veneer of civility we - or more specifically or leaders in power - will also concoct any manner of bullshit story to facilitate the necessity of pursuing things even farther for the purpose of more ... Not need...just more. An animal will break off the attack the instant the threat passes. Humans...OTOH...not so much.

Tomos actually nailed where I'm coming from with his assessment of society not scaling well. The larger a crowd of people becomes, the harder they are to keep on the same page. So more and more silly assed rules - like you can't walk your alligator in the town square - get enacted for the purpose of "maintaining order". And that's when the clic's start taking over the pecking order.

See you are trying to equate animal instinct with violence, I on the other hand am not. I'm speaking to the predatory nature that is so prevalent today in how power is badly wielded in all aspects of our sad joke of a civilized society. If you take a mans life in an alley, that's bad. But if you use a 900lb gorilla of a legal tiem to destroy a mans life with some bullshit trumped up patent trolling ... Well... *Shrug* ...That's just how the system works. Yet the predatory intent was the same. We just like to kid ourselves that we're - "Civilized"... - better than the other animals because we didn't leave a literal bloody carcass laying in the street after the fight.

How high are the bodies stacked due to some corporations desire to "protect" their shareholders? If the shareholders found out, would they  really care? ...You know...after the cameras were turned off.

In the AA they like to say that the first step is to admit that there is a problem. And we need to do that ... Instead of pretending that the predatory animal nature does not exist in the core of our being.

TaoPhoenix

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"So Ren, if you send me a nice picture of a space alien from DeviantArt, I'll send you a dollar!"  *

*Some conditions apply.

 ;D
...

Thanks! You can send your dollar to me in bitcoins here:

1LoZLVjjzJp6Vt3Q4AaTkVHuM8i3obhw7Y

;D


Well, maybe we're talking about different dictionary definitions of Trust.

I meant at a much more human level of "do you believe this guy will actually shell out the money?"

And that's the point. You don't need to trust anyone as you can eliminate trust through escrow and multi-sig sending.


Heh hysterical pic!

But we're still talking about different defs of trust. Even before it gets into escrow, you have to "Trust #2" that it will get into escrow! However, see that Tarot Kickstarter thread, if I say I am too lazy to figure out how to get you your dollar in bitcoin so I won't send it and "Oh look! The Season Finale of Warehouse 13 is on!", ... then you can't "Trust #2" in me no matter how fancy the tech side is.

That's what I was referring to about that contest, it looked like some key info was missing. Maybe I'm blind but I didn't see any proofs that it was all sewn up and ready to go.




zenzai

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I don't think that it's money.  I think it's the same thing that everything has been rooted to before money even existed as a concept- power.  All else is just an expression of this.  Power corrupts- and all of the expressions of it also.

I'd rather say that too little power corrupts. If you have unlimited power you also have the power to do and get anything you want without hurting or exploiting others...  ;)

Renegade

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I don't think that it's money.  I think it's the same thing that everything has been rooted to before money even existed as a concept- power.  All else is just an expression of this.  Power corrupts- and all of the expressions of it also.

I'd rather say that too little power corrupts. If you have unlimited power you also have the power to do and get anything you want without hurting or exploiting others...  ;)


For the first part, "I'd rather say that too little power corrupts," I'd say that the way that is working right now is in how the ruling class (politicians) are enforcing socialism on people to drive them into poverty and dependence, which results in the disenfranchised masses returning to the poles to vote back in their oppressors. They vote for the very corruption that has created dependency for them.

For the second part, the current power structure is one of domination and exploitation - it is not unlimited. It relies on the suppression and dependency of others.

But, this all has little to do with nabbing that $100k bounty! :)
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

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"So Ren, if you send me a nice picture of a space alien from DeviantArt, I'll send you a dollar!"  *

*Some conditions apply.

 ;D
...

Thanks! You can send your dollar to me in bitcoins here:

1LoZLVjjzJp6Vt3Q4AaTkVHuM8i3obhw7Y

;D


Well, maybe we're talking about different dictionary definitions of Trust.

I meant at a much more human level of "do you believe this guy will actually shell out the money?"

And that's the point. You don't need to trust anyone as you can eliminate trust through escrow and multi-sig sending.


Heh hysterical pic!

But we're still talking about different defs of trust. Even before it gets into escrow, you have to "Trust #2" that it will get into escrow! However, see that Tarot Kickstarter thread, if I say I am too lazy to figure out how to get you your dollar in bitcoin so I won't send it and "Oh look! The Season Finale of Warehouse 13 is on!", ... then you can't "Trust #2" in me no matter how fancy the tech side is.

That's what I was referring to about that contest, it looked like some key info was missing. Maybe I'm blind but I didn't see any proofs that it was all sewn up and ready to go.


You can mine any other cryptocurrency then sell it for BTC. ;)

Still waiting for my dollar of BTC here... ;)

But my mistake wasn't the same mistake as you've mentioned -- the amounts we're talking about are inconsequential, and I had fun posting that pic. I didn't really expect $1 as it's all just in fun.

However, if I really did want my dollar, I could have gone and arranged with you to set up escrow, then posted the pic.

Basically, the conversation goes like this:

You) I'll give you $1 to post an alien pic from Deviant Art.

Me) Sure. Put that $1 in escrow.

You) Ok. Done.

Me) Let me check... Ok. Looks good.

...a little while later...

Me) Ok, here's your pic!

You) Great! Let's finish off the escrow.

Us) Yay! We both got what we wanted!  :Thmbsup:

At no point do we need to trust each other there. When I ask you to put the $1 in escrow, that guarantees your end of the deal, or you can look at it as me saying, "Really? For sures? Like totally for reals?" My posting of the pic is the completion of the deal before escrow completes.
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TaoPhoenix

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Hmm, well okay, I'll assume better minds than mine are watching that contest guy, and that your transaction did take place behind the scenes other than that original post.

So presuming someone checked up on that, I do get what escrow does, and then I'll go with your technical side of things.


Renegade

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Re: Want to make some extra coin? Like a LOT of extra coin? BIG BOUNTY!
« Reply #24 on: July 02, 2014, 08:07:15 AM »
The results are in!

http://www.reddit.co...winner_announcement/

Mike Hearn won with his "Lighthouse" project.

Runner-up went to the Eris project team.

There is some seriously good stuff happening there, and anarchystar really deserves the credit for making it all possible.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker