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Last post Author Topic: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...  (Read 12463 times)

Renegade

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Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« on: October 20, 2010, 07:40:18 PM »
Well, the final **** is in as Jobs f**ks the desktop.

So, there's going to be an iStore for iDiots now. Nice. How long until that douche locks out all software that isn't sold through his store? It's coming.

Quote
Macs will soon have an online application store, similar to the one for the iPhone and iPad...

...the Mac store will make it easier to reach the almost 50 million Mac owners, Jobs said

Is it possible to be full of more shit than that?

200,000 software titles and the user is exposed to 25??? Yeah. That's "easy to reach". Jobs is a disingenuous f**ktard.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

zridling

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2010, 05:30:52 AM »
Yea, but can I make a phone call with it?  ;D

Steve Jobs, feeding them candy. Natalie Merchant anyone?



Lashiec

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2010, 05:46:46 AM »
As long as the store doesn't become the only officially sanctioned way to install software, and the store includes automatic updates for the installed apps, bring it on. Like if I could give a damn about it, really ;D

Eóin

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2010, 06:04:22 AM »
+1 Lashiec, as long...

Stoic Joker

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2010, 07:03:13 AM »
Um... Using the typical 10" screened netbook price of $400 as a (starting) point of reference.

Quote
The new Air is on sale now in two versions: a 13.3-inch model costs $1,299 to $1,599, depending on the amount of memory, while the 11.6-inch product starts at $999.

They priced it really aggressively,” said Shaw Wu, a technology analyst with Kaufman Bros. LP in San Francisco. He also advises buying Apple’s shares.

$1,000 for a device with an 11" screen is considered pricing something "aggressively"...Why?!? (Viciously maybe) ...What (Koolaid Soaked) turnip truck did this clown just fall off of?

Stephen66515

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2010, 07:21:23 AM »
Um... Using the typical 10" screened netbook price of $400 as a (starting) point of reference.

Quote
The new Air is on sale now in two versions: a 13.3-inch model costs $1,299 to $1,599, depending on the amount of memory, while the 11.6-inch product starts at $999.

They priced it really aggressively,” said Shaw Wu, a technology analyst with Kaufman Bros. LP in San Francisco. He also advises buying Apple’s shares.

$1,000 for a device with an 11" screen is considered pricing something "aggressively"...Why?!? (Viciously maybe) ...What (Koolaid Soaked) turnip truck did this clown just fall off of?

I think the word "stupidly" would be better than aggresively

justice

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2010, 07:53:35 AM »
If you don't like it don't use it.

wraith808

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2010, 09:16:10 AM »
If you don't like it don't use it.

+1

Deozaan

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2010, 09:42:12 AM »
As long as the store doesn't become the only officially sanctioned way to install software, and the store includes automatic updates for the installed apps, bring it on.

I agree.

It actually sounds pretty cool to me. It's the way Linux does things (Ubuntu, at least) with the Software Center. And speaking of netbooks, have you ever tried to install something on a Netbook from a CD? It's kind of hard when there is no optical drive in the machine. A digital distribution center ala Steam for software would be great in cases like that.

Unfortunately, knowing Apple, they're most likely going to use it to lock the system down even further, which is bad. But since I don't use a Mac, I guess I don't really care that much.


40hz

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2010, 10:56:10 AM »
It actually sounds pretty cool to me. It's the way Linux does things (Ubuntu, at least) with the Software Center.

So...apple announces it wants to put a software repository behind a paywall?

Now that's "insanely great" innovation if I ever saw it.

Can't wait to see how long it will take for them to get a patent on some minor, niggling aspect of it - and then sue the developers of apt, Portage, and Synaptic for infringement.

  ;D

mahesh2k

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2010, 11:23:37 AM »
How this is different than repository that we see in UNIX/LINUX/Android world ? i mean linux has it for free and apple made it paid service or maybe mix (free/paid).
« Last Edit: October 21, 2010, 11:25:58 AM by mahesh2k »

Eóin

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2010, 02:50:48 PM »
I wonder will developers with an app in the store also be allowed to sell it through other channels, without the 42% markup in price?

Renegade

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2010, 05:09:29 PM »
How this is different than repository that we see in UNIX/LINUX/Android world ? i mean linux has it for free and apple made it paid service or maybe mix (free/paid).

There are many ways in which it is different.

1) Linux users don't berate everyone because of the software center. However, you can fully expect that soon after the Mac store rolls out, you, me and everyone else will very quickly become idiots for getting software from elsewhere.

2) This is the difference between equipping the army with M-16 and grenade launchers, and equipping the asylum wards with lethal weaponry. In the Unix/Linux/Android world people are intelligent and responsible; you have choices. Apple is insanely driven by greed (this is a trivial definition of a company in line with the legal definition); choice will disappear soon on the Mac.

Echoing concerns already expressed, this is not a good thing because it's another step along the road to locking down the Mac so that you can only use it the way Steve Jobs wants you to.

I heard a rumor about the new OSX version, Lion. It will by default behave like iOS so you can only have 1 application running at a time. It's a massive stupification of the OS. How stupid do you need to be to not be able to deal with having more than 1 application open? If you've never used a computer before, or you're under 10 years old, well, then there's an excuse. Steve Jobs has some good ideas about making things easier, but this?

Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions, but having that in Lion and the Mac store coming at about the same time... It reeks.

I don't want to see choice disappear on the Mac. I don't want hurdles to using it the way I want to.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Eóin

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2010, 05:49:47 PM »
There is no way MS, Adobe or any of the producer for big expensive graphics and music production applications are going to pay Steve 30% per purchase. However without those applications the Mac is a dead duck. So 3rd party program suppliers will always have to be available.

Of course Steve would love if everyone did pay him 30%, but in this case he won't get it.

Lashiec

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2010, 05:59:53 PM »
I heard a rumor about the new OSX version, Lion. It will by default behave like iOS so you can only have 1 application running at a time. It's a massive stupification of the OS. How stupid do you need to be to not be able to deal with having more than 1 application open? If you've never used a computer before, or you're under 10 years old, well, then there's an excuse. Steve Jobs has some good ideas about making things easier, but this?

That's not a rumor, but nonsense. And I think I don't have to explain why, do I? :)

What Lion will have, and probably fueled such rumour, it's the ability to auto save and auto resume documents and applications state, which it's a fantastic feature I'd like to see under other operating systems, even though many applications are already coded to do that on their own.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2010, 06:29:57 PM by Lashiec »

Renegade

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2010, 06:27:29 PM »
There is no way MS, Adobe or any of the producer for big expensive graphics and music production applications are going to pay Steve 30% per purchase. However without those applications the Mac is a dead duck. So 3rd party program suppliers will always have to be available.

Of course Steve would love if everyone did pay him 30%, but in this case he won't get it.

Very good point. MS, Adobe, Avid and a few others are primary motivating factors for people to use a Mac. It would be very hard for Apple to turn on them like a rabid dog. But... If past behaviour is any indicator... I'm worried.

I'm not the only one worried though. Ron Gilbert ranted on Twitter:

Quote
grumpygamer Ron Gilbert
Step 1: Mac App Store + 3rd party apps. Step 2: User option to disallow 3rd party apps for "safety". Step 3: Remove that option.

grumpygamer Ron Gilbert
For you Apple apologists claiming Apple will never lock down the Mac, step one is in place and you all let it happen.

More people in the comments here at Engadget.



I am still very leery though. I think it's just a stepping stone. While Jobs said that they won't lock down the Mac, I quite frankly don't believe him. So much of what comes out of Cupertino is just outright black lies that it's pretty much just being irresponsibly gullible to believe anything that comes out of his mouth.

I just had a mini-rant here about the Mac App Store. I of course felt the need to point out a bit of Apple lies/hype.

Dunno... It's possible that they won't lock it down, but it's just such an Apple thing to do. They've always been about **control**. There's a lot of money there and it would be uncharacteristic of Apple to not try to grab it all. They did it on the iPhone. They spit in people's faces with Logic when they bought the company.

My bigger fear is that if Apple succeeds in locking down the desktop, it will force Microsoft to go in the same direction. This is the worst thing that could happen. Linux simply doesn't have the marketing to get their product out there, and yet it would be the last bastion of freedom.

Apple's 1984 commercial is only a self-reflection now.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2010, 06:29:03 PM »
I heard a rumor about the new OSX version, Lion. It will by default behave like iOS so you can only have 1 application running at a time. It's a massive stupification of the OS. How stupid do you need to be to not be able to deal with having more than 1 application open? If you've never used a computer before, or you're under 10 years old, well, then there's an excuse. Steve Jobs has some good ideas about making things easier, but this?

That's not a rumor, but nonsense. And I think I don't have to explain why, do I? :)

What Lion will have, and probably fueled such rumour, it's the ability to auto save and auto resume documents and applications state, which it's a fantastic feature I'd like to see under other operating systems, even though many applications are already coded to that on their own.

You're right. I checked on it since I posted that. I probably should have checked before.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

f0dder

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2010, 02:48:31 PM »
I think it's just a stepping stone. While Jobs said that they won't lock down the Mac, I quite frankly don't believe him.
+1. Microsoft might be a monopoly, but I find Apple to be a lot scarier... and a lot more closed.

The idea of an App store is nice, and the linux software repositories are great - that one of the few things it, hands-down, does better than Windows.

But as soon as there's big financial interest involved, and considering censorship and the license terms Apple enforces on the iPhone App store - ugh. And there's rumors that apple might be removing Flash and Java support for OS X...
- carpe noctem

40hz

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2010, 03:14:39 PM »
And there's rumors that apple might be removing Flash and Java support for OS X...


Apple is being a little coy in it's official announcement re: Java and OS X:

Quote
As of the release of Java for Mac OS X 10.6 Update 3, the Java runtime ported by Apple and that ships with Mac OS X is deprecated. Developers should not rely on the Apple-supplied Java runtime being present in future versions of Mac OS X.

The Java runtime shipping in Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard, and Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard, will continue to be supported and maintained through the standard support cycles of those products.

I think this may have more to do with Oracle's recent legal move against Android rather than an immediate desire to kill off all Java use on the Macintosh platform. Right now I'm guessing they're more interested in lessening potential legal exposure by virtue of their having their own Java runtime port - which is something Oracle seems to be taking issue with now that they're starting to walk down the same dark legal alley that ultimately destroyed SCO.

Not that it would be completely beyond belief that Apple would decide to kill off Java support on the Mac. Apple is one of the prime examples of the N.I.H. mindset when it comes to technical innovation.

And Oracle never was the best of companions to plan a future with - unless your business "plan" was to get bought out by them eventually.

« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 03:18:06 PM by 40hz »

Lashiec

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2010, 03:16:51 PM »
But as soon as there's big financial interest involved, and considering censorship and the license terms Apple enforces on the iPhone App store - ugh. And there's rumors that apple might be removing Flash and Java support for OS X...

Nah, they're simply not bundling them with Lion, so if you want any of those two, you're on your own. It's not the brightest idea Apple ever had as, unlike the iPhone, you need Flash on desktop computers, and Oracle does not yet have a Java runtime for OS X, which it's in their best interest to get resolved soon, considering the number of Java developers working with Macs. In the end, it's just another step towards Apple absolute control over their own products.

40hz

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2010, 03:24:18 PM »
In the end, it's just another step towards Apple absolute control over their own products.

Looks like the lines of battle are starting to get drawn.

In *this* corner wearing the "CLOSED/PROPRIETARY" silks: IBM, Oracle, Microsoft, Apple, RIAA, and the MPAA...with Novell watching intently from the sidelines!

And in *this* corner: Just about everything and everybody else - including the consumers.

 :-\

« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 03:26:40 PM by 40hz »

Renegade

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2010, 07:26:02 PM »
+1. Microsoft might be a monopoly, but I find Apple to be a lot scarier... and a lot more closed.

This is really kind of odd, and I'm truly surprised that there isn't more outrage at Apple.

With Microsoft, they really wanted to control the *platform* and make some of their tools the defaults.

With Apple, they have always controlled:

1) The platform
2) The hardware
3) The defaults

Which is far more "evil" than Microsoft ever was. At any point in time. And nobody ever said anything about it. Ever. Are people blind? Because it sure seems like the "oooh, that's shiny" factor in Apple has blinded a lot of people.

But now, Apple is controlling (or trying to control) access to the platform and all sales on the platform.

Controlling access and sales. It deserves repetition.

Who's really evil?


But as soon as there's big financial interest involved, and considering censorship and the license terms Apple enforces on the iPhone App store - ugh. And there's rumors that apple might be removing Flash and Java support for OS X...

I hope karma comes back to bite them.


In the end, it's just another step towards Apple absolute control over their own products.

Looks like the lines of battle are starting to get drawn.

In *this* corner wearing the "CLOSED/PROPRIETARY" silks: IBM, Oracle, Microsoft, Apple, RIAA, and the MPAA...with Novell watching intently from the sidelines!

And in *this* corner: Just about everything and everybody else - including the consumers.

 :-\


I don't know if IBM, Oracle and Microsoft really live up to the level of villainy of Apple, the RIAA and the MPAA, but yeah... Pretty much.

I am SOOOOO rooting for Novell. At the moment, they are so underrated and they're doing so much good. Go Mono~! :D

On second thought, it's kind of like a battle royale... Throw Google in there as well. :)
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

f0dder

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2010, 09:44:26 PM »
Part of the reason people don't see through Apple is probably that they're - still - the underdog, and that their target audience are hipster zealots.
- carpe noctem

justice

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2010, 09:00:58 AM »
It's because misinterpret apple announcements like flash/java removal. all they've said is you'll get directed to the latest flash plugin when you first see a flash movie (because of its embed code) rather than it the supplied plugin being outdated the moment the OS is sold. So its not about closed, its about not having an outdated flash plugin and security /instability issues, and giving people a choice, i thought that was what open was all about :P

I believe the java thing is to do with support on Xserve servers (iirc), and server admins wouldn't have a problem installing JVM on a server either.

Anyways that will be the last time i'm visiting an apple thread on donationcoder, if you could please label them with apple then i can safely ignore the trolls. ;)
« Last Edit: October 23, 2010, 09:02:54 AM by justice »

wraith808

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Re: Welcome to Hell... iHell that is...
« Reply #24 on: October 23, 2010, 10:35:02 AM »
Anyways that will be the last time i'm visiting an apple thread on donationcoder, if you could please label them with apple then i can safely ignore the trolls. ;)

I'm glad that I'm not the only one to have noticed that the attitude towards Apple for a board that's not supposed to be anti-Apple has gotten decisively trollish as of late.  I'm not an Apple apologist by any means, but the line between a serious discourse and a witch hunt was passed a while ago, I think...