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Last post Author Topic: Windows XP Myths  (Read 38378 times)

dk70

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #75 on: October 15, 2006, 06:06:57 AM »
I suggest you check out F0dders link before you get impressed with "knowledge". And re-read this thread again nudone, obvious who is attacking who and most definitely who is for the xxxxth twisting argumentes and stated facts, like my poor old certified by Microsoft WDM driver. Point is there is no room for disagreement with this guy, exactly the point. Check F0dders tons of links again, same story everywhere. Impressed with his spamming to own site and linkage to his many "sources" is irelevant, or should be. The old wise man approach dont work either. You do realize Im now supposed to explain why WinME gave problems to many unknowlegable users (including myself of course) and explain their knee-jerk reactions, right? We are now not focusing on the WinME release, driver support, need for WinME, history of WinME etc. but stupid crybabies on forum. Of course we are. Can you spot the tactics by any chance? If you dont wish to take sides then dont.

Only people Ive ever seen padding his back are those who live out their inner troll through him or somehow see entertainment value in a thread/debate which ALWAYS will digress into this. And so he eventually end up with warnings and bans - 1+1 is 2. Simply stating facts which can be verified.

I just gave you direct qoutes from ADM and Moderator from Avast forum Mastertech. Zig-zag away, these are the facts. If I bothered I could find many more of same type but your breaking of every forum rule imaginable and general behavior is fully documented. I doubt very much ADM here should give thumbs up to that.

I dont think I should talk about another forum member like this - unless Im right.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 06:11:30 AM by dk70 »

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #76 on: October 15, 2006, 06:42:16 AM »
I suggest you check out F0dders link before you get impressed with "knowledge". And re-read this thread again nudone, obvious who is attacking who and most definitely who is for the xxxxth twisting argumentes and stated facts, like my poor old certified by Microsoft WDM driver. Point is there is no room for disagreement with this guy, exactly the point. Check F0dders tons of links again, same story everywhere. Impressed with his spamming to own site and linkage to his many "sources" is irelevant, or should be. The old wise man approach dont work either. You do realize Im now supposed to explain why WinME gave problems to many unknowlegable users (including myself of course) and explain their knee-jerk reactions, right? We are now not focusing on the WinME release, driver support, need for WinME, history of WinME etc. but stupid crybabies on forum. Of course we are. Can you spot the tactics by any chance? If you dont wish to take sides then dont.
Funny I can't find any links from Fodder to back up his dispute with the XP Myths page, he mentioned a book that doesn't even mention the setting he was referring to by his own admission. Yet I provide direct links to Microsoft Knowledgebase articles and those are to be just brushed aside?

And no you already clearly explained you don't know who to blame for your problem which was Creative Labs. Many more unknowledgeable users who frequent forums had the same problems yet all those who followed their OEMs and Microsoft's advice didn't have problems. Coincidence? I think not. What tactics? Are you implying something? I sure did not bring up ME as you can clearly see. The only tactics I see is when people can't back up what they claim they lash out with personal attacks.

Only people Ive ever seen padding his back are those who live out their inner troll through him or somehow see entertainment value in a thread/debate which ALWAYS will digress into this. And so he eventually end up with warnings and bans - 1+1 is 2. Simply stating facts which can be verified.
What is you obsession with labeling me as a "troll", actually Fodder started that when he couldn't defend his argument and resorted to stating that Microsoft does not know what it is talking about with it's own operating systems. I think it is sad that once you get beat in the technical argument you choose to try and personally attack someone.

I just gave you direct qoutes from ADM and Moderator from Avast forum Mastertech. Zig-zag away, these are the facts. If I bothered I could find many more of same type but your breaking of every forum rule imaginable and general behavior is fully documented. I doubt very much ADM here should give thumbs up to that.
The moderators at the Avast Forums don't know how to moderate, instead of removing the personal attacks posts they resorted to deleting all of mine. That is not how you moderate, you don't punish the victim simply because a few people don't like you. Please look for more if you are so confident. You have already made these unsubstantiated claims. What is "breaking a forum fule"? Posting or replying to a topic and then trying to rationally discuss it? Or is it clearly explaining how a feature of XP works with documented sources? Please tell me what that is? Apparently slandering someone by labeling them a troll and then making more slanderous statements you are unable to substantiate is "within forum rules". Why are so afraid of hearing what I have to say? Why are all the Firefox Fanboys so afraid? That is the real question.

I dont think I should talk about another forum member like this - unless Im right.
How much money do I win if I bet you use Firefox?

mouser

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #77 on: October 15, 2006, 06:59:23 AM »
dk70 you had to stir up the pot again just when it was cooling down..
this post has gotten needlessly personal,though there are still some interesting technical arguments going on.

the regular members here are the ones who should be asking themselves why they are getting all worked up about posts.

you should know by now that someone is going to step in and remind new posters that we try to be more respectful and polite here, and you should know by now that the way we deal with such situations is by treating people who we believe may be crossing the line with the respect we want them to show in kind.  that's the way this forum works.  if you think someone is out of line, then you don't start engaging in name calling, you politely point out that we try to be more respectfull here and in your reply they will see that it is true.

there's no danger of this forum degerating into flame wars, so if you see someone acting out of line, you don't have to engage in a heated battle to the death with them.  especially new visitors.  just show them by example that we take a different tone on this forum.  in time they will either realize that they like the way we do things, and tone down their approach, or they will decide they don't want to be part of the discussions, or in the worst cases we may have to ask someone to leave, but there's no need to go to defcon 1 at the first sign of trouble.

so let's take a deep breath and return to normality.

I really think that f0dder and dk70 could have taken this opportunity to demonstrate more restraint and set a better example - come on guys, lead by example!  And Mastertech I would also ask you to try to express your opinions in a more respectfull way as well, even if you feel like someone is not correct in what they are saying.

« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 07:07:42 AM by mouser »

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #78 on: October 15, 2006, 07:03:51 AM »
Wait a minute now I remember and now I understand what your problem is. dk70 you tried arguing with me about how Windows Prefetching works and why the setting in CCleaner was useless and did nothing but REDUCE performance by cleaning the folder. You didn't understand how Windows Prefetching worked or what the problem was with the CCleaner setting. I remember now... guess what CCleaner finally moved the useless clean "Old Prefetch Data" option to the advanced section and disabled it by default because I was right. Need I say more?
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 07:05:28 AM by Mastertech »

dk70

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #79 on: October 15, 2006, 07:13:32 AM »
http://www.google.co...h?q=mastertech+troll is f0dders link.

My other link is outdated yet show enough, more forums have him in "banned" group now.

Getting closer nudone? If so you are welcome...

Am I blind or did f0dder edit/delete one of his post? I send him a PM which he quoted here. Which is only reason why I jumped in - would love not to. As said ALWAYS the same outcome. I told him not to go infight with this dude because that and link-spamming is only motive as has been seen on majority of all techy sites you know of! For years even, hence the milelong list of bans and warnings. Again stating facts anyone can verify, not personal attacks. Not relevant - or is it? His last trick, as you can see, is just to turn all arguments into "personal attacks" which he then expect to be saved from. Might even turn to moderator asking for help! Same old MT game. Anyway, feel free to quote it again f0dder, all considered I couldnt care less - though next time ask first. Not entirely pleased seeing my PM in public, ok exception from the rule though.

True about Avast ADM and moderators - they should have banned you long ago. I told you they would already in 2005! Can see it miles away. Sadly you have the ability to drag some down to your level, possibly getting them into trouble, and generally taking advantage of the "good spirit", like here. Why my PM to f0dder which I sensed where obvious target since he dont submit and know too much...

Opposite you MT I did investigate features and details of prefetching, only you make a big deal of it. I gave you links to plenty of MS sources even.

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #80 on: October 15, 2006, 07:46:59 AM »
My other link is outdated yet show enough, more forums have him in "banned" group now.
How many is that? Why not actually do the math instead of making sweeping statements attempting to imply I have been banned at all these forums when I haven't. I am not even banned at Avast were you incorrectly have already claimed.

Am I blind or did f0dder edit/delete one of his post? I send him a PM which he quoted here.
Probably just like how you just assumed I am banned from all these forums like some Firefox Fanboy said, you didn't check before you made the statement.

Which is only reason why I jumped in - would love not to. As said ALWAYS the same outcome. I told him not to go infight with this dude because that and link-spamming is only motive as has been seen on majority of all techy sites you know of!
Spamming? That is odd because I did not post this topic here. My "motive" is to educate people on these Myths and for some reason I still don't know why, try to get people to stop slowing their systems down. Mainly because I can't stand misinformation.

For years even, hence the milelong list of bans and warnings.
Years? Milelong list of bans and Warnings? Please provide evidence of this.

Again stating facts anyone can verify, not personal attacks.
Yes it is a personal attack since my whole discussion has been technical in nature not why you argued about something you don't understand (Windows Prefetching) at the Avast Forums.

Not relevant - or is it? His last trick, as you can see, is just to turn all arguments into "personal attacks" which he then expect to be saved from. Might even turn to moderator asking for help! Same old MT game. Anyway, feel free to quote it again f0dder, all considered I couldnt care less - though next time ask first. Not entirely pleased seeing my PM in public, ok exception from the rule though.
I'm really confused here, so calling me a "Troll" is what? Please explain this. My question is why you PMed Fodder some slanderous BS about a topic we are not even talking about?

True about Avast ADM and moderators - they should have banned you long ago. I told you they would already in 2005! Can see it miles away. Sadly you have the ability to drag some down to your level, possibly getting them into trouble, and generally taking advantage of the "good spirit", like here. Why my PM to f0dder which I sensed where obvious target since he dont submit and know too much...
What should they have banned me for? Posting facts about Firefox that you don't like? If dragging people down to my "level" of Windows Knowledge is what you call, then that is an accomplishement.

Opposite you MT I did investigate features and details of prefetching, only you make a big deal of it. I gave you links to plenty of MS sources even.
You crack me up, please post where you gave me these "links". And why you endlessly argued something you had no understanding of. If I recall you even refused to test it. Let I remind you CCleaner did exactly what I recommended and removed the useless "Old Prefetching Option" for the reasons I clearly stated. If it was no big deal they would have done nothing of the sort.

dk70 would you consider an option in a program that when run causes Windows to boot twice as slow and all your applications to load twice as slow a "BIG DEAL"? If not please tell what you do consider a big deal because apparently the performance of your system and others are not important to you, well they are to me.

YouCantCountTo5

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #81 on: October 15, 2006, 10:59:00 AM »
I would like to thank the "MasterTech" guy and the site administration for giving me that extra oomph to decide not to donate or return to this site. This thread has more than inspired this set of actions and the fact that it has been allowed to survive this long. I've sat in the shadows for about the past 3 weeks reading these forums and the fact that this thread has been allowed to continue for as long as it has and the long time members bad mouthed publicly rather than nailing the root of the problem in this thread, is the nail in the coffin to me.

Administrator, what is your direct email address so that I can send you more details as to why I will not be returning nor will I be recommending the site to others.

In closing, you have an OK site, but any site that places more value on trying to win over the "unchangable" user and what should be "Intolerable" comments and flaming over the value of its long time members is not a place I want to be a part of.

Thanks

YouCantCountTo5
Shaun Costello
Phoenix AZ

mouser

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #82 on: October 15, 2006, 11:11:02 AM »
you can mail me at mouser@donationcoder.com or send me a pm message through the forum.
i have the utmost respect for the long time members on this site - i consider myself good friends with f0dder and in fact.  i'll let them speak for themselves if they feel i've treated them unfairly.  i respect your views - i might suggest though that you may be reading too much into my criticisms of them.  i'm pretty sure they understand through my other conversations in private with them how much we value them.  it's more of giving them a friendly little rap accross the knuckles here to let them know that as long term members they are expected to lift up the forum in terms of friendliness and professionalism and courtesy, and not get drawn into the muck even if their tempers get riled up.

we do make an extra effort to make new visitors feel welcome, and try hard to keep things friendly and respectful, and make new visitors feel comfortable posting.  in general i think people know by now that i don't like locking threads - i tend to feel like it's better to let these things burn out on their own, which they inevitably do, rather than end with people still feeling like they wanted to get in one last word..
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 11:15:28 AM by mouser »

Carol Haynes

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #83 on: October 15, 2006, 11:29:08 AM »
Here, here - I too have come close to locking off the thread but retreated from that action as I don't feel comfortable doing it (or even suggesting it). Time to knock it on the head guys or Cody will be out with his razor sharp itellect to sort you out (not to mention a nasty nip from his beak!)

app103

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #84 on: October 15, 2006, 12:17:33 PM »
I don't see anything wrong in what mouser said/did.

I tried very hard to resist replying to mastertech's attacks on my point of view, and instead tried to lighten up the mood of this thread twice, with humor.

The point mouser was trying to make, and it is a beneficial one for this forum (or any forum for that matter) is if you think someone is a troll, don't feed them and they won't come back for more.

Sometimes it's easier said than done, though. And I think mouser handled it the right way.  Mouser was just trying to remind us of that.

I, for one, walk away from this thread a little better of a person than I was before....stronger...able to resist falling into traps and avoiding becoming part of a problem instead of the easy solution.

Thanks mouser.  :Thmbsup:
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 12:32:11 PM by app103 »

mouser

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #85 on: October 15, 2006, 12:47:18 PM »
there's an opportunity to learn from every thread like this, so at the risk of beating a dead horse let me clarify what my main point was, since i think i was trying to say something more than that.

my main point was to treat people with more respect even if you don't think they deserve it and even if they don't give you that respect in return.  and if they attack you, rise above it, without giving in to a desire to insult them, and however tempting it might be. either you will find you misjudged them, or they will get bored and stop engaging you, or they will learn from your example and become better people, or it will become clear to everyone that something deeper is going on.  note that this advice could be taken by everyone who participated in this thread.

most importantly in remaining above the attacks you will set an example for other people who are reading the forum, that this is a place where people are trying hard to be respectfull and welcoming.

and please don't get the impression that i am taking sides against long time members of this site - i'm not, im just asking long time members to demonstrate the spirit of this site when they deal with such situations.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 01:08:30 PM by mouser »

Darwin

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #86 on: October 15, 2006, 12:51:10 PM »
Yeah... I'm actually one of the long-term site members that rose to Mastertech's bait but I escaped Mouser's censure... I respect and support Mouser's position on this because I respect Mouser enormously - look at what he's accomplished with this site - and so far the problem on this thread has been posters, such as myself, reacting to Mastertech. There are people that I don't get along with at work, but I choose not to engage them, rather than expecting them to be fired (as pleasant a prospect as that might be ;)). This situation is no different.
"Some people have a way with words, other people,... oh... have not way" - Steve Martin
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 12:56:09 PM by Darwin »

f0dder

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #87 on: October 15, 2006, 05:02:29 PM »
I don't see a problem with how mouser has handled the situation and haven't taken any insult. I'm used to deal with much worse trolls like ***** (my own censure there). Personally I would probably have locked the thread, and looking at the track record MasterTech has, would have banned him.

But on the other hand, look at how nice the whole DonationCoder site is, and how friendly people generally are - I think it's at least partly due to how the admins handle situations here.

I'm going to be 100% honest though and say that I believe MasterTech is a annoying little troll and that I'd kick him in the stomach if I met him face-to-face... and yes mouser, I'll have some chocolate and cola now ;)
- carpe noctem

nudone

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #88 on: October 15, 2006, 05:08:07 PM »
I would like to thank the "MasterTech" guy and the site administration for giving me that extra oomph to decide not to donate or return to this site. This thread has more than inspired this set of actions and the fact that it has been allowed to survive this long. I've sat in the shadows for about the past 3 weeks reading these forums and the fact that this thread has been allowed to continue for as long as it has and the long time members bad mouthed publicly rather than nailing the root of the problem in this thread, is the nail in the coffin to me.

Administrator, what is your direct email address so that I can send you more details as to why I will not be returning nor will I be recommending the site to others.

In closing, you have an OK site, but any site that places more value on trying to win over the "unchangable" user and what should be "Intolerable" comments and flaming over the value of its long time members is not a place I want to be a part of.

Thanks

YouCantCountTo5
Shaun Costello
Phoenix AZ

bizarre.

mouser

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #89 on: October 15, 2006, 08:45:38 PM »
f0dder that last post of yours was totally uncalled for.. seriously i really wish you could show some better judgement here. i expect more from you than that.

tslim

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #90 on: October 15, 2006, 10:35:18 PM »
I am a lazy man who prefers staying at home (as much as possible) than travelling around (especially by driving on my own) and I take very little care of my car (I can't recall when was the last time I wash it). I always describe my car as: "All components are either malfunction or not in the right shape except for those mandatory/must have parts which make my car moves"

The othe day, I send my little poor car for repair because of a major part problem, guess what, the 50 years old (I guess) mechanic throws at me (in bad tone) words like "I can't believe it, your car is in such a sh-t condition, the xxxx is gone, your yyyy is so bad and ..." And this is before he start repairing my car (i.e. he might loss me as a customer and make no money) But I just smile in response to his "father teaches son" style of comment (and I pay as much as he claimed after the car is repaired), the reasons are simple:

1) He is a car mechanic - a good one, I suppose, because he love my car more than my money...
I believe the better a mechanic the more he/she loves to see a car in good shape, though he/she might express his/her techinical love badly!

2) If I get angry with him, dispute with him, I am quite sure at the end he will make no money from me but what is next?
I will have to drive miles further (which I don't think I will want to) to get another mechanic who really understands what is "Customer is always right" . Anyway, I normally will need to pay more to this kind of mechanic for the same service.

I am not saying someone is like the old mechanic nor hinting that he is as old as 50, I just feel his eagerness to get things techinically right is as great as the old mechanic and he expresses it as bad as the old mechanic.
Also, I don't mean to urge the party who argue with him to instead smile to him like what I do to the old mechanic, I only wish to point out that there is no gain in a moody argue.
[link from boingboing]

zridling

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #91 on: October 16, 2006, 01:02:33 AM »
I'm never one to back down from a good fight, but the key to any successful "forum" is the same thing Socrates meant with his dialectic — give and take, back and forth, discovering and uncovering knowledge along the way. Once a forum diverts from a given topic, then it's like trying to right a car sliding wildly out of control on a wet highway — shit flies everywhere and pretty soon the wheels fall off. I actually had one or two people follow me around the web for years accusing me of stuff for what reason I've yet to discern. Ed Bott has spent years on his blog knocking down Windows' myths and he gets new challenges every month!

After a certain age, the passions that fire one's anger lose their hold on your brain and you learn to let things go under the long-held axiom that you absolutely positively cannot change another's mind on most topics, despite whatever facts you each cite. (Look no further than politics and religion.) Trust me, in a few years, it won't make a tit's worth of difference in the scheme of things. As for Shaun Costello, I invite you back, as this thread — as you acknowledged yourself — is atypical of DonationCoder.com. But recognize, Shaun, that this very thread demonstrates the great strength of DonationCoder.com, that we can give and take on any topic without fear.

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #92 on: October 16, 2006, 04:49:52 AM »
I tried very hard to resist replying to mastertech's attacks on my point of view, and instead tried to lighten up the mood of this thread twice, with humor.
This is what you do not understand they are not "points of view" they are factually incorrect statements. A point of view is that you like orange juice better than cranberry juice. How a feature or setting works in Windows is not a "point of view".

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #93 on: October 16, 2006, 04:52:19 AM »
Yeah... I'm actually one of the long-term site members that rose to Mastertech's bait but I escaped Mouser's censure...
There is no "bait". You implications towards me are as wrong as your understanding of Windows. I don't post something to "bait you". I post something to correct what you did not understand and you made factually incorrect statements. You "baited yourself". Don't post something blatantly incorrect and I will not respond to it. But since you just did by claiming I "baited" anybody I must again respond to clear that up.

Mastertech

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #94 on: October 16, 2006, 04:57:52 AM »
I don't see a problem with how mouser has handled the situation and haven't taken any insult. I'm used to deal with much worse trolls like ***** (my own censure there). Personally I would probably have locked the thread, and looking at the track record MasterTech has, would have banned him.
First of all Fodder you still have not supplied ONE SOURCE to back up either of your incorrect claims. Why is that? And why have you now turned this into a personal attack on me? Simply it is the only way you think you can win the argument. I have no track record, except for being accurate about what I state. Of course you want me banned so their is no one to challenge you on things you cannot back up.

I'm going to be 100% honest though and say that I believe MasterTech is a annoying little troll and that I'd kick him in the stomach if I met him face-to-face... and yes mouser, I'll have some chocolate and cola now ;)
Of course you do because I asked you to prove what you can't. It is much easier to call me a troll than to provide proof. But I am not falling for it and never will. I wonder how much other incorrect information you provide here?

NeilS

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #95 on: October 16, 2006, 05:08:48 AM »
Zombie thread.  :o Chop the head off or it'll keep getting back up again.

mouser

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Re: Windows XP Myths
« Reply #96 on: October 16, 2006, 06:45:26 AM »
ok, we're going to lock this thread up now since i think everyone has had their say a few times over :)

I think this is a fitting closing image: