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Last post Author Topic: NANY 2018 Release: cnpaperplay - Codenames /Codenames Duet Play on Paper Clone  (Read 12010 times)

tomos

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I'm still not 100% clear mouser:
if someone has a word list, [1] do they have to give it to you here, or [2] can they also create a PDF themselves using the code you linked to ?

Note I went to the linked github page and dont see anything accessible (well, not to me at any rate).
Tom

mouser

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The repository that I have open sourced, as well as the zip file download in the first link has pre-built english pdfs you can just printout and play with.

The source code repository also includes the python utilities that will let you generate new gamebook pdfs, using the included or your own custom word lists, and will let you translate the words and instructions into other languages (japanese is included).  If you can run python and you are on windows or linux x86 you should be able to use these utilities.

If you do make new translations and/or wordfiles, either merge them or send them to me and I can merge them into the official repository.


Note I went to the linked github page and dont see anything accessible (well, not to me at any rate).
It should be live and fully there.

mouser

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By the way, the easiest way to play with new word lists is probably to create a new "language" subdirectory and then put your wordfile_default.txt in that subdirectory, and invoke from source/ directory like "cnduet.py --language MYSUBDIRNAME".

Although you are only replacing the wordlist and not creating new language translations, this is the easiest and most flexible solution for testing.
Alternatively you can put the wordfile_default.txt in the main data directory and specify it on the commandline with --wordfile argument.

tomos

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Note I went to the linked github page and dont see anything accessible (well, not to me at any rate).

It should be live and fully there.
I'm sure it is --
I was just trying to figure out if this is something easily accessible for me personally as a basic user, or for others like me. So, if your familiar with the cammandline, it's fine.
Tom

mouser

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For those interested in translating, look at the japanese subfolder -- that shows you a fully translated game (words, templates, etc.).  But when you translate you can leave out certain files and they will resort to default english.

Note also that you don't have to strictly translated the word list -- it will simply use whatever words are there.  In that way you could also make alternate themed versions of the game that used subsets of words (like a halloween book that only had scary words, etc.).

mouser

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Updated with new scoring rules, as follows:
"+2 point per target found, +10 per unused turn, -5 per mistake, -10 if sudden death.  Games ended by a black word score differently: -10 points for each unused turn, mistake, and unfound target.  Penalize illegal clues by ticking an extra turn and mistake checkbox."

mouser

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You guys who aren't playing this are missing out -- it's a ton of fun.

thosch

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Great work, thanks!

I am a native German speaker and checked the list provided by tomos.
It's pretty good, but some word are cut off abruptly.
I corrected this / removed some of those, please find the new file attached - it would be nice if you could generate books using this. Otherwise I could try to figure it out myself, but probably would take me awhile.


mouser

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Welcome, thosch! And thank you for the german wordlist

I'm happy to make some german books.
Do you think you might be willing to translate the instruction text as well?

By the way, we have a larger wordlist now.. If you feel like translating the extra words..

tomos

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I am a native German speaker and checked the list provided by tomos.
It's pretty good, but some word are cut off abruptly.
I corrected this / removed some of those, please find the new file attached - it would be nice if you could generate books using this. Otherwise I could try to figure it out myself, but probably would take me awhile.

thank you very much thosch !
Tom

mouser

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I have uploaded a "translator pack" here:
http://www.donationc...y_translatorpack.zip

It has instructions and all the files that need translating to create a full new language version.

I have also added the translator pack files under the documentation/ subdirectory in the github repository.

tomos

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When you've uploaded the german language 'books', I'll try and spread the word here a bit.
Tom

thosch

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Yes, I can do some translations - I will look into it on the weekend!

mouser

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Awesome.
Anyone else? Would be nice to have some chinese, french, italian, arabic, greek, polish, etc., etc!

IainB

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Awesome.
Anyone else? Would be nice to have some chinese, french, italian, arabic, greek, polish, etc., etc!
Well, I was once fluent in Welsh, though a bit rusty now.
And I speak Esperanto like a native.
My wife might be willing to help with Thai, if I asked her nicely.
Ditto for my daughter and Maori.

thosch

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I translated the English word list, combined it with the list from tomos (deleting duplicates), and added and removed some words on my own discretion. Find the list with 729 German words attached.

I am in the process of translating the text on the duet html page.
One rule question: why is there a "mistake track", shouldn't the time track be enough? And why the rule to tick an additonal time box, if no mistake boxes remain? I also own the boardgame and I read the rules as follows: if you pass, turn over a time token. if you guess wrong, put a time token on a word tile.
-> in both cases 1 turn token is spent.

So the only difference between passing and guessing wrong is that you don't run the risk of hitting a black word by passing.
Maybe I am missing something, I haven't played using your booklets yet.

mouser

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One rule question: why is there a "mistake track", shouldn't the time track be enough? And why the rule to tick an additonal time box, if no mistake boxes remain? I also own the boardgame and I read the rules as follows: if you pass, turn over a time token. if you guess wrong, put a time token on a word tile.  -> in both cases 1 turn token is spent.

In the original game, you can play different missions (difficulty levels) that simply tell you how many turns and mistakes you are allowed to make.  The less turns allowed, and the less mistakes allowed, the more challenging the game.

While the scripts can be used to print out books with different numbers of these, players could also simply agree how many turns and mistakes they are allowed for a given game.

But I decided to add something, by introducing a scoring mechanism.  In this way, you are penalized in your score for making more mistakes.
The new score instructions from the intro.html page say:

Scoring: +2 points per target found, +10 per unused turn, -5 per mistake, -10 if sudden death.  Games ended by a black word score differently: -10 points for each unused turn, mistake, and unfound target.  Penalize illegal clues by ticking an extra turn and mistake checkbox.



The scoring is the one way the paper version "differs" from the original box. (That and I obviously removed a lot of explanation in order to get the rules to fit on one page, so players will have to figure out some details).

So turn track and mistake track are important to help you calculate your score. IF you care about score.. For most of us just winning and losing is fine.

Personally I find the paper version significantly more enjoyable and practical, and the scoring adds a fun way to compare your score against other couples and to strive for a high score.

It also lets you compute a score even if you "lose" -- though it will be bad and can easily go negative :)




ps. The python scripts support lots of options for creating games with different numbers of words, turns, allowed mistakes, number of each color, etc.  So if codenames is too easy/hard for you you could experiment with alternative games.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 02:42 PM by mouser »

thosch

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Oh, right I see - I ignored the missions when I first got the game and then forgot about them.

I think this rule
with the restriction that the maximum number of guesses on a given turn are the number specified by the clue giver plus one.
applies only to the team vs. team variant. At least in my German rulebook for Duet it says "as long as your partner guesses successfully, he may continue" and I don't see anything about having to stop after +1 guesses.

mouser

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At least in my German rulebook for Duet it says "as long as your partner guesses successfully, he may continue" and I don't see anything about having to stop after +1 guesses.

This is definitely NOT right, at least in the english rules.  It's such a core mechanic I can't imagine it's not the same in your german rules.
You are always restricted to guessing at most +1 extra word than the cluegiver said.

The only exception to this is at the end of the game in sudden death mode, where you can continue guessing until you make a mistake and there are no more clues allowed.


I just read the english rules again and I was *WRONG*!!! The rules do in fact say you can make unlimited guesses.  You were right.

Yikes! I've been playing it wrong then!!!!  Thanks for enlightening me...
Hmm now I am in a quandry.. I don't like the rule change from Codenames base game.  I prefer it the old way.
I suppose with the new sudden-death end-game rule, it doesn't make that much of a difference if you can guess unlimited words in mid-game or at the end.
Still, I prefer the rule that you can't guess more than 1 beyond the number said by the clue giver.  So I would like to keep the rule in the print and play version.

I think maybe the print and play version needs some extra info on the last page of the book describing the differences between this version and the original; it can mention this rule and the scoring mechanic.



PDF rulebook on line: https://czechgames.c...es-duet-rules-en.pdf
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 07:35 AM by mouser »

thosch

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I translated and attached the Duet pages. German words are generally longer and I added a sentence explaning what the number in the clue means. So I used more space, but the rules still fit on one page for me (A4 paper size).
Please tell me if everything is all right, and if so: can you please generate German booklets?

Re: +1 rule.
Well, maybe you know this saying "A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away."
I think this one rule could be taken away in Duet :-) Also considering the constrained space of the rules manual.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 10:38 AM by thosch »

mouser

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I will download and generate some books.  If it takes up too much space I can always reduce font size.  Standby.

mouser

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Check these out and let me know if they are good to go.
If so I will update official downloads with the german books:
http://www.donationc...lay_books_german.zip


It would be nice to give credit to the translators -- could you write a little translator_readme.txt note for me to include?  Or if you just want to tell me what to include I will be happy to make the file and include it.


thosch

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Hey, sorry for the delay.

It seems you took the old word list (which has errors and less words), can you please find the "wordfile_default_german_sorted.txt" in my post above and generate again?

Translator note attached here


mouser

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Can you try downloading new version and let me know if it looks good:
http://www.donationc...lay_books_german.zip

thosch

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Yes, looks good! Thanks!