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Author Topic: Spam complications  (Read 3621 times)

Hans L

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Spam complications
« on: January 09, 2015, 10:15:08 PM »
Hello:

My new email host has SpamAssassin, but while I asked questions about it (as a new customer), I could get responses only after telling them that I would be glad to let the world know about their policy of ignoring new customers. Their subsequent answers made me understand that they only knew one thing: how to advise their customers to set the SpamAssassin score to a lower number. Of teaching SpamAssassin, they knew nothing. However, they were very willing to help, 24/7 :-). Of a cron job to teach SpamAssassin, they knew not whether THEIR shared server would allow it, and they knew not the correct code to use.

I then considered my own email server, but was talked out of it. So, as I see it, I have two options: threaten my host again, forcing them to respond responsibility, or leave my host for another one. The thing is that this host came highly recommended as a great spam fighter, so I now wonder how to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Would anyone here have any other ideas, or any knowledge about where to find a host who offers teaching of SpamAssassin (or a similar spam-fighting program)?

I am new in this group, and hope that my problem fits in.

Best,

Hans L

skwire

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2015, 10:15:51 PM »
For the record, Hans is a longtime, online friend of mine that I asked to post here with his question.  He's been an active member of the Becky email client mailing list that I've run on YahooGroups for nearly ten years now.  =]  Help him out!

mouser

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2015, 12:14:27 AM »
Welcome to the site, Hans!
I have had struggles with SpamAssassin in the past -- it can be very helpful but confusing.

skwire

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2015, 12:26:58 AM »
Also, for the record, I've run my own email server for over ten years so I use, and I'm plenty familiar with, Spam Assassin and such.  However, what I'm not familiar with is how this sort of thing is handled when email is hosted by a third-party.  And, because I host all my own servers, I'm not up-to-snuff on good, fairly-priced hosting providers.  Hence, my request for Hans to post here when he asked for my help regarding his email issues.  I hope that helps to clear things up a bit.

Curt

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2015, 03:55:29 AM »
@Hans; welcome  :up:

this link just to make sure you know about it: http://wiki.apache.o...ssassin/WritingRules

Stoic Joker

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2015, 09:28:55 AM »
Their subsequent answers made me understand that they only knew one thing: how to advise their customers to set the SpamAssassin score to a lower number

I'm also into self hosting, but this part does sound familiar. Is that a reference to a control UI with 2 sliders on 1 slider control, that allow you to set (working from memory here...) a tag as might be spam and a just delete because it is spam scoring level?

I ran into something like this while working on a client's 3rd party hosted Exchange (cloud) server. The tagged spam goes into the user's junk mail folder (assuming Outlook), and the guaranteed (by slider position) spam is automatically just deleted. With something like this it's usually best to err on the side of caution until critical senders can be white listed, and then slowly tighten the settings until you hit 85%-90% efficiency.

Note: Even with self hosted systems that offer full access and granular control, spam filter settings should never try to hit over 95% efficiency. As the margin for error should always err on the side of caution to avoid disruptions of critical mail flow, and running the risk of driving your mail server admin crazy with 'where did message X go' reports.

wraith808

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2015, 09:40:57 AM »
Would anyone here have any other ideas, or any knowledge about where to find a host who offers teaching of SpamAssassin (or a similar spam-fighting program)?

I use LiquidWeb and always recommend them- I haven't had any spam problems specifically, but they've done a very good job helping and advising on a variety of hosting issues, so you might at least ask.

Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2015, 10:06:50 AM »
Thank you for the welcomes. And thank you Jody/skwire for your introduction of me.

I will continue to read about SpamAssassin. I have a lot of documentation downloaded. Time is the problem (as for all of us, I am sure). I have saved the Writing Rules. And I have taken the percentages to heart (not striving for perfection, which is the bane of the good). As for LiquidWeb, as their prices per day are about the same I now pay per month, I realize that they are well above my needs.

I hope for more tips, and will work on my side here, and report back.

Again, thank you so far!!!

Hans L

wraith808

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2015, 10:21:12 AM »
As for LiquidWeb, as their prices per day are about the same I now pay per month, I realize that they are well above my needs.

If their price per day on the main page is more than you pay per month, then their lowest price would also be above... but just for full disclosure, they do have lower prices.

https://www.liquidwe...website-hosting-plan

Standard Website Hosting is $14.95/month... which is where I started when I first used them.  As my needs progressed, I scaled up to something a lot more... pricey.  But during the whole thing, the service has never changed... it's always been as good and as prompt, even when I was paying $14.95/month.

rgdot

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2015, 01:35:17 PM »
Welcome Hans

side note on spam and hosting
I have seen hosts who disable Sendmail (and phpmail) in favour of SMTP only, such a sad white flag in my opinion


Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2015, 01:41:05 PM »

Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2015, 01:44:41 PM »
As for LiquidWeb, as their prices per day are about the same I now pay per month, I realize that they are well above my needs.

If their price per day on the main page is more than you pay per month, then their lowest price would also be above... but just for full disclosure, they do have lower prices.

https://www.liquidwe...website-hosting-plan

Standard Website Hosting is $14.95/month... which is where I started when I first used them.  As my needs progressed, I scaled up to something a lot more... pricey.  But during the whole thing, the service has never changed... it's always been as good and as prompt, even when I was paying $14.95/month.
I wrote a response to this before, but perhaps i was not logged in.

What I think I said was that I did not look carefully enough at LiquidWeb's prices. I should have.

Oh, then I asked you how LiquidWeb is regarding spam, my main concern right now.

Regards,

Hans L
« Last Edit: January 10, 2015, 01:45:42 PM by Hans L, Reason: Just misspelling. »

wraith808

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2015, 02:37:26 PM »
Oh, then I asked you how LiquidWeb is regarding spam, my main concern right now.

In all honesty, I've never had problems regarding spam, so I'm not sure if I've just been extraordinarily lucky, or their spam mechanisms are that good.  I do know now that I'm the point on several clients that I have hosted, I'd assume that if there was a problem I'd hear about it from at least *one* of them, but I haven't.  They utilize SpamAssassin on cpanel- I can tell you that.  And, as I said, when I've talked to them on any issue- small or large- I've been impressed with their response and knowledge.

I'd suggest if you're interested to talk to them about the problems that you're having before purchasing through their chat- and rate them for yourself.

Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2015, 03:55:11 PM »
Oh, then I asked you how LiquidWeb is regarding spam, my main concern right now.

In all honesty, I've never had problems regarding spam, so I'm not sure if I've just been extraordinarily lucky, or their spam mechanisms are that good.  I do know now that I'm the point on several clients that I have hosted, I'd assume that if there was a problem I'd hear about it from at least *one* of them, but I haven't.  They utilize SpamAssassin on cpanel- I can tell you that.  And, as I said, when I've talked to them on any issue- small or large- I've been impressed with their response and knowledge.

I'd suggest if you're interested to talk to them about the problems that you're having before purchasing through their chat- and rate them for yourself.
Will talk to them.

Hans L

Stoic Joker

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2015, 11:42:08 PM »
I've never had problems regarding spam, so I'm not sure if I've just been extraordinarily lucky, or their spam mechanisms are that good.

Hell, that's easy enough to check ... Just send me you email address and I'll forward our corporate catch-all box to you.. :D

wraith808

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2015, 12:22:24 AM »
I've never had problems regarding spam, so I'm not sure if I've just been extraordinarily lucky, or their spam mechanisms are that good.

Hell, that's easy enough to check ... Just send me you email address and I'll forward our corporate catch-all box to you.. :D

You'll excuse me if I don't take you up on that ;D

Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2015, 04:48:49 PM »
Hello everyone:

My wife came into my office today and said: "I want an email host of my own, where I can get emails without spam on my iPhone and iPad!"

History: After a rather nasty email to my email host the other day, they ignored me, as I had expected. Not that they did not deserve a few honest words, but I am sure they did not think so :-)

Back to the present. Since I could not guarantee a very good spam filter without going to Gmail, but I did not want to upset my wife's four own-domain email boxes in her email client (Becky, the best), my brain suddenly (guess I wanted to survive!!!), but unexpectedly, started to put together all it had digested unconsciously during the last week, and here is what I came up with (tested successfully with one of my emails and my gmail and my iPhone):

-  I created a gmail account and set it for IMAP

-  I created a new mailbox in my email client (Becky; did I say it is the best?), with the IMAP settings for my gmail address

-  I downloaded and installed the gmail app on my iPhone, which meant I needed to do nothing; it set it self up with the gmail settings.

-  Then, for the existing email address of mine that I used to check this whole thing (let's call it XXX@YYY.com; in Becky, my email client)), I set a filter that meant that all messages that arrived in its Inbox were copied to the Inbox of my Gmail mailbox (in Becky).

So, here is the process:

Message to XXX@YYY.com to my email host > SpamAssassin "removes" 80 % of spam > Message to POPFile (my on-computer spam filter app, removing more or less the remaining 20 % of the spams) > Inbox of the XXX@YYY.com mailbox in Becky > copy of message to Gmail Inbox in Becky.

Since Gmail in Becky is IMAP, the message in question (if NOT spam) is now also available on my iPhone.

The only drawback is that (a) messages to XXX@YYY.com that are responded to on the iPhone or (b) new messages sent from the iPhone are not sent to the relevant mailbox in Becky (email client). So, when this is set up for my wife, she will have to look, from time to time, in the Gmail Sent box in Becky and drag sent messages that she want to save to the relevant other mailbox in Becky.

Today is Sunday. Tomorrow, Monday, I will implement this for her four email addresses. On Tuesday, she will work with it. Come Wednesday, my wife will come in to my office and say: "I shouldn't have to drag messages from the Gmail Sent box to my other mailboxes!" Whereupon I will break down and cry.

Regards,

Hans L

Hans L

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Re: Spam complications
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2015, 06:15:57 PM »
I think that I should say that all the mailboxes except the Gmail one are POP.

Regards,

Hans L