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Author Topic: Scoring of recently used items being re-scored after presented in FARR  (Read 2597 times)

Filipe Meira Castro

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Hi,

When I start typing a name of a folder (eg: Mus  - for Music!!)  then many related folders show up, and the one I really want goes to top with over 2000 points!!!

That is really what I want, but the problem is that when I start typing, "Mus" I can see that other items are being populated and re-scored at a latter time, and even the correct Music one is being populated with less than 1000points.

This means that I cannot just type "Mus"+Enter because during those initial seconds it still did not reach those 2000points and the folder I really want is not the first one on the list!! So I have to slow down, wait and read before clicking Enter which is a bit slower and also sometimes I end up triggering other folders/files because in the instant I clicked enter the results have changed.

This might be the way FARR is adding score based on each rule... It would be ok that when FARR would find a higher pointed item on the list to redraw it, but in this situation the item is being presented with lower points than what it will have some seconds after... hopefully there is a way to present the item only when all the rules have scored the item or maybe have a historical table with recently "combined scores"

It would be much faster to just type a few letters and click enter and not end up triggering other items because of laggines of update final score, at the end this was a recently used item that I know it will end up in top position and I just want to quickly relaunch it without having read and wait for it to be on top position to click enter!

Cheers,
Filipe

mouser

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Hmm, this is a bit tricky..  So there are 2 issues here, the first is that the folder is changing score, which isn't per se causing you a problem.  The second is the possibility that the position of the item you are looking for may change during this adjusting of score -- which could very well be a problem.

The only time an item will change score, is if it is "found" in multiple ways -- because the different ways of finding things can trigger different bonuses.

I can't remember if there are other ways this can happen but the one time when this may happen is if an item is in your launch history, it will be scored first.  It will later be found again while doing a directory search, which may result in a different score.

Let me give this a little thought -- it would seem like scoring something initially from the launch history should give it its highest score right away, so that it would never go up in score later on..

In the meantime can you confirm for me that the cause of your item changing score is that it is in the launch history list?

Filipe Meira Castro

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Hi Mouse,

Thank you so much for looking into this.

That folder is in the Launch History with a score of only "100" and then "Heuristic File Bonus" adds 1000 and eventualy it reaches over 2000.
(but not sure if folders work a little diferently in FARR than files...)

Let me give this a little thought -- it would seem like scoring something initially from the launch history should give it its highest score right away, so that it would never go up in score later on..

Yes, for me scoring from the history should always be going on top!! I guess that would do the trick :) Not sure if adding a historical table with recently "combined scores" would help!

Have a great day,
Filipe

Filipe Meira Castro

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I guess that revision of scoring from the history would be really benefitial!!

Most of the files I want to launch were already lauched in the past!!

So during the scoring process is a bit annoying/slow to have files/folders on top that I have never even launched and having to wait for the files that have been launched in the past to head up to top after a while!! :)

Have a great day,
Filipe

mouser

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In the most common cases, items in the launch history should get high scores that put them initially at the top, and they never lose their position.

Your case may be different because you may be giving items a big (decisive) bonus score somewhere later on that i didn't anticipate.  My memory now is that i do try to compute final scores when initially looking at history items -- if so it sounds like i missed something somewhere.. I will try to fix this one way or the other.

If you can definitively nail down where the subsequent higher score is coming from it would help -- it really shouldn't be coming from the heuristic pattern score list, i don't think, as those SHOULD be calculated initially when it's evaluating the item from the launch history -- but then again I may be mistaken.

tomos

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The only time an item will change score, is if it is "found" in multiple ways -- because the different ways of finding things can trigger different bonuses.

I can't remember if there are other ways this can happen but the one time when this may happen is if an item is in your launch history, it will be scored first.  It will later be found again while doing a directory search, which may result in a different score.

maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying above, but the scoring is also related to the letters typed matching the entry in the list - mind you 1000 to 2000 points sounds very high scores compered to what I usually see on this machine (I havent messed around with the default settings much).
Tom

mouser

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Quote
maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying above, but the scoring is also related to the letters typed matching the entry in the list -

Yes -- the issue here is that when an item is in your launch history, it doesn't JUST get a bonus in score from being on that list.  Something else happens to items on the launch history list.

What also happens is that FARR searches that list FIRST, before doing anything else.  That's what allows that list to act like a very fast cache -- so results previously launched are listed immediately.

Then FARR does it's normal search of folders.. at which point an item that was found when initially going through the history list will be found a second time..
What's happening in Filipe's case is that the second time the item is found, it is getting a higher score.  The question is why is it getting a different score the second time it's found.  

In broad terms -- the score is probably different because FARR is adding some bonus the second time around, that is calculated based on where it was found (i.e. while doing a search of a specific directory that has a bonus associated with it).  Now I *thought* I accounted for that already but there must be a scenario I overlooked.

That's why I'm asking if Filepe can figure out where the increase in score might be coming from -- as that would tell me which scoring bonus I neglected to apply when scoring items from the initial pass through the launch history.

tomos

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Thanks for the in-depth mouser :up:
(I had a feeling that what I was pointing out was to be taken for granted.)
Tom

JohnJ

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I have found that weighting interactions can get quite complex so, as I am sure you already know, you can just create a quick alias for common items (e.g., 'mus' in this case) when this problem arises and not worry too much about it.

If a particular similar problem frequently arises a careful examination of your custom weighting rules helps.

mouser

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JohnJ's advice is one all users would do well to follow as a general rule:

If you are launching something frequently, make a custom alias for it!  The result will be that it will be found instantly, and it will block out all other results.

Filipe Meira Castro

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Thank you all for comments and help :)

Current settings, searching "Mus" eventully scores 2724, then I click enter and the folder C:\MyFolder\Media\Music is launched in Windows Explorer!!

An intriguing thing is, If I then call FARR again, even without typing anything, I see that "Music" item is ready alredy on the list on top place but only with score 1000!!!!!!!!! And if I then start type "Mus" for a few instants that FARR redraws and that folder gets 645 points that will reach the 2724 seconds after...

My current settings:

Screenshot - 2014-07-24 , 01_56_38.png

Under search folders:
   Removing "C:\MyFolder\Media" (score 800) --> will get score 639

Under Heuristic Scoring rules:
   Without "Left most Match Bonus (250) --> will get score 2700
   Without "History File Bonus (adds weight to previously launched items) (1000) --> will get score 2724 (Same!!)
   Without "History File Bonus Max Autoceiling (Grouw to this) (510) --> will get score 2724 (Same!!)
   Without "Folder Score as % os file score [<100 ranks files above folder](300) --> will get score 908
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 04:14:39 PM by Filipe Meira Castro »

Filipe Meira Castro

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Hmmm,,

I have deleted all my history items and it seems related to it... it had a low score on the history to start with...

When launching a new item it will be stored in the history and the "Score file Bonus (Adds weight to previously launched items)" will set / increase score.
But If I keep doing the same, that score is not changed....

Is there a way to keep increasing the score every time a result is launched?

Cheers,
Filipe

mouser

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Is there a way to keep increasing the score every time a result is launched?
this happens automatically.  the settings adjust by how much the scores grow each time and to what ceiling.

Filipe Meira Castro

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The final result is not increasing as the item is launched, but when I go to the options and "launch History" I can see that item score is increasing at the rate of 1. I have no idea why this is not going through to the end score and it is also strange because my "History File Bonus" parameter is 50 and I could not see any field that I have 1 as a setting!!

This is much better since I deleted/recreated the history.

Thank you so much for helping :)

mouser

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Does this explain why yours isn't growing:
Screenshot - 7_23_2014 , 7_20_45 PM.png

Is your second number lower than first?

Filipe Meira Castro

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I have 50 and 9000!! that's why this is strange!!!