Messages

1

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: September 13, 2008, 07:01 PM »

Thanks Ehtyar. Appreciate the level headed response.

Someones going to like you... His jaw is... made of metal?

-Armando (September 06, 2008, 10:19 PM)

Did I miss an inside joke?

2

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: September 07, 2008, 10:55 PM »

CWuestefeld,
Thank you for your message. It was not my intention to infuriate anyone but I do appreciate your input. Allow me to try to explain why I chose python:

1] I have to hire someone to start the project and I can't hire a "generic" programmer (or so I'm told)
2] python allows for rapid prototyping and iterative development
3] there is already an existing open source project that I can use as a base & it is in python
4] python goes with open source like pb and jam (or so I'm told)
5] python code is easy to read by a different programmer (or so I'm told)
6] I may get brave enough to want to contribute myself and I can see myself learning python... but not C++ (realistically)
7] I forget #7... let me get back to you

now, allow me to pose a question: is it truly so rare and undignified to propose a language beforehand? I have seen it as the standard procedure on sites like getacoder/rentacoder/odesk, etc.

3

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: September 06, 2008, 08:46 PM »

I do have a program in mind, as I've mentioned and shortly I'll share what it is and ask your feedback on its suitability in more detail.

-Ketracel (August 27, 2008, 10:43 PM)

as promised, the programming language I have in mind is... [drumroll]... python.

Please let loose with praise and/or criticism. Why would this be a good choice? why would it be a bad choice?

thanks!

4

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 29, 2008, 01:08 AM »

jgpaiva, thank you for your comment. I fully agree btw. I'm not a programmer nor am I an expert GUI designer but I have read more than 10 books on usability and GUI design which is more than I can say about programming :-)

The intention behind the question was not that I want to go ape$hit crazy on the GUI design, it was more to flesh out how much I can push the GUI framework. For example, does the "wire framing" that goes around the window have to be there? Is there a way to remove it (I'm assuming full screen mode here)

5

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 27, 2008, 10:43 PM »

Ehtyar,
thank you for the detailed explanation. I think I understand.
This neat little app would then have to be written in XUL, right?
http://www.evolus.vn/Pencil/

And although I'm not a programmer, I have checked things out a bit and have run into wxWidgets. It seems to be the best GUI toolkit - again, don't want to start a debate! lol

I'm curious, would one be able to use wxWidgets and get the sort of GUI that blender has?

http://www.blender.o.../pics/6e6a5d0d36.jpg

http://www.blender.o.../pics/746e247682.jpg

http://www.blender.o.../pics/e637ade87d.jpg

I do have a program in mind, as I've mentioned and shortly I'll share what it is and ask your feedback on its suitability in more detail.

thanks again for your help, it is much appreciated!

6

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 27, 2008, 12:44 AM »

f0dder,
thanks for the explanation, that clears it up. And yes, I hear you re C++. it is the most popular and common language out there (isn't it?).

Ehtyar,
the only part which I really understand is that you are recommending python and perl, but I'm not sure I follow your reasons. Can you "dumb" it down just a bit for a non-programmer?

XUL you say? I'd never heard of it. I'm not sure I understand... is it installed? or online apps? or both? I mean, does the program run inside Firefox? is there an example of an app written in XUL?

thanks!

7

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 25, 2008, 11:40 PM »

f0dder,
re the importance of networking (sending/receiving data constantly), yes! you're absolutely correct. This is vital to the app.

re the argument, well, I've heard it - I'm not convinced because common sense tells me what you mention also. Having said that, without wanting to start a language war or debate, higher languages have an inherent usability which lowel level ones don't have by sacrificing effiency/speed. Most of the time. And if you want to get poetic, some languages are more "pretty" than others. Anyway... :-)

I was talking about Blender (check it out at blender.org), a 3D modeling program written primarily in C and C++ with some python for scripting. I love what they have done with the GUI of that app. I had a similar vision for my own project, before finding Blender.

re VB... I dunno... lol, oh and also, I'd like it to be platform agnostic (Mac/*nix/Win). Can VB do that? :-)

__________________________________________________

mouser,
sure, what would be most helpful? I've got the project fleshed out but I'm not sure which portion of it you'd like me to expound on. In one sentence, the installed desktop program allows a person to trade securities by graphing their chart and giving feedback to the user on what is going on in the market and what they have done relative to it.

Since I'm not a programmer, I'm not sure what complexity it would call for... and therefore, no idea in terms of $$ or time. What I had in mind was to quickly get a rickety version up and running and then to iteratively refine it. I'd like to kick start the project off by hiring a programmer then based on the strength of the offering, organically building a dedicated community of traders/programmers to move it forward.

What makes a certain language more appealing is that there is currently a sort of long-lost "third cousin" already under GPL v2 which I could use as a launching pad. This would mean that, rather than staring from zero code, there would be already an existing project to "fork" in a matter of meaning.

8

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 24, 2008, 08:31 PM »

yeah, I've spent a few minutes playing with it and the only time it recommends other programs over C/C++ is when you tell is that speed is not important

9

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 24, 2008, 07:59 PM »

I found this neat little tool:

http://www.awaretek.com/atesterea.html

I'm not sure if I did it right because I don't know what some of the variables meant.

Here are the variables I gave it:

ease of learning the language 50
ease of using the language.... 85
speed of program execution.. 90
quality of available tools...... 90
popularity of the language.... 70
power and expressiveness......50 <-- what does this mean?
cross-platform availability.... 80
low cost of language tools.....90
ease of client side web scripting.1
ease of server side web scripting.1

The result is

1. C/C++
2. Java
3. Python

10

Developer's Corner / Re: How to choose programming language?

« on: August 24, 2008, 05:05 PM »

Mouser,
Thanks for your message. To be honest I've done a bit of research and have a certain language in mind already... but want to make sure that it is the "correct" one.

To give you a better idea of the project, it is an installed app that would be used to trade stocks and other financial securities. An important part of the app and what sets it apart from others in the same category, would be its user interface. So while being somewhat "heavy" in terms of GUI load, it would also need to be relatively fast. When a user says buy/sell, the response should be instantaneous.

Having said that, I'm a bit reluctant to automatically jump into C++. I know it is the most common language today but I would like this project to be open sourced and think that there may be other languages more appropriate.

As well, I've done enough research to know that other languages, for example, python, can be as fast as C++ (with the right tweaking - psyco). Then there's C - with an incredible open source implementation in blender.org

C++ code can be notoriously difficult to read and understand for anyone other than the original coder. And even the person who wrote the code can get tangled up. Or so I've heard. So I'd prefer a "cleaner and leaner" language for the reason that many eyes will go over the code.

I totally agree with you when you say that the hardest part is finding a good coder. I've cast about here and there for them and either I don't know how to find one... or there are few around in languages that are not the most common (C++/java).

So how does one find and recognize a good coder? I've read a lot and googled much more but am still open to suggestions and feedback, especially from actual coders.

Here is one such article I found:
http://inter-section...se-a-good-programmer

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Developer's Corner / How to choose programming language?

« on: August 23, 2008, 08:28 PM »

I'm not a programmer so I would appreciate your help. I would like to sponsor an open source project for an application (installed as opposed to online) and was wondering how to go about choosing which language to use for it?

How do programmers choose which language to use for a program? is there a "right" answer? what variables does it depend on? I know most know a few languages but are most comfortable with one or two. So before I hire a programmer, I think it would be obviously, helpful to narrow things down in terms of a language.

I have done a lot of work in developing the idea so I would be able to answer questions about it, if you need more info before you can give an answer.

Thank you.