Author Topic: Release: sWeather (tray-based weather app) (Read 755,706 times)

RightPaddock · « **Reply #575 on:** January 05, 2019, 07:30 AM »

Thanks Jody,

Ranger Bob · « **Reply #576 on:** January 06, 2019, 05:52 PM »

I can not receive weather updates today in sWeather. I have checked and Yahoo weather is up with no problems but a Refresh does not bring in the weather, it just has NA in the Tray.

tomos · « **Reply #577 on:** January 06, 2019, 06:28 PM »

Quote from: Ranger Bob on January 06, 2019, 05:52 PM

I can not receive weather updates today in sWeather. I have checked and Yahoo weather is up with no problems but a Refresh does not bring in the weather, it just has NA in the Tray.

see:

Quote from: skwire on January 04, 2019, 08:31 PM

Quote from: RightPaddock on January 04, 2019, 06:41 AM
Quote from: worldwide on January 04, 2019, 06:16 AM
Important EOL Notice: As of Thursday, Jan. 3, 2019, the weather.yahooapis.com and query.yahooapis.com for Yahoo Weather API will be retired.
To continue using our free Yahoo Weather APIs, use https://weather-ydn-yql.media.yahoo.com/forecastrss. Contact yahoo-weather-ydn-api@oath.com for credentials to onboard to this free Yahoo Weather API service.
Should I start looking for a replacement for sWeather ?

I've applied for access to the new API and am waiting to hear back. If approved, and if I can make sWeather work with the new API, no, you won't have to look for a replacement. If I cannot get it working with the new API, yes, you will.

skwire · « **Reply #578 on:** January 07, 2019, 09:59 PM »

No word yet from Yahoo!, but I'm sure they've been inundated with API access requests due to these recent changes. I'll keep you all posted.

dhry · « **Reply #579 on:** January 08, 2019, 11:59 PM »

Just putting this out there, have you considered supporting an alternate weather API such as OpenWeatherMap? I'm not sure if there are any others out there that are free.

Cheers
Dhry

skwire · « **Reply #580 on:** January 09, 2019, 03:38 AM »

Quote from: dhry on January 08, 2019, 11:59 PM

Just putting this out there, have you considered supporting an alternate weather API such as OpenWeatherMap?

I have, and:

1) None of my software reports home or anything like that so I have no real idea of sWeather's install base. However, based on the email feedback I get, it is one of my most popular apps. So, based on that, and based on their verbiage, I will assume the number of API calls the free tier they offer is not nearly enough to support sWeather.

2) Changing the API would require a lot of code refactoring, which I don't have time for. If I did do something like that, I'd probably just write an sWeather 2.0 as time allowed and require each user to get their own API key from OpenWeatherMap to get around the API call limit.

Of course, another option is to pay for API access but most of the ones I've looked at are pretty pricey and the donations I receive for my software wouldn't even begin to cover such an expense. That said, every donation is, of course, appreciated. =]

Personally, I don't use all of the apps I've written, but I did write sWeather for myself, and use it daily, so I'm eager to get it working again. I hope all this helps to explain my perspective on everything.

Drugwash · « **Reply #581 on:** January 09, 2019, 07:51 PM »

Maybe an easier (somehow) approach would be to F(orget) the API, load the corresponding web page and parse it to get the desired values. I do that for an IMDb-related script of mine, instead of F(ool)ing around with the API - that is, begging for their approval.

On a related note, AccuWeather used to provide free widgets for sites and blogs; not anymore, apparently - the free widgets page is now blank and the code (js script) doesn't work. Ain't that a F(reak)ing coincidence…?

skwire · « **Reply #582 on:** January 09, 2019, 08:30 PM »

Quote from: Drugwash on January 09, 2019, 07:51 PM

Maybe an easier (somehow) approach would be to F(orget) the API, load the corresponding web page and parse it to get the desired values. I do that for an IMDb-related script of mine, instead of F(ool)ing around with the API - that is, begging for their approval.

If it were for just a personal script, I would entertain doing that. However, for a released app, I'll pass. =]

Drugwash · « **Reply #583 on:** January 09, 2019, 08:45 PM »

Yeah well, look what you said above: "Personally, I don't use all of the apps I've written, but I did write sWeather for myself, and use it daily, so I'm eager to get it working again."

It is personal, in the first place, and I believe if you make it work again - by any means - then you can share it with the rest of the world just as it comes out. It may be imperfect, it may require frequent updates if/when webpage layout/ids/etc change, but as long as you keep it updated for yourself it wouldn't be hard to publish the new versions online.

What I'm saying is, if one were to choose between having something or not having anything, probably the something would prevail. I'm getting old and I could surely use this script/app to tell me when I should or should not go out. I don't care if it takes 50 or 100 RegExMatch() statements to do its job, as long as it does its job.

wraith808 · « **Reply #584 on:** January 09, 2019, 11:54 PM »

Quote from: Drugwash on January 09, 2019, 08:45 PM

I don't care if it takes 50 or 100 RegExMatch() statements to do its job, as long as it does its job.

You'll care when something breaks and you have to figure out what that might be

dhry · « **Reply #585 on:** January 10, 2019, 12:51 AM »

Quote from: skwire on January 09, 2019, 03:38 AM

1) None of my software reports home or anything like that so I have no real idea of sWeather's install base. However, based on the email feedback I get, it is one of my most popular apps. So, based on that, and based on their verbiage, I will assume the number of API calls the free tier they offer is not nearly enough to support sWeather.
2) Changing the API would require a lot of code refactoring, which I don't have time for. If I did do something like that, I'd probably just write an sWeather 2.0 as time allowed and require each user to get their own API key from OpenWeatherMap to get around the API call limit.
Of course, another option is to pay for API access but most of the ones I've looked at are pretty pricey and the donations I receive for my software wouldn't even begin to cover such an expense. That said, every donation is, of course, appreciated. =]
Personally, I don't use all of the apps I've written, but I did write sWeather for myself, and use it daily, so I'm eager to get it working again. I hope all this helps to explain my perspective on everything.

It certainly does, and no worries at all. Thank you for creating the program, I had been looking for something when WeatherWatcher went pay-only and your program fit the bill perfectly. Here's hoping it all pans out with Yahoo's API access. Until then I always have my phone app.

Dhry

Drugwash · « **Reply #586 on:** January 10, 2019, 08:07 AM »

Quote from: wraith808 on January 09, 2019, 11:54 PM

You'll care when something breaks and you have to figure out what that might be

That's what detailed comments in the code are for.

Besides, debugging can be fun and I could surely help with that, if needed.

I see the old Firefox/Pale Moon extension I mentioned somewhere above still works with AccuWeather so maybe we could get some inspiration from its code.

wraith808 · « **Reply #587 on:** January 10, 2019, 08:54 PM »

Quote from: Drugwash on January 10, 2019, 08:07 AM

Quote from: wraith808 on January 09, 2019, 11:54 PM
You'll care when something breaks and you have to figure out what that might be
That's what detailed comments in the code are for. Besides, debugging can be fun and I could surely help with that, if needed.
I see the old Firefox/Pale Moon extension I mentioned somewhere above still works with AccuWeather so maybe we could get some inspiration from its code.

Detailed comments are not always helpful in retrospect with legacy code. I know that from experience. I think a combination of good coding practices and comments are optimal- and even that doesn't always work! But, it's up to the maintainer to decide if that shortcut was useful in the long run!

skwire · « **Reply #588 on:** January 10, 2019, 09:13 PM »

Regarding scraping webpages, no, I will not do that within a publically released application. That way madness lies. I have neither the time, nor desire, to scrape pages and try to handle minor changes and/or differences in world regions, etc, etc. It'll be an official API from some site or nothing.

RightPaddock · « **Reply #589 on:** January 11, 2019, 03:27 AM »

Quote from: dhry on January 10, 2019, 12:51 AM

Until then I always have my phone app.

and by tapping the Windows key the MS weather app in Start.

Quote from: skwire on January 10, 2019, 09:13 PM

Regarding scraping webpages, no, I will not do that . . . That way madness lies.

Precisely. . . I use one intensively. Since the beginning of 2012, that's ~2600 days, there have 7000+ posts in its support thread. It does scrape multiple mono-lingual sites. There have been over 400 releases in 7 years and that doesn't include beta test versions - that's more than one a week!

RP

dhry · « **Reply #590 on:** January 11, 2019, 04:10 AM »

Quote from: RightPaddock on January 11, 2019, 03:27 AM

Quote from: dhry on January 10, 2019, 12:51 AM
Until then I always have my phone app.
and by tapping the Windows key the MS weather app in Start.

Don't believe I have that. Win 7 here.

Dhry

Drugwash · « **Reply #591 on:** January 11, 2019, 01:23 PM »

Looking here one realizes that whatever is still "free" in this world will not be so for much longer.
No idea if OpenWeatherMap provides what's needed for a direct replacement in current script, but there's nothing else in that list that could fit the bill, so I guess it's either that or nothing - because those yahoos at Yahoo, at this point, stand for nothing as far as I'm concerned.

TechTeacher · « **Reply #592 on:** January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM »

I would like to say thank you for all your work over the years. This must have started as a passion project for you and turned into what it is now.

The problem is "free". It's been that way so long that people "expect it". I've been having this same discussion in UseNet groups about posting and expectations. Specifically, saying thank you.

When something is "free" for so long, it becomes a question of expectation of entitlement. Well that's not the case. The amount of time you have put in, and now the people bitching must make you feel that you have a chain and weight around your neck. I've been there on similar projects.

I've contribute to "free" projects when I can (limited funds), and I you CHOOSE to continue, then I'll do the same. I hope that you do, but remember, you have no obligation to do so. All that I ask is if you do kill it, post the fact so we might know.

In the meantime, THANK YOU, for all your efforts.

Techteacher

theinfinitypoint · « **Reply #593 on:** January 12, 2019, 09:23 AM »

Noticed the N/A in my sWeather tray and saw you are working on the solution. Just wanted to speak up and thank you for keeping your awesome little program going!

skwire · « **Reply #594 on:** January 12, 2019, 11:13 PM »

Quote from: Drugwash on January 11, 2019, 01:23 PM

Looking here one realizes that whatever is still "free" in this world will not be so for much longer.

*shrug* See my explanation below.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 11, 2019, 01:23 PM

No idea if OpenWeatherMap provides what's needed for a direct replacement in current script, but there's nothing else in that list that could fit the bill, so I guess it's either that or nothing -

Again, though, since I don't track anything like that, I have no accurate idea how many API calls sWeather's install base uses. However, I'm pretty positive the OpenWeatherMap free tier does not allow for the total amount of API calls that sWeather's install base would use. Call it an educated hunch. Regarding paying for API acces, for some of my apps I've released I do, in fact, pay out of my pocket for API access provided the fee is reasonable. OpenWeatherMap's first paid tier is $40 per month. While I'm happy to pay, say, ~$50/year for API access, I think $40 per month is a bit much to ask for an application I don't charge for.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 11, 2019, 01:23 PM

because those yahoos at Yahoo, at this point, stand for nothing as far as I'm concerned.

So, this is where I differ from a lot of folks. While I enjoy free APIs, I certainly don't expect companies to offer them. Furthermore, if a company does offer them, and even if I use them for years, I don't get upset if a company discontinues them. I just shrug and see if there is another option. If there is not, I just shrug again and be thankful for the time it was freely available. IMO, life is way too short to get all worked up over stuff like this.

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM

I would like to say thank you for all your work over the years. This must have started as a passion project for you and turned into what it is now.

Thank you, TechTeacher, you are very welcome. I get an immense amount of enjoyment and satisfaction writing and releasing freeware and interacting with users.

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM

The problem is "free". It's been that way so long that people "expect it". I've been having this same discussion in UseNet groups about posting and expectations.

Yep, as I mentioned above, I am not the expectant or entitled type. If it's free and suits the purpose, I'll use it. If it goes away, I just shrug and move on. No big deal to me.

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM

When something is "free" for so long, it becomes a question of expectation of entitlement. Well that's not the case. The amount of time you have put in, and now the people bitching must make you feel that you have a chain and weight around your neck. I've been there on similar projects.

I'm a really laid back guy so I never feel like it's a ball and chain but, yes, I do feel an obligation to make a good faith effort to fix bugs, fulfill feature requests, and do my general best to keep things working. That said, since I choose to release my software as freeware, I never feel that I MUST do these things. One gets what one pays for, eh? I do have a full-time job that involves quite a bit of business travel, so I work on my freeware as time permits. Conversely, this means I can also ignore things as I see fit and not feel too badly about it. Hahahaha.

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM

I've contribute to "free" projects when I can (limited funds), and I you CHOOSE to continue, then I'll do the same. I hope that you do, but remember, you have no obligation to do so. All that I ask is if you do kill it, post the fact so we might know.

Oh, I haven't given up hope just yet. I was looking at the "new" API and it is very similar to the original API that sWeather used when I first released it. The original one was based on RSS feeds (without OAuth) before Yahoo! switched up to their YQL (Yahoo! Query Language) API and now it's back to RSS feeds (with OAuth, this time). Hopefully, I hear something back this week so I can start working on things. I don't travel this week, so I should have time once I get API access.

Quote from: theinfinitypoint on January 12, 2019, 09:23 AM

Noticed the N/A in my sWeather tray and saw you are working on the solution. Just wanted to speak up and thank you for keeping your awesome little program going!

Thanks, theinfinitypoint, I appreciate your kind words.

Mal · « **Reply #595 on:** January 13, 2019, 12:46 AM »

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 11, 2019, 08:01 PM

I would like to say thank you for all your work over the years. This must have started as a passion project for you and turned into what it is now.

The problem is "free". It's been that way so long that people "expect it". I've been having this same discussion in UseNet groups about posting and expectations. Specifically, saying thank you.

When something is "free" for so long, it becomes a question of expectation of entitlement. Well that's not the case. The amount of time you have put in, and now the people bitching must make you feel that you have a chain and weight around your neck. I've been there on similar projects.

I've contribute to "free" projects when I can (limited funds), and I you CHOOSE to continue, then I'll do the same. I hope that you do, but remember, you have no obligation to do so. All that I ask is if you do kill it, post the fact so we might know.

In the meantime, THANK YOU, for all your efforts.

Techteacher

Ditto from me. You said it so eloquently. I have nothing to add except for a personal THANK YOU for sharing your wonderful work with others for free. Keep up your great work and please keep me informed of your updates. All the best. Mal

Drugwash · « **Reply #596 on:** January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM »

Please forgive me, Jody, my philosophy of life is very wrong: I think everything should be free. I'm too idealistic and naive. That's why it always gets to me when I see change for the sake of change, planned obsolescence and so on. I like stability, consistency, continuity, compatibility - completely opposite to this century's trend.

Another bad side of mine is that I'm always grateful by default for everything that's offered for free but I rarely express it, considering it implied, which is - unfortunately - not always the case. And pointing out bugs or asking for features doesn't help at all, although all that is just out of this darn innate perfectionism - the desire to see a good thing better, to help its creator, not to do myself a favor.

So thank you Jody for everything you've done and still doing for us all, for free. And hopefully you'll find a way to get this script working again, firstly for yourself. Good luck!

TechTeacher · « **Reply #597 on:** January 15, 2019, 10:26 PM »

Your philosophy of, "I think everything should be free." fits in with the values originally expressed by Homebrew Computer Club. This of course has been revised to, "How much can we make". Of course there are still few exceptions in the tech arena, Linus Torvalds immediately comes to mind with Linux. But even that has become commoditization by the market. But creators are entitled to compensation for their efforts (should they choose to be) and have the right to change their minds at any point.

Look up Richard Stallman and the concept of Copyleft!

This is not an attack on you and please don't take it that way. I, also have that baked into a certain point. But for me, it's the media industry. My issues stem from not being able to record broadcasts on "public airwaves" at the highest resolution. And having to "buy" the same movie over and over again as the format media changes. This directly addresses you statement below.

"That's why it always gets to me when I see change for the sake of change, planned obsolescence and so on. I like stability, consistency, continuity, compatibility - completely opposite to this century's trend."

And I agree with your above statement 100%. You may use Apple as a text book example.

I had my Samsung Windows i700 phone from the day it was released till the day they killed the analogue band. I'm still running windows 7 on most of my systems, because IMO everything that came after was POS (And I ain't talk'in point of sale!) Hell, I still have a modem connected to my laptop for when the power goes off with a Virtual Windows For Workgroups and the original version of Mozilla installed on it with Trumpet Winsock!

I'm sorry for "monologuing", and going off topic, but I suddenly needed to vent.

As to the original topic. If sWeather is dead, then so be it. It was a wonderful little program that earned my respect and gratitude. To quote Twain, "The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated."

I can hope!

wraith808 · « **Reply #598 on:** January 16, 2019, 03:05 AM »

I think that 'free' is often misinterpreted, especially on the side of the receiver. 'Free' is never free, the costs are either absorbed by someone else, or are in a form that you don't immediately realize. People thought that Facebook was free. They were wrong. They were buying the ability to use Facebook with their privacy. In the same way, skwire offers these programs for free, but he absorbs the cost, whether he does it because he wants to or not, it takes his time and resources.

I think if more people thought about things in that way, they might be more appreciative (and in some cases skeptical) of the people that provide free things.

skwire · « **Reply #599 on:** January 16, 2019, 05:51 AM »

Quote from: Drugwash on January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM

Please forgive me, Jody, my philosophy of life is very wrong: I think everything should be free. I'm too idealistic and naive.

Brother, there is no need for an apology. I don't think your philosophy of life is, as you put it, wrong. Given the world we live in, I don't think it's very realistic, but it's not wrong.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM

Another bad side of mine is that I'm always grateful by default for everything that's offered for free but I rarely express it, considering it implied, which is - unfortunately - not always the case.

Please don't worry about it. As mouser knows, I am not the type of person that writes software for any type of accolades. I was brought up with the saying, "If a friend asks for help, you help them." The satisfaction I get from being able to share what I'm capable of is enough for me. In fact, it makes me quite uncomfortable to toot my own horn or to directly solicit donations. That said, every donation makes me feel utterly humbled that somebody would part with their own money for something I've offered for free.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM

And pointing out bugs or asking for features doesn't help at all,

Quite the opposite, actually. Without bug reports and feature requests, my applications would not be what they are.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM

although all that is just out of this darn innate perfectionism - the desire to see a good thing better, to help its creator, not to do myself a favor.

And that's how I take them. I like fixing things and making them better, so please keep on reporting bugs and requesting features. I'll do my best to get to them...or tell you no. Hahaha.

Quote from: Drugwash on January 13, 2019, 07:49 AM

So thank you Jody for everything you've done and still doing for us all, for free. And hopefully you'll find a way to get this script working again, firstly for yourself. Good luck!

You are most welcome. And, yes, I hope like hell I hear back from Yahoo! and get sWeather working again. It's one of my favourite apps and I, myself, use it daily.

Quote from: TechTeacher on January 15, 2019, 10:26 PM

As to the original topic. If sWeather is dead, then so be it.

It's not dead until I say so...and I haven't said so.

Quote from: wraith808 on January 16, 2019, 03:05 AM

I think that 'free' is often misinterpreted, especially on the side of the receiver. 'Free' is never free, the costs are either absorbed by someone else, or are in a form that you don't immediately realize. People thought that Facebook was free. They were wrong. They were buying the ability to use Facebook with their privacy. In the same way, skwire offers these programs for free, but he absorbs the cost, whether he does it because he wants to or not, it takes his time and resources.

Beautifully put, wraith808. Yes, programming does cost me time, resources, and more grey hair. However, I accept that fully and cheerfully, otherwise I wouldn't do it.

Quote from: wraith808 on January 16, 2019, 03:05 AM

I think if more people thought about things in that way, they might be more appreciative (and in some cases skeptical) of the people that provide free things.

It's all good. All good.

FWIW, I offer my programs as freeware for the following reasons:

I thoroughly enjoy programming. It's a great feeling to be able to create something useful for myself and others.
It's my way of giving back to the internet, at large, for all the other freeware I've used myself over the years.
IMHO, I have a knack for taking somebody's idea for a piece of software and making it into something tangible for them. This is the whole idea behind our Coding Snacks forum and I one-hundred percent love doing this for people.
As I mentioned before, offering my software as freeware means that, though I try to do so, I am not obligated to provide any type of support, bug fixes, feature requests, etc. I have a family, a full-time job, and plenty of other hobbies that (mostly, haha ) come first.