RFID Tracking IDs in Schools - Non-compliance = Exclusion

[Renegade]

Big Brother wants to know where your kids are. And if he doesn't know, well, then they just won't get to play.

http://rt.com/usa/news/texas-school-id-hernandez-033/

A school district in Texas came under fire earlier this year when it announced that it would require students to wear microchip-embedded ID cards at all times. Now students who refuse to be monitored say they are feeling the repercussions.

Since October 1, students at John Jay High School and Anson Jones Middle School in San Antonia, Texas have been asked to attend class clasping onto photo ID cards equipped with radio-frequency identification chips to keep track of each and every pupil’s personal location. Educators insist that the endeavor is being rolled out in Texas to relax the rampant truancy rates devastating the state’s school and the subsequent funding they are failing to receive as a result, and pending the program’s success the RFID chips could soon come to 112 schools in all and affect nearly 100,000 students.

...

To Salon, Hernandez says subjecting herself to constant monitoring by way of wearing a RFID chip is comparable to clothing herself in the “mark of the beast.” When she reached out to WND.com to reveal the school’s response, though, she told them that she was threatened with exclusion from picking a homecoming king and queen for not adhering to the rules.

"I had a teacher tell me I would not be allowed to vote because I did not have the proper voter ID," Hernandez told WND. "I had my old student ID card which they originally told us would be good for the entire four years we were in school. He said I needed the new ID with the chip in order to vote."

Mark of the Beast indeed. Big Brother = 666?

Well, maybe not "Big Brother"...



But definitely "Bigg Brother":





(For those that want to play with numerology, the program above is here, but the site is NSFW.)

[Carol Haynes]

Local school here requires finger prints to use the lunch service (and they take both thumbs - just in case you lose one!).

Don't know about anyone else but if I lost a thumb I don't think my first thought would be 'how do I get my school lunch?' !!!

[TaoPhoenix]

Local school here requires finger prints to use the lunch service (and they take both thumbs - just in case you lose one!).

Don't know about anyone else but if I lost a thumb I don't think my first thought would be 'how do I get my school lunch?' !!!

See, these guys have forgotten what Bullies are. In twelve seconds I see Bully taking a kid's hands and slamming them on a stove, thus ruining his fingerprints forever. Bully gets "suspended". Kid gets in trouble with Authorities for the rest of his life.

[Renegade]

Local school here requires finger prints to use the lunch service (and they take both thumbs - just in case you lose one!).

Lunch?

Well, considering how "pizza" and "ketchup" are vegetables in some schools now, I have a hard time seeing any compelling reason to let your kids eat a school lunch. Brown bagging it gets around that problem, and is bound to be healthier for the kid.

[Carol Haynes]

Actually the lunches are good and reasonably healthy in UK schools these days after a protracted TV series pointed out how dreadful they were. Certainly the local school has good veg, salad and fruit based lunches with very limited access to junk food. Having said that finger printing an entire school - including staff ... what next - branding barcodes?

[40hz]

Local school here requires finger prints to use the lunch service (and they take both thumbs - just in case you lose one!).

Lunch?

Well, considering how "pizza" and "ketchup" are vegetables in some schools now, I have a hard time seeing any compelling reason to let your kids eat a school lunch. Brown bagging it gets around that problem, and is bound to be healthier for the kid.

Unless you had the infamous "Catholic School Brown Bag Lunch" I got almost every day when I went to school. The 'school nurse' sent out a letter before the start of each school year with a "nutritious" lunch recommendation on it - and my mother wasn't one to dispute what the school nurse suggested. She and most of the other mothers appreciated how it was the exact same letter that got sent every year. That made it one less thing to worry about or fuss over once school started as far as our moms were concerned.

The Catholic School Lunch consisted of a some sort of cold cut (protein!), served on insipid corporate white "bread" (a good starch!) with a dab of yellow mustard or mayo (to prevent choking!) and a leaf or two of lettuce (for vegetables!) - neatly sliced in half (not diagonally!) and wrapped in wax paper.

This "luscious" sandwich went into a #2 brown paper bag along with an apple. (Keeps the doctor away dontcha' know?) Your name and grade written on the front completed the package and facilitated identifying your lunch later on in the day. (Lunches got put in the cubby above your coat. Food was never to be placed inside a school desk at my school.)

Beverage was supplied by the school and consisted of a half pint wax carton of whole milk donated to the school by a parishioner who owned a local dairy. The only break in this weekday routine was on Friday when you'd get PB/PBJ or tuna/egg salad - because "good" Catholics didn't eat meat on Fridays back then. (Note: none of this food was ever stored in a refrigerated place. My school wasn't air conditioned. Heck...we didn't even have fans in our classrooms. So...this is a healthy lunch right?)

[attach]

[Stoic Joker]

Thankfully I have no memories that vivid from my childhood...as I've successfully managed to block all of them. To the best of my current - which I strive to keep on a sliding scale - recollection I was indeed born somewhere between the approximate age of 35...and yesterday.

[cranioscopical]

it could be wrapped in a piece of paper and jammed deeply in a uniform pants pocket

Is that a sandwich in your pocket or are you just pleased to see Sister?

[40hz]

it could be wrapped in a piece of paper and jammed deeply in a uniform pants pocket

Is that a sandwich in your pocket or are you just pleased to see Sister?

Better to have a pickle in your pocket than walk around all day with a chip in your shoulder I guess.

[40hz]

Thankfully I have no memories that vivid from my childhood...as I've successfully managed to block all of them. To the best of my current - which I strive to keep on a sliding scale - recollection I was indeed born somewhere between the approximate age of 35...and yesterday.

Lucky you. I can mentally replay my entire life in sharp detail - and with a high degree of factual accuracy. (Talk about useless reams of data! Who in their right mind would ever waste memory space mentally storing the seating charts and menus of every holiday dinner, party, or social function they ever attended?)

Oh well, at least if my life ever flashes before my eyes it'll be feature length and possibly give me a few more minutes of breathing than most people probably get.

[Stoic Joker]

it could be wrapped in a piece of paper and jammed deeply in a uniform pants pocket

Is that a sandwich in your pocket or are you just pleased to see Sister?

Hay now... lets not be getting me started on the Penguin Fetish stuff ... I'm still at work and can't be looking up Nun pics...

[40hz]

^Look at Linux pr0n then.

[Stoic Joker]

^Look at Linux pr0n then.

Um... [googled it]



(Zoiks!) ...Think I'll stick to doing it my way.

[superboyac]

Oh well, at least if my life ever flashes before my eyes it'll be feature length and possibly give me a few more minutes of breathing than most people probably get.

[Carol Haynes]

Sorry I didn't mean for this thread to be totally hijacked into discussing school lunches and Linux prOn !!!

The 'thrust' of my post was about fingerprinting entire schools (in response to the original post). Personally I would rather carry a chipped ID card in school than have to submit to finger printing - what's next DNA tests? And what real safeguards can a school from government and law enforcement to stop all this data ending up in a national database (which has been discussed by politicians in the UK for decades).

[Stoic Joker]

And what real safeguards can a school from government and law enforcement to stop all this data ending up in a national database (which has been discussed by politicians in the UK for decades).

I think that's the point, they're not trying to stop it ... They're (the front line of the (for the children) first wave) trying to ease us into it. People will revolt (well they're supposed to anyway), children OTOH are taught to follow instruction from authority figures. So once you've been "registered" at school... It's already to late.

[Renegade]

I think that's the point, they're not trying to stop it ... They're (the front line of the (for the children) first wave) trying to ease us into it. People will revolt (well they're supposed to anyway), children OTOH are taught to follow instruction from authority figures. So once you've been "registered" at school... It's already to late.

+1

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

It is impossible to look into the state of education now without being completely horrified. If you're not utterly horrified, you're either not looking or would love living in an Orwellian state.

Once they force it on kids -- they'll force it on adults. It's only a matter of time.

[40hz]

^The US operant conditioning...oh...sorry...public education system has already had significant "success" as many employers are now learning when dealing with their next-gen hires.  

[Stoic Joker]

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

This is probably more a question for 40hz, but you said it. (Um...) If the object is to get people to dislike/distrust/avoid/turn on people that resist their tracking mechanisms ... Wouldn't that be avoidance conditioning?

[Renegade]

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

This is probably more a question for 40hz, but you said it. (Um...) If the object is to get people to dislike/distrust/avoid/turn on people that resist their tracking mechanisms ... Wouldn't that be avoidance conditioning?

I love horseshoes and hand grenades.

http://psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Avoidance_conditioning

[Stoic Joker]

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

This is probably more a question for 40hz, but you said it. (Um...) If the object is to get people to dislike/distrust/avoid/turn on people that resist their tracking mechanisms ... Wouldn't that be avoidance conditioning?

I love horseshoes and hand grenades.

http://psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Avoidance_conditioning

Hm... So one is a subsection of the other ... Lovely.

[40hz]

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

This is probably more a question for 40hz, but you said it. (Um...) If the object is to get people to dislike/distrust/avoid/turn on people that resist their tracking mechanisms ... Wouldn't that be avoidance conditioning?

You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to...

I'm no expert by any stretch. (I'd have to get my GF in on this for that.)

Here's wiki's definition which matches what sketchy understanding I have from my college days (when Skinner was in vogue bigtime btw):

Operant conditioning (or instrumental conditioning) is a form of learning in which an individual's behavior is modified by its consequences; the behavior may change in form, frequency, or strength.

Operant conditioning is a term that was coined by B.F Skinner in 1937[1] Operant conditioning is distinguished from classical conditioning (or respondent conditioning) in that operant conditioning deals with the modification of "voluntary behavior" or operant behavior.

Operant behavior operates on the environment and is maintained by its consequences, while classical conditioning deals with the conditioning of reflexive (reflex) behaviors which are elicited by antecedent conditions. Behaviors conditioned via a classical conditioning procedure are not maintained by consequences.[2]

I also was thinking that, as opposed to being encouraged to turn on people who didn't cooperate, they were more being conditioned to accept that old lie the polygraph voodoo priests use in their sales pitch. That's the line that goes something like: "An honest person is always willing to prove their honesty and integrity. And that's because the only people who have reason to be afraid of polygraph tests are the liars. "

Sorta stands the old constitutional notion of "considered innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt" on its head.

In this case the kids are being conditioned to accept monitoring as normal and necessary - which in turn is maintained by the separate consequences of accepting (you get) and refusing (you don't get) to do so.

FWIW outside of pure "positive reinforcement" I think some avoidance conditioning is routinely incorporated into most forms of behavioral modification. Almost all the conditioning techniques I've seen use both the carrot and the stick. That's a very powerful double reinforcement in that you get the inducement to avoid pain coupled with the incentive to gain pleasure.

Works really well too since many people can only be hurt or punished up to a point before they really dig their heels in. But if you do the good cop/bad cop approach - you can usually find a precise pain/pleasure tipping point for most people. (And for those few whom you can't...well...you can always just have them taken out and shot. Voila! Problem solved!)

Sad that it's now become an almost perfect science isn't it?  

[40hz]

And worse, kids are taught that tracking people is "ok" and that people that don't want to be tracked are "difficult" or "bad". *cough* operant conditioning *cough*

This is probably more a question for 40hz, but you said it. (Um...) If the object is to get people to dislike/distrust/avoid/turn on people that resist their tracking mechanisms ... Wouldn't that be avoidance conditioning?

I love horseshoes and hand grenades.

http://psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Avoidance_conditioning

Hm... So one is a subsection of the other ... Lovely.

I prefer hand grenades and nukes myself.