Even Paul Allen is a little confused by Windows 8, but it gets better

[zridling]

[attach]

[40hz]

how it will eventually get better within a year as apps catch up.

I suddenly feel as if I have been transported back to 1988! It's that same old Microsoft refrain.

Besides, any idea anybody had that was worth anything was invariably first "thunk up" by Apple, right?

[tomos]

[Allen]: Strangely, there is no way to set the desktop as your default view (there should be).

that one is hard to understand.

What happened in 1988 40? (I only started using computers myself 1999)

[ewemoa]

A guess...

From History of computers during 1980 to 1990:

Apple files a copyright infringement against Microsoft for Windows 2.03 and Hewlett Packard for New Wave in comparison with their Macintosh operating system.

[zridling]

We should have a contest for some prize here on DC on how long it will take Microsoft to "fix" the UI in Win8 to revert back to [desktop] normal.
I give them one SP and seven months tops.

[Stoic Joker]

We should have a contest for some prize here on DC on how long it will take Microsoft to "fix" the UI in Win8 to revert back to [desktop] normal.
I give them one SP and seven months tops.

Okay, I don't think they ever will. I think people will bitch, scream, rant, rave, whine, cry, and then just figure it out. Yes those of us in the die hard old guard desktop crowd will have the hardest time with it. But (unfortunately...) the masses don't suffer our need for full access to everything. They just want to get/see/check X and go on...and that sort of (at-a-glance) consumption computing is quite easy with the new UI.

[Josh]

We should have a contest for some prize here on DC on how long it will take Microsoft to "fix" the UI in Win8 to revert back to [desktop] normal.
I give them one SP and seven months tops.

Okay, I don't think they ever will. I think people will bitch, scream, rant, rave, whine, cry, and then just figure it out. Yes those of us in the die hard old guard desktop crowd will have the hardest time with it. But (unfortunately...) the masses don't suffer our need for full access to everything. They just want to get/see/check X and go on...and that sort of (at-a-glance) consumption computing is quite easy with the new UI.

Having used Windows 8 for over a month now, I can say that it is quite easy to get back to the desktop. The start screen appears at login, and I click desktop. In the event that this bothered me, I could easily create a shortcut to "show desktop" in the startup folder and bam, problem solved.

I fail to see what the controversy is here. We've seen the same thing with every OS since XP. XP was criticzed for a "fisher price look". Vista was criticized for UAC. 7 was criticized as what "vista should have been". 8 is now criticized with another major UI change similar to XP. It seems par for the course. You are never going to make everyone happy.

I, for one, am loving Windows 8.

[Stoic Joker]

I fail to see what the controversy is here. We've seen the same thing with every OS since XP. XP was criticzed for a "fisher price look". Vista was criticized for UAC. 7 was criticized as what "vista should have been". 8 is now criticized with another major UI change similar to XP. It seems par for the course. You are never going to make everyone happy.

I haven't switch to it full time on a primary machine yet, but I'm having a blast with it on my laptop.

[40hz]

[Allen]: Strangely, there is no way to set the desktop as your default view (there should be).

that one is hard to understand.

What happened in 1988 40? (I only started using computers myself 1999)

It's the "sure it's not much yet  - but a year from now once the programs catch up - it will be great" speech. Microsoft has had a habit of releasing too early and then telling its customers they need to "give it time." (IIRC former IBMer Mike Maples took over as head of the Applications Division at MS in 88. They then split that division into something like four or five new divisions, each with its own mission statement - and then started that "making it all make sense" campaign,)

Usually Microsoft manages to get things right (mostly) by either version or service pack #3. So it's not without reason that the rule of thumb for most major corporate deployments is to "wait for the first service pack" before committing to a major Microsoft version change.

So far this strategy has worked out quite well for Microsoft's bottom line.

[40hz]

I, for one, am loving Windows 8.

I haven't switch to it full time on a primary machine yet, but I'm having a blast with it on my laptop.

I guess 40hz be but dumb. "Having a blast" and "loving" it aside, exactly what does it actually bring to the table that wasn't there before? Seriously! What am I missing? It's an operating system...not the newest installment of a video game.

Somebody help me out here.

[mahesh2k]

It's another age of UI  in my opinion. We have to get used to new UI from various OS makers. Typical taskbar, menu used to be productive way back but now there are some new UI changes which are hard to adopt but does make you more productive on tablet or similar other modern hardwares. There's nothing we can do other than adapting to this change. I wonder if stardock and similar companies going to cash in on these changes for the folks who don't like such changes or don't want such UI.

[Stoic Joker]

It's an operating system...not the newest installment of a video game

What you mean OS not a video game?? It best game of all! Users at work love to play it...and when they lose, they come to me to put their data back (because evil Trojan man "stole it"). Then they start new game. 


But seriously, the laptop in question sits by my chair in the living room so it's handy for any quick mentioned on TV lookups (e.g. when I'm most likely to be in brain dead end luser mode). And for the quick in-and-out stuff the new UI works just fine. I actually rather like it.

[40hz]

There's nothing we can do other than adapting to this change.

Disagree.

Microsoft is not the entire world. And I was never one to willingly accept that somebody gets to make all the rules just because they happen to own a bat and ball.

What you mean OS not a video game??

Nope. But Excel is. It's probably the deadliest, most high stakes game of all considering the number of real people's livelihoods, and companies with investment prospects, all hanging on somebody 'playing with numbers' on a spreadsheet these days.

[tomos]

I think it's a great idea -in theory at any rate-
one OS that will work for desktop and/or tablet.

From what people say, they're just getting bogged down on a few details that MS are either to stubborn (or...) to change.

But then I havent used it yet.

[mahesh2k]

Microsoft is not the entire world. And I was never one to willingly accept that somebody gets to make all the rules just because they happen to own a bat and ball.

Yes, but when we're using windows, we play by their rules. And due to desktopshare, we played by their rules for quite some time now. Sure we have other options but not when we are working for windows specific customer. We have no choice than keeping one box running with it and accept the change.

[tomos]

From what people say, they're just getting bogged down on a few details that MS are either to stubborn (or...) to change.

from another thread, I dont know how accurate this article is - it's mainly speculation about the 'why'- why MS dont make it easier (for anyone, but especially people in a work environment) to avoid Metro or simply kill it completely. It's an interesting slant on it anyways.

[...] Also, same issue with the desktop/metro thing...wouldn't someone (rather quickly) create a program to default send the user to the desktop?  Just like how DOPus can replace your windows explorer?

About the second bit : Classic shell [dedoimedo.com]

[Carol Haynes]

1980s computing was one thing at a time (which is pretty much what not-Metro is).

Can't set the desktop as default - never going to happen. Simple reason: not-Metro = App Store = Money, desktop = too much freedom to choose and MS don't get their cut.

My prediction: Windows 9 (if they dare) or 10 = no destktop at all = lots of cash for MS.

Office 2013 is already aiming at the not-Metro interface - the rest will follow. Do you really think other companies such as Adobe won't follow the bandwagon and risk getting left without their major platform in a few years?

MS hasn't got their heads up their arse not listening to people - they know exactly what they are doing and the word is simply MONEY.

The other thing is MS is definitely working towards software as a service. Already they have said Office 2013 won't be available in a multi seat Home and Student version - instead they are encouraging software subscription per seat. I'd guess by the next incarnation of Office they will only offer subscription services - and I bet they get round the idea that people are still using Office 2013, 2007 and 2010 by making the next version of windows only backward compatible with 2013 to force adoption.

[tomos]

They could end up driving many who just want desktop type environment to apple or linux. I suspect they'll try and keep both, if only for that reason, but not allow us to seperate the two fully as you say Carol, for the dosh.

[barney]

Late to the fray - again! - but thought I'd mention a few things that have been recent encounters.

For the last while, I've been in the thrall of the Medical Monsters.  Been tied to a most uncomfortable horizontal sleeping - hah! - platform by a significant number of tubes, needles, tapes, and other such accouterments of allowed torture.  My only means of external communication to the outside world were a phone (Galaxy S3) and a tablet (Google's Nexus 7).  Granted, neither of these is MS, but there were some awakenings, in spite of the staff, on the nature(s) of hardware and its capabilities.

While my observations apply directly only to Android devices, in large they apply to all.

A tablet, regardless the OS, is a consumer device ... it does not work for development.  Any development requires significant input that simply cannot be accomplished unless you have the lifespan of Methuselah.  In fact, any significant communication requires that same degree of endeavour.  Anything beyond SMS limits is simply not practical.

What does that have to do with Win8?  I've been running a pre-RTM version with VBox (Virtual Box) for some time.  Doing it on a laptop, so have had no access to touch features.  It's fun for playing, but there's not yet enough development for any real creation environments.

Regarding development, there's yet a lot of work to be done - it will happen, but it ain't there yet.

I'm waiting for the real Win8 tablets to be released - not the RT versions - and I'll get some version of them, depending upon what's offered.  But, for now, any tablet is a toy unless all you want is to browse the Web or send SMS.  Having Win8 as an OS will not change anything as regards tablet capabilities, and I'm looking forward to Win's penchant for getting things right the 3rd time.  Just hope it's soon.  Win8 is fun, but it ain't productive.