Author Topic: Windows editors - do they have to be so bad? (Read 119,574 times)

brotherS · « **Reply #75 on:** April 20, 2009, 02:48 PM »

Quote from: rjbull on January 16, 2009, 02:32 PM

I've just been looking at a few more Windows editors. Originally, I was looking for these features:

Automatic back-ups
Bookmarks
Edit multiple files (tabbed interface?)
Ability to specify filters as external user tools (most seem to unable to cope with redirection symbols)

I love win32pad - it can do NOTHING what you are looking for in an editor, but what it does it does really well.

http://fileforum.betanews.com/detail/Win32Pad/944076528/1 (only 72 kb!)

Quote

A superb replacement for M$'s Notepad.exe. Amazingly small size. Fast and stable. Lots of features for its size.

kartal · « **Reply #76 on:** April 20, 2009, 10:17 PM »

Has anyone used pro version of LopeEdit ? Is it worth the money?

http://www.lopesoft.com/en/index.html

Jussi Jumppanen · « **Reply #77 on:** April 21, 2009, 05:02 AM »

Quote from: tide on April 20, 2009, 09:09 AM

I upgraded to version 3.94a from 3.93 for which I paid full price less than one year earlier. I regarded the upgrade price to be too high and was very disappointed to find that the two versions were virtually indistinguishable to me.

One version of Zeus runs quite happily right next to any other version, provided each version is installed in a different folders. So this is where the trial version is invaluable.

If it was me, I would just run the newer trial version for the full 45 days, just to see if added any value. Naturally if I found there was nothing in it for me I would not bother with the upgrade and just wait for the next release.

This has always been the recommended approach to upgrading and the user is even reminded of this on the Zeus upgrade page: http://www.zeusedit.com/purchase.html

Quote

I suspect you might sell more copies/upgrades if you were to adopt versioning that is more in line with the rest of the world.

You might be right, but the Zeus version numbers are now part of history

rjbull · « **Reply #78 on:** April 23, 2009, 09:15 AM »

Quote from: f0dder on April 16, 2009, 09:15 AM

STDIN/STDOUT/STDERR work irrespectively of a command shell - when you use win32 CreateProcess, you can override those handles at will. Even GUI processes can use stdin/stdout/stderr, not just console processes.

OK, but in practice I find editors tend not to enable access to STDIN etc. to user tools.

Quote

Quote
Quote
Quote
If you press almost any other key, you lose the marked area and have to start again.
This is a Windows standard so I suspect that is why most windows editors do this. But in Zeus this is configurable.
Another piece of Microsoft stupidity that has to be fixed by the aftermarket...
Dunno if it's stupid, I guess it depends on what you grew up with. Most of the time, with my usage habits, this is a decent enough default. For a serious editor, I prefer also having the option of persistent selection, as well as mark-begin + mark-end.

Good point: I grew up with persistent selections. From your last sentence, I presume those features must be present in NPP, so I suppose I'd better go and look for them

rjbull · « **Reply #79 on:** April 23, 2009, 09:19 AM »

Quote from: Jussi Jumppanen on April 20, 2009, 01:14 AM

In fact the 3.94a version is so different from the latest Zeus it can be downloaded free of charge from this link:
http://www.zeusedit.com/z300/ze32r394a.zip

<erm> Jussi, does that mean free download, i.e. you don't have to pay to download a trial, or free software, i.e. you don't have to pay to keep and use it? Or is there a lower fee for the older version?

f0dder · « **Reply #80 on:** April 23, 2009, 09:45 AM »

Quote

OK, but in practice I find editors tend not to enable access to STDIN etc. to user tools.

I can't recall seeing STDIN support (and never needed it), but the editors I've used that supports user tools have been able to capture STDOUT.

Quote

Good point: I grew up with persistent selections. From your last sentence, I presume those features must be present in NPP, so I suppose I'd better go and look for them

Nope, I've gotten used to living without them

- I'm contemplating coding a "mark-begin, mark-end" plugin though

rjbull · « **Reply #81 on:** April 23, 2009, 02:51 PM »

Quote from: f0dder on April 23, 2009, 09:45 AM

I can't recall seeing STDIN support (and never needed it), but the editors I've used that supports user tools have been able to capture STDOUT.

I'm hankering after wider availability of TED Notepad's ability to send text through a filter and overwrite the original marked text with the modified text...

Quote

Quote
Good point: I grew up with persistent selections. From your last sentence, I presume those features must be present in NPP, so I suppose I'd better go and look for them
Nope, I've gotten used to living without them - I'm contemplating coding a "mark-begin, mark-end" plugin though

NPP 5.3.1 has "TextFX Quick" features Find Matching Brace, Mark to Matching Brace, Delete Matching Brace Pair, Mark Lines to Matching Brace. Those aren't bad work-arounds.

f0dder · « **Reply #82 on:** April 23, 2009, 03:46 PM »

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of TextFX though - too much functionality in one plugin, and lots of it work somewhat weirdly (using numbers copied to the clipboard and such).

mwb1100 · « **Reply #83 on:** April 23, 2009, 05:21 PM »

Quote from: rjbull on April 23, 2009, 09:19 AM

Quote from: Jussi Jumppanen on April 20, 2009, 01:14 AM
In fact the 3.94a version is so different from the latest Zeus it can be downloaded free of charge from this link:
http://www.zeusedit.com/z300/ze32r394a.zip

<erm> Jussi, does that mean free download, i.e. you don't have to pay to download a trial, or free software, i.e. you don't have to pay to keep and use it? Or is there a lower fee for the older version?

I'm not Jussi, but I've downloaded and installed it and it appears to be a 'registered' copy upon installation. There's no indication of having an expiration or being an evaluation copy as there is in the install of the more recent versions.

kartal · « **Reply #84 on:** April 23, 2009, 06:37 PM »

wow, that is cool, I will definetely give a go.

Jussi Jumppanen · « **Reply #85 on:** April 24, 2009, 05:24 AM »

Quote from: mwb1100 on April 23, 2009, 05:21 PM

I'm not Jussi, but I've downloaded and installed it and it appears to be a 'registered' copy upon installation.

What mwb1100 is 100% correct. This is a fully registered version of Zeus that will never expire and can be used free of charged.

But remember this version is about 5 years old, so it is missing a lot of features found in the latest Zeus release.

If you find the software is missing a feature, chances are that feature will exist in the latest Zeus release

rjbull · « **Reply #86 on:** April 24, 2009, 08:30 AM »

Quote from: Jussi Jumppanen on April 24, 2009, 05:24 AM

Quote from: mwb1100 on April 23, 2009, 05:21 PM
I'm not Jussi, but I've downloaded and installed it and it appears to be a 'registered' copy upon installation.

What mwb1100 is 100% correct. This is a fully registered version of Zeus that will never expire and can be used free of charged.

That's very generous: many thanks!

Quote

But remember this version is about 5 years old

Jussi, I still regularly use PC-Write. Its .exe is dated 1993.

Quote

it is missing a lot of features found in the latest Zeus release.

I'll bear that in mind! But I'd guess that also makes it faster and lighter weight for older hardware like my Win98SE laptop - which, admittedly, even I will have to replace with Vista UAC hell when I get some time to set the new one up.

wraith808 · « **Reply #87 on:** April 24, 2009, 01:16 PM »

Quote from: rjbull on April 24, 2009, 08:30 AM

I'll bear that in mind! But I'd guess that also makes it faster and lighter weight for older hardware like my Win98SE laptop - which, admittedly, even I will have to replace with Vista UAC hell when I get some time to set the new one up.

Vista UAC hell is only UAC hell if you enable it...

wraith808 · « **Reply #88 on:** April 24, 2009, 01:27 PM »

Quote from: Jussi Jumppanen on April 24, 2009, 05:24 AM

Quote from: mwb1100 on April 23, 2009, 05:21 PM
I'm not Jussi, but I've downloaded and installed it and it appears to be a 'registered' copy upon installation.

What mwb1100 is 100% correct. This is a fully registered version of Zeus that will never expire and can be used free of charged.

But remember this version is about 5 years old, so it is missing a lot of features found in the latest Zeus release.

If you find the software is missing a feature, chances are that feature will exist in the latest Zeus release

Well, your participation here made me give it a look, and if it's as good as it seems, I might not have to spend so much money on SlickEdit

Is Zeus portable, i.e. can you run it off of a USB stick?

kartal · « **Reply #89 on:** April 26, 2009, 06:46 AM »

Jussi Jumppanen,

Is it possible to get Python shell in Zeus(for interactive purposes)? It would be even better if Ipython would run inside Zeus instead of standard python shell.

Jussi Jumppanen · « **Reply #90 on:** April 27, 2009, 06:38 AM »

Quote from: wraith808 on April 24, 2009, 01:27 PM

Is Zeus portable, i.e. can you run it off of a USB stick?

I not really sure $:-\$

My guess is the software will run off the USB stick (i.e just copy the install file to the stick) but it definitely won't be 100% portable.

The exe will always make sure a a handful of registry entries exists on the machine so it will access the registry when run.

Jussi Jumppanen · « **Reply #91 on:** April 27, 2009, 06:46 AM »

Jussi Jumppanen,

Quote from: kartal on April 26, 2009, 06:46 AM

Is it possible to get Python shell in Zeus(for interactive purposes)?

There is no interactive Python mode in Zeus, but you might be able configure a pseudo interactive mode by adding a Zeus tool item that runs the python script via the tee utility (i.e. run python + script via tee inside of Zeus as a tool):

http://www.zeusedit.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74

Quote

It would be even better if Ipython would run inside Zeus instead of standard python shell.

Since Zeus is c/c++ and Ipython is .Net this is not really possible.

urlwolf · « **Reply #92 on:** May 25, 2009, 10:39 AM »

I don't think Ipython is .Net. It work on linux, and lives in launchpad

, cannot be .net

That would be IronPython.

urlwolf · « **Reply #93 on:** May 25, 2009, 10:41 AM »

btw, I encourage anyone to have a look at the beta versions of emeditor. Lots of innovative features coming.

mnemonic · « **Reply #94 on:** May 25, 2009, 11:09 AM »

Whilst I agree that EmEditor is progressing really well, the whole plug-in system *really* irks me. The main reason is the lack of stacking of windows and the fact the a side panel has to be open for that plug-in to be active.

For example, to have code folding active, you need to have the outline side panel active, which just takes up valuable screen space.

Or, if you want the symbol list, you also need to have the project side panel on screen. As these cannot be stacked, that means side panels on both the left and right-hand sides of the screen.

To have code folding and the symbol list available, you need the project side-panel on the left, the symbol list on the right and the outlining panel on the bottom. That's a lot of monitor space on a laptop.

Or, am I missing something?

Edit: I agree with the responsiveness of the author of EmEditor. I suggested fullscreen last year and it has now been added. It also seems that the stacking of windows is on the list of planned developments - "Ability to make plug-in custom bars "dockable" or displayed in tabs."

urlwolf · « **Reply #95 on:** May 25, 2009, 11:38 AM »

I think you can have the code folding (+ signs) without having the side panel open now.
I do agree that there are better ways to organizing sidepanels, and they are not that difficult to get working I'd say.