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I'm thinking of going primitive, with discursion into zettelkasten
Dormouse:
How about some sort of plain text type wiki system? -wraith808 (November 13, 2019, 03:45 PM)
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I've never really liked wikis. I tend to think of them as a database type solution using a single long text document. But they do tick all the required boxes.
I'm not unhappy with the separate file solution because there are always ways of managing files. It's a little more cumbersome up front. In use I'm not sure there's a difference. Depends on whether I stick with Tagspaces.
I haven't thought through a tagging solution yet. Tagspaces is inefficient in its use of space and will probably be inefficient if the tag numbers get too large. Simple words (the usual approach) are appealing but take a lot of typing and reading and hog limited spaces. I'm tending to a code system. # (it's a tag), 0-9 (ten major categories), A-z (52 main sub-categories assuming I'm not precluded from both cases) with the option of further numerals or letters if more are needed. But that's already indicating 520 tags using only three digits (admittedly 52 would be versions of 'other'). I know it would need a look up table, but would actually not take me long to learn 520 codes; I'd probably learn them as I went along. And would be followed if needed by simple words separated by commas. This would be a designed solution. How many tags are really needed if you have good text search?
wraith808:
How about some sort of plain text type wiki system? -wraith808 (November 13, 2019, 03:45 PM)
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I've never really liked wikis. I tend to think of them as a database type solution using a single long text document. But they do tick all the required boxes.
-Dormouse (November 13, 2019, 05:18 PM)
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They don't have to be one text document. In fact, the one that I linked uses separate documents.
WM2 doesn't involve the use of anything other than the files. There are no supporting files stored on your system. That's the difference.-wraith808 (November 13, 2019, 02:49 PM)
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Where are the repository and backups and history kept if it's a files only program?
-Dormouse (November 13, 2019, 04:09 PM)
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It has a toggle that you can switch to using a repository. But it's not inbuilt into the way that it handles files by default in WM2 as it is in WM3. I never used that feature, nor was it forced on me.
Dormouse:
WM2 has a toggle that you can switch to using a repository. But it's not inbuilt into the way that it handles files by default in WM2 as it is in WM3. I never used that feature, nor was it forced on me.-wraith808 (November 13, 2019, 05:24 PM)
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The vast majority of even the most textish programs for writers work with a database. Keeps easy access to fragments, versions, chapters and scenes, characters, research etc. Even MS Word has effectively switched to that with 365 or OneDrive. For those that store separate files, it is generally easier to think of those as backups.
The WM developer seems to have developed WM to support his own writing & says he has done all his writing in WM3 for years. There were programming reasons for the switch to WM3, but I suspect that the change to database + bound files was because it worked much better for him as a writer. I'd concur. It makes it much more attractive to me for substantial use.
jeromg:
I've been following this thread with interest and even though I guess I am strongly biased, I don't see anything that would beat my current text-only (markdown) setup : neovim + git + Nextcloud (this setup includes a couple of vim plugin like vimwiki and Voom to manage outlines). I get everything I need from folding to hoisting, outlines management, tags, backups, full undo history (through git), not to mention the incredible vim efficiency.
The only issue I can see is the rather steep vim learning curve. I fully understand this will not work for everybody.
Cheers,
Jerome
Dormouse:
I don't see anything that would beat my current text-only (markdown) setup : neovim + git + Nextcloud-jeromg (November 14, 2019, 07:46 AM)
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I wouldn't argue with that though I can't see it being a good fit for me.
Looking over all the thread discussions so far, and forgetting digressions, the main issues seem either to be around long-term storage or optimal process and workflow.
Long-term storage
File based systems Versus database solutions
Plain text (inc markdown) Versus others (rtf, html, docx, odf, xml etc)
Workflow
Is zettelkasten worth it? What is it, if it is?
The ‘best’ solutions are very personal. We have different functional and usability needs, but it’s also a question of comfort and fit.
Naturally we have looked at a variety of software solutions. I was amused when I saw this quote:
I have grown weary of consumer geeks mistaking the tool for the work, and even more weary of the bizarro apple fan world in which notes apps are somehow second only to task managers for the tech mode du jour.-https://appademic.tech/zettelkasten-thoughtful-plain-text-note-taking/
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which was followed by going on about The Archive!
Personally, I will stick to file based solutions for long-term storage, even if they are less efficient in the short term. But I’m not bothered about file formats: I’ll go with the functionality I need. I anticipate most being rtf, pdf, txt, md, xls, html + images.
I’m not sure about zettelkasten. I see many advantages. I’m sure I can configure a system to suit me. I’ll give it two years, if I can, before making a judgement. I know my problem will be sticking to it consistently enough. When I started I was only thinking that I needed to give up OneNote/Evernote and their peers for anything long-term.
I remain happy to use database solutions for current workloads, with short-medium term outcomes.
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