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Automatic document creation. How?
JohnFredC:
Access with an Access backend (mdb) is wonderful for single person apps and good for small workgroups with a handful (say, less than 20) of simultaneous users. Access as a front-end to SQL server or Oracle is a wonderful tool, plain and simple.
Some more "pithy" remarks: 8)
Friendly, powerful development tools and data do not an application make. Good software is more about the UI metaphor, efficient data structure designs, data integrity, etc, etc.
Access's brilliance is that it leverages any moderately intelligent person into data-driven application development.
Access's downfall is that it leverages any moderately intelligent person into data-driven application development, even those who know nothing about application development.
DP departments most particularly hate it, because end-users tend not to be app-development savvy. Give them Access, though, and they can make something that is functional for their department very quickly. Then management wants DP to take over maintenance, extend the functionality, convert the app to a robust client/server environment. Typically the original developer didn't know about relational forms, data integrity concepts, or efficient query structures, many-to-many tables, inside vs. outside joins, or what have you: DP inevitably finds errors in implementation of major proportions. Further, the kinds of functionality that Access enables with such ease (self-modifying reports, for instance, see my post above, or real-time self-populating pick-lists) are much more involved to create in the kinds of tools that DP uses and with the kinds of expertise that DP hires, adding to the budget needed to replicate the end-user designed functionality.
So DP lobbies against end-user ownership of the data (and, by association, application development) via various (sometimes draconian) policies that restrict the use of end-user tools such as Access. App development professionals who are qualified in other, DP-sanctioned tools are hired by DP, absorb the "bad" press, and repeat it without a second thought. The result is that the line-of-business is stuck without the (sometime extremely simple) tools it desperately needs and in the fast-paced modern world, opportunities to enhance shareholder equity pass by.
Fortunately for developers like me, the more astute line-of-business management can see through the DP posturing toward the benefit of hiring a professional who can produce badly needed robust solutions very quickly (of course having DP miss its own deadlines over and over again doesn't hurt).
I've been in the business for 30 years on both sides of the fence: in-house corporate database development and delivery (very large unnamed bank) and subsequently as an outside (and successful) purveyor of those very apps built in Access. We could debate the politics and best practices issues in another thread, but...
For the sorts of things that superboyac is inquiring about, Access is like a dream come true.
Whew, sorry for such lengthy opinionating! :-\
wraith808:
Access with an Access backend (mdb) is wonderful for single person apps and good for small workgroups with a handful (say, less than 20) of simultaneous users. Access as a front-end to SQL server or Oracle is a wonderful tool, plain and simple.
<snip />
For the sorts of things that superboyac is inquiring about, Access is like a dream come true.
Whew, sorry for such lengthy opinionating! :-\
-JohnFredC (June 13, 2011, 04:29 PM)
--- End quote ---
We'll have to agree to disagree on that point. I've been around the block a few times myself, and have dealt with a variety of situations from access being used as a back-end, to access being used as a front end for SQL Server, Oracle, and Sybase (you want to talk about a nightmare? Access+Sybase. Actually, anything and Sybase... but that's a different discussion). And in my experience, Access and enterprise has been a headache. Admittedly, that was a while ago. But from a speed and configuration perspective, and getting around problems that enterprise solutions enabled me to solve more easily, Access never did me any favors.
superboyac:
I sort of understand what is being said, and appreciate it. But I do think my project is so simple compared to what is being discussed, that many of the points do not apply. I am inclined to believe johnfred that access can do the job, because even before bringing it up here, I just couldn't see why it wouldn't be able to do it.
But I am going to try the two solutions here that I like:
1) trying to do this in Access
2) trying to do this using Indesign and xml
One of those has to work. I may be wrong, but the very key issue is going to be the fine-tuning of the document. Text styles, nudging images around, precision formatting (I'm unreasonably picky). Plus, we've already done everything in Indesign by hand right now, so I might be leaning towards it. However, this Access solution has me intrigued. So much so, I even took a training class two weeks ago for Access.
superboyac:
How about this workflow:
1) store all the data in Access (questions, solutions, diagrams, etc.) maybe even create an input form to add new questions and such
2) export the content in the final structure as xml. (this is to avoid using Access reports as the final product, if it is not as flexible as I'd like)
3) import the xml into indesign, and use indesign to do the final tuning.
How's that? I think that's a good solution in case access alone doesn't work.
Stoic Joker:
As a network/systems administrator I'm definitely in wraith808's corner on this. I've seen many an Access based nightmare, and am thus a big fan of SQL.
But I will give you this one:
Access's brilliance is that it leverages any moderately intelligent person into data-driven application development.
Access's downfall is that it leverages any moderately intelligent person into data-driven application development, even those who know nothing about application development.-JohnFredC (June 13, 2011, 04:29 PM)
--- End quote ---
Any time I use it the tied hands effect the WYSIWYG affords makes me want to tear my eyes out almost immediately. Only saving grace is that you can at least switch to a (semi) proper SQL Query prompt and get something done. But even that's a bit clumsy.
I've scratch written many of our internal systems, and while it did take more time to do it around a SQL db ... Once it was done, it was done. Scaling issues aren't a problem, the server just handles what is thrown at it. Which is good because I had a lot more time back when most of this stuff was done. So now as the data volume increases and usage picks up, I don't have to worry about it turning into a fire-drill because the db decided to max out and explode. Getting to the 50,000 record stability/performance turning point really isn't that hard to do these days.
I guess I've just never actually seen a good Access based application. *Shrug*
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