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Nokia CEO admits that the cell phone industry is a gimmick.
halo1982:
OK, he didn't say that literally, but that's what he meant. Read:
some analysts agree with Anssi that relying on Android as the universal OS may lead to "permanently low profitability" with users failing to distinguish between different brands if they all offer the same experience.
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I don't know about you, but this goes back to all the things I've been bitching about lately. Why do phones have to be tied to carriers? Why can't I just get whatever phone I want, and then choose whatever carrier I want? What Anssi is admitting is that their actual cell phone services are so lame that the only thing distinguishing the phones is the "look" on the screen...the wallpaper, essentially. Not the service quality, not the hardware, not the functionality. Look, Anssi, Nokia makes cell phones. If you want to compete, focus on making a bad-ass cell phone. If your cell phone is bad ass, it won't matter what operating system is on it.-superboyac (September 21, 2010, 09:13 AM)
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Yes, it will make a difference. Because Symbian has a terrible ancient development environment. While they are getting away from that by switching to things like the Qt framework for the interface, no one wants to program for it outside of Europe. Nokia has made some totally badass cell phones, most recently the N8. But no one wants it because there are no apps on the Ovi store for it, because developing for Symbian is a nightmare. Which is why there are hundreds of thousands of Android and iOS apps and only a handful of Symbian apps.
Actually, you want to be distinguishable? Why don't you make the very first cell phone that is not only bad-ass, but completely open for all carriers. Ah, business...don't you just love it?-superboyac (September 21, 2010, 09:13 AM)
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They, and everyone else, have been doing this for years in Europe. Unlocked GSM phones are the norm over there, but they also have locked, contract-subsidied phones, which are also capable of being unlocked. But that's Europe, where all the countries have GSM 900/1800 support and UMTS 2100 support. In the US because of our spectrum licensing, things are quite different. We have two different GSM bands, 850MHz and 1900MHz. AT&T uses WCDMA/UMTS on those bands too. But then there's T-Mobile that uses the standard 850/1900 bands for GSM service while using the AWS bands of 1700/2100 for WCDMA/UMTS/HSDPA (3G). And that European phone that supports 2100MHz UMTS will not support T-Mobile's network, because they use 1700MHz for downstream and 2100MHz for upstream, or vice versa, I can't remember. The N8 (and upcoming E7) actually does support all five of the GSM/UMTS frequencies so it could work on both AT&T and T-Mobile's 3G, but no one in the US wants a Nokia with an awesome 12MP camera because they can't check in on Foursquare or whatnot do to the lack of developer support on the platform. If you look in the Nokia Ovi store, most of the apps there are in languages that are not English.
Furthermore, you have Verizon and Sprint. Both networks are CDMA2k based, using 850MHz/1900MHz bands. But a totally different network type than AT&T and T-Mobile. Yes, there are hybrid GSM/CDMA phones that you could use on either Sprint or Verizon, but assuming you buy one from them at the unsubsidized price and use it on the other carrier's network, you'll have hell getting it activated and even more hell getting data features to work. Oh plus Sprint still has that old 800MHz iDEN network (Nextel) that they claim they will be phasing out, but it was supposed to start phasing out iDEN once they bought Nextel, and the network was *supposed* to be totally decommissioned by 2010. Presently Sprint keeps rolling out iDEN phones, though...
Then comes LTE. That *may* end some of the problems listed above, but probably won't. AT&T and Verizon are both going to transition to LTE, but the there's Clear/Sprint who currently use WiMAX for their "4G" network, incompatible with LTE, though they've said they have the option to switch to LTE once WiMAX dies a slow death (which it will/is). Sprint/Clear deliver WiMAX in the 2500MHz band, not sure where Verizon or AT&T are going to deploy LTE. But that could fracture things even further. And who knows what T-Mobile will do. They're deploying HSDPA+ in major metro areas right now, still on the 1700/2100 AWS bands, which is damn fast (I have an air card), faster than WiMAX. But as far as LTE goes that's anyones guess if and when T-Mobile will deploy, and T-Mobile doesn't have the spectrum to deploy it on the 850/1900MHz bands. So AWS it will probably be, leading to more incompatibility.
So the US wireless industry: currently 4 or 5 different types of networks with different spectrum allocated to them, all incompatible with each other. For a truly universal phone to work in the US and the world, it would have to support GSM/UMTS 850/900/1800/1900/2100 plus that other band they use in Japan (700MHz maybe...I forget). Plus have CDMA 850/1900 support, plus throw in iDEN 800 just for fun, then WiMAX 2500 just for the US, and next year LTE on god knows what bands, then the few other different frequencies used in other random parts of the world, plus throw in TD-SCDMA for 3G in China and...you get the picture. Expensive expensive expensive, no point in it. That's why when you travel abroad you should just use your own unlocked phone (assuming it supports the world bands you need in the countries you're going to) with a prepaid SIM, or buy a burner phone if you're visiting some place especially exotic...
And as a user of several Android phones, I can say that yes, Android does offer a mostly similar user experience throughout the phones you use, and having a Galaxy S/Samsung Vibrant (T-Mobile) which is also known as the Captivate on AT&T, the Fascinate on Verizon, and the Epic 4G on Sprint, it is hard to distinguish phones more and more now. Which is why, as you say, manufacturers should make them more badass. But there is no universal solution, and like it or not, the OS DOES have a LOT to do with a phone's appeal right now.
zridling:
Why do phones have to be tied to carriers? Why can't I just get whatever phone I want, and then choose whatever carrier I want?-superboyac (September 21, 2010, 09:13 AM)
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Google tried, but just as they were set to rollout this very thing in '07 with the Open Handset Alliance which included 78 hardware vendors and phone/data carriers. Then one-by-one they reconsidered when they saw that far more money could be made if, like Apple, they all separately built their own phones and tied them to their networks via long customer contracts. It's a TOTAL ripoff. It would have been dreamy to be able to buy an unlocked phone, and THEN let carriers vie for your business on it. But the capitalists who decide that the customer should always get screwed first, last, and at all points in between told Google they wouldn't participate.
The whole idea was over before it ever got started.
superboyac:
Why do phones have to be tied to carriers? Why can't I just get whatever phone I want, and then choose whatever carrier I want?-superboyac (September 21, 2010, 09:13 AM)
--- End quote ---
Google tried, but just as they were set to rollout this very thing in '07 with the Open Handset Alliance which included 78 hardware vendors and phone/data carriers. Then one-by-one they reconsidered when they saw that far more money could be made if, like Apple, they all separately built their own phones and tied them to their networks via long customer contracts. It's a TOTAL ripoff. It would have been dreamy to be able to buy an unlocked phone, and THEN let carriers vie for your business on it. But the capitalists who decide that the customer should always get screwed first, last, and at all points in between told Google they wouldn't participate.
The whole idea was over before it ever got started.
-zridling (November 17, 2010, 12:11 PM)
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What a shame. Which is why I'm still holding off on getting any data plan. All I want is GPS, really. I'm just going to get a dedicated portable GPS device. Any recommendations?
KynloStephen66515:
Actually in Europe, where Nokia are based of course, cellphones aren't tied to network. Though it usually cost more because no one is subsiding the cost of the phone. Also most networks carry all the popular phones so you have choice when looking for a subsidized one too.
-Eóin (September 21, 2010, 09:37 AM)
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This is what I always hear about as the "unlocked" phones, right? i wonder why they are more flexible about it in Europe? Also, the listed price of unlocked phones are ridiculous. That's also a gimmick. They make that price artificially so high just to force you to buy it through your carrier. None of these phones are worth more than $200-300. No more than the price of a netbook.
-superboyac (September 21, 2010, 10:47 AM)
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Generally, even if you buy a contract, the phones are open to any network (Generally excluding, but not always, the "Network 3" as they really don't care if you use that phone they gave you, or you sold it.
If you do happen to find a phone locked onto a network, its generally for a reason (iPhones are o2 only) so if you unlock them, other carriers wont be able to offer you the services available on the phones software.
Other than that, 99% of phones are unlocked to the major networks, and ones that have been locked, and sold to a pre-owned phone shop, will be unlocked by the store staff and sold as "unlocked".
This is possibly because of how many times users change networks to get a better deal, or because thier friends are on another network and its cheaper to change and call them from the same one.
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