Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
General brainstorming for Note-taking software
Armando:
Great points
In evernote, you just start typing in the permanently docked search bar on the top. As you typed, the list of notes got shorter and shorter to just the matching ones. More importantly, every matching result was highlighted.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 05:21 PM)
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I agree : the highlighting is something I miss in IQ. Hopefully, the future will bring a solution to that "problem" -- I believe it depends on the grid component.
firtunately, I don't miss it enough though to justify not using IQ.
Now, IQ does the same search as you type with the ctrl-f window. But it's not as simple to use. First of all, it's a separate window. I recommend having a permanatly docked search bar that will filter the displayed grid and not the entire database (or have an option for either/or).
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 05:21 PM)
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Good point about being able to dock the "quick search" dialog. This is in Mantis somewhere as it's always been something I wanted.
Now, I don't know which version you have, but the search dialog is now much more sophisticated and flexible than before. You can now:
1- search the current active grid only
2- display the results on whatever grid you see fit (or almost)... It's really really cool as you can display info in any context you want (this is possible in part because of the new "hoisting" feature that works very well -- there's a small bug right now with "full hierarchy" that affects hoisting a bit... But that should be fixed soon ;) )
The other complicated factor is that unlike EverNote, the information in IQ is stored in a variety of fields, not to mention the html pane. So how can the results be displayed, with all the matching terms highlighted, AND all the fields (inlcuding the html pane) being visible? That's a tough one, and I can't figure out a solution to that yet. With Evernote, there was only one 'field", which was the box the notes were in. So it was easy to highlight and display the matching results...there was only one thing to show. But with IQ, there are multiple.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 05:21 PM)
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That's very true.
Generally though, complex searching -- whatever the software is -- is done in a few steps.
This is how I'd do more complex filtering in IQ
1- The First search is about getting a general view of all items containing the concepts I'm looking for,
2- I select those items I believe will be more interesting OR I just select all of them... and press enter to display them in a grid (using one of the display option from the "Quick search" dialog (ctrl-f) -- "search grid", "current grid", etc.)
3- Now I'm the grid displaying my result. I press ctrl-f again.
3- Inside the "quick search" dialog, I change the option to "search current grid", and refine my search even more, and send the items to yet another seach grid (or to the same one, replacing the previous results, etc.)
This cycle can be repeated until you have exactly what you want. Usually, it's absolutely not necessary though : it's easy enough to just type in the "Quick search" dialog to get to the right items, and then display the info where you need to display it.
Also, within the search dialog, it's easy to see which field contains what : the "Show details" option allows one to see exactly what field contains what. Yup...!
Granted : It's NOT as snappy as Evernote 2.1, but... I can live with that for the moment. (Nothing was ever as snappy as Evernote... But then, evernote isn't super sophisticated either. It's a different beast.) Of course, I often feel that it could be snappier. But then, I have a pretty big database with about 25 000 items (many of them containing text and images) and I never had that much with EverNote.
Actually, I just came up with a solution, here is my stab at it:
--First, have a permanantly docked search bar (like Evernote) that searches the current grid only (just to keep things simple).
--As you type in it, the actual grid will be filtered down to only the matching results. This would work the same as if you picked the "Show selected items in search grid" feature already present in the ctrl-f window. The difference here being that everything is happening in the current grid. No new windows, no special find dialog...it's all in the same window. And as you backspace or clear the search box, all the grid items would reappear as normal. In essence, it's the ultimate grid filter.
--Thirdly, ALL matches are highlighted. The matches in the normal fields are highlighted, and the matches in the html pane are highlighted. Multiple word searches would have different color highlights for each word (like Evernote and Google's highlighting features).
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 05:21 PM)
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I've had conversations with Pierre about having a "quick search" bar that would do live filtering for the active grid, and he understands what some of the benefits would be (if he chimes in, maybe he'll share his current opinion...)
The problem is to not make the interface more complicated than it already is : there are to many ways of searching, already... And filtering the grid's content is already very possible with the alphanumeric toolbar selecting
Textfields = your concepts....
This should be simplified, and maybe that's where an intermediary solution lies. Live grid search could be more tightly integrated in the alphanumeric toolbar... (although... The alphanumeric doesn't work when items are hoisted in a grid... Anyway, I guess that could be eventually sorted out...)
I got used to the Quick-search dialog and, because of the new enhancements, I don't really care too much anymore about having live search in the grids themselves... However, if there was a way to integrate this idea without making the interface more complicated, it would be great (let's not forget that the user still needs to be able to search everywhere, not just a "grid" -- which is in fact just a collection of filters allowing certain items to be shown + certain data auto-assignation set in the grid management dialog).
Any other ideas?
Now, as for Onenote, there is only one feature about it that makes me want to use it over IQ in some cases. That's the whiteboard idea where I can just write anywhere, place pictures anywhere, there is no structure to it. Other than that, I see no other reason to choose it over IQ. Here is an example of something I can do with Onenote that I can't do in IQ. I'm buying a new suit and I have pictures and bits of information all over the place for it, but I need to move them around freely: (see attachment in previous post)
Well, I hope my suggestions prove to be useful.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 05:21 PM)
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OneNote definitely has a sexy (and pretty functional) interface, and I agree that the "whiteboard flexibility" that comes with it is pretty cool. Maybe is it just a matter of enhancing the HTML pane in IQ...?
Hmmmm. I don't know.
It also depends on how will IQ's concept mapping capabilities evolve, something that'll give it even more flexibility -- The other day I was thinking of ways it could integrate with something like VUE ( http://vue.tufts.edu/features/index.cfm) for presentations, etc.
Ok... Enough blabbing...
superboyac:
Good stuff, Armando, as always.
Yes, "snappy" is a good word for it. It's a tough one to solve because they are two different programs. IQ does so much more than Evernote. Of course, I've noticed the improvements to the search window that you mentioned, I love them. I noticed the new hoisting thing, but I didn't know what it was for. I have to play with it, I don't quite understand what it does right now.
You brought up a good point. There are a number of ways already to search and filter the grids in IQ. I can understand Pierre not wanting to continually add more. Maybe something to think about in the future is to consolidate all these search and filter features to some degree. You know the Bat (email program) did this quite recently. For years it had a very powerful find feature. Just recently, they added a "google type" option for the search dialog that essentially just searches everything. So it's not date specific, or regex specific, etc. like it was before (which is still available). They just added this search everything option, and now I use it almost exclusively. so maybe all the alphanumeric filter, column filter, date filter, etc...all these things can be consolidated in a simpler and smarter interface. Linkman also deals with the issue in a similar manner. It has one search box, and there are many checkboxes below as to what fields to search. Now, I know Infoqube offers all these features and more, I'm just talking about interface issues and implementation. In other words, i can get IQ to do whatever it is I'm thinking (usually), but maybe we can package all these features differently and more simply.
Pierre is really great in that there is no feature he won't add to his program. i guess it's our job to help him with all of this whenever we can. It's amazing that with each new release, there are more and more things added to the program. I feel like at some point, Pierre is going to devote maybe a year or so to just interface things. There is just so much going on with the program. but I love it. It's the notetaker we were all waiting for for years.
Armando:
I noticed the new hoisting thing, but I didn't know what it was for. I have to play with it, I don't quite understand what it does right now.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 10:25 PM)
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Basically, it just isolates items in the grid for you. You select your items you want to isolate from the rest, and you "hoist" them. This can be performed over and over to focus more precisely on some items. The feature has a few nive twist to it. Check it out. (As I said, however, there's a little bug with the "full hierarchy" mode right now... You might not notice it though as it appears in certain specific conditions only.)
Maybe something to think about in the future is to consolidate all these search and filter features to some degree. You know the Bat (email program) did this quite recently. For years it had a very powerful find feature. Just recently, they added a "google type" option for the search dialog that essentially just searches everything. So it's not date specific, or regex specific, etc. like it was before (which is still available). They just added this search everything option, and now I use it almost exclusively. so maybe all the alphanumeric filter, column filter, date filter, etc...all these things can be consolidated in a simpler and smarter interface. Linkman also deals with the issue in a similar manner. It has one search box, and there are many checkboxes below as to what fields to search. Now, I know Infoqube offers all these features and more, I'm just talking about interface issues and implementation. In other words, i can get IQ to do whatever it is I'm thinking (usually), but maybe we can package all these features differently and more simply.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 10:25 PM)
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I agree. Quite a challenge for Pierre. I wonder if he'll tackle that before v.1, or if he'll wait. There's the calendar to finish, the item recurrence feature, the syncing features, and then polish the gantt & project management features... Lots to do ! and I think I'll be using all the features quite extensively as I can't wait to leave Outlook -- not that I hate it (I actually like it for what it does :-[), but I've always found it too rigid and limiting.
Pierre is really great in that there is no feature he won't add to his program. i guess it's our job to help him with all of this whenever we can. It's amazing that with each new release, there are more and more things added to the program. I feel like at some point, Pierre is going to devote maybe a year or so to just interface things. There is just so much going on with the program. but I love it. It's the notetaker we were all waiting for for years.
-superboyac (February 16, 2010, 10:25 PM)
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Wow. I hope he reads that... I've been a bit of a "scold" lately, constantly filing suggestions and bugs in Mantis. Words like yours should boost his enthousiasm... We need him, alive and kicking ! ;D
rjbull:
Bits du Jour have an offer on CaptureSaver, scheduled for Saturday 20th March 2010. I haven't tried it, but here's the blurb from their Web site, which makes it sound a bit like Surfulater or UltraRecall:
CaptureSaver® - Professional Internet Research Tool
CaptureSaver lets you gather and permanently save information into an off-line research and reference library while you are surfing the Internet. It ensures you stop losing valuable information and always have what's important at your fingertips.
Save, organize and search anything with this internet research tool:
Web Pages, Blogs, Wikis, RSS News, Email, Images, Newsgroup Threads, and Other Internet Content
Text from Window, Screen Shots, Rich format text from Application such as Microsoft Word, Notepad, Adobe Acrobat Reader or others
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fwdever:
A better alternative: CaptureSaver from http://www.capturesaver.com
CaptureSaver Lets you:
* Gathering information and build your own digital library of information for research.
* Capture web content and pages in a single click.
* Capture text and images: keep only the ones you want.
* Capture application-specific content.
* Add personal comments and specify tags to stored information.
* Add personal notes to stored information.
* Edit content with rich html formatting capabilities.
* Organize your information in a way that makes sense to you.
* Search by date, title, tag or text in notes.
* Reuse and share your information with other file formats exports.
* Easily move your research information from one computer to another.
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