Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
"The browser is the new OS" ...(really?)
nontroppo:
I'm looking forward to the day where we all own our own software again, but where it is as ubiquitous, cross-platform and web-enabled as current web services are, and looking forward to an end to the ad-supported web services.
-mouser (June 17, 2008, 10:43 PM)
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Well, all that is needed is a reliable framework where our home data can be accessed wherever we are via web-based apps right? Then you are in control of your data AND you can roam in the cloud. Nothing about a web app demands its data to be on the same domain it is. Or that is has to be hosted remotely as HTML5 attests to.
Though still largely speculative, here is where Roughlydrafted thinks Apple is going in this domain:
It might also come as a surprise that Apple will soon release a suite of apps that will join QuickTime, iTunes, and Safari on the Windows platform. Like Apple’s existing Windows apps, the new ones will all put the Mac OS X user interface in front of millions of new users. Additionally, they will also advance Cocoa-style development in front of a much larger audience, because Apple is also giving away the frameworks it used to create those new apps.
Another surprise is that all those apps will also run cross platform on Linux. How will Apple do this? Not by shipping a large, cross platform Yellow Box runtime for various other operating systems as it attempted to do back in 1997.
Instead, Apple is refining Cocoa for deployment within the web browser to enable developers to build those so called “Rich Internet Applications” that Adobe wants users to build in Flash/Flex/AIR, Microsoft in Silverlight, Sun in Java, and so on.
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http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2008/06/14/cocoa-for-windows-flash-killer-sproutcore/
A standards-based, open source Cocoa-like dev platform, otherwise known as a YAFJF (yet another flaming javascript framework ;)).
Lashiec:
Lashiec, how is webware proprietary when it uses open standards like HTML and ODF, and to a lesser extent, PDF?
-zridling (June 17, 2008, 09:45 PM)
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You don't have absolutely no idea about what's happening between your computer and the server, less even about what the server doing, so it's still proprietary, contrary to open source apps, where everyone can grab the code and take a peek to see how the whole app works. With webware, this is impossible, and you can only make good guesses at best. Even then, I don't know how many things you can see (the code) of what the web app is showing you via the browser (someone with more expertise than me in web development should be able to clarify this point). Webware at best qualifies like semi-open software.
Add to that what mouser talks about, total lack of control over your files, and how web apps force you to use their supported browsers. In a way, this feels like the dark years, where everything broke if you were not using IE. One could argue that you can always use another browser meanwhile, contrary to using a completely different operating system like it's the case with desktop software, but I thought the use of open standards led by the surge in market share of an open source browser should led to a open web for anyone, not only for those using the two sanctioned browsers.
While it's an advance to be able to choose (while in the past you only have one option), and Firefox is cross platform, I really hope the future brings everything together so people could use what they like to work with its web app of choice. Although if we're going the path I outlined in my previous post, this will not be necessary, and probably Trident (IE) will be out of the game :D
mouser:
how is webware proprietary when it uses open standards like HTML and ODF, and to a lesser extent, PDF?
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Do not confuse the VIEWER being open source with the backend software and data being open source.
The browser, which is the device you use to interact with the web service may be open source, but with web services this is like saying your keyboard is open source. It tells you nothing about the software and data actually doing the computation behind the scenes.
And even though many backend web services and tools are open source (wordpress, etc.), BUT even so that doesn't tell you anything about how you can access your data when it's stored on the company services. If you're using a web-based mail program -- your mail is all stored on their company server. It doesn't help you that your browser may be open source, that's meaningless. An important question is, how easy is it to get at your data and move it to another service, and are you satisfied not having complete control over your data? I'm not saying you shouldn't be satisfied with how things are now, i'm just saying that i personally do not like it. I want to be in control of my data. Personally i view this as more important than the issue of open source (should we call it "Open Data"?). I can always write a replacement program if a proprietary piece of software goes rogue.. but if i can't move my data out of a company's web server then that leaves me in a precarious situation.
Deozaan:
For those here who say Games in a browser suck, check out the Fallen Empire Legions video.
MrCrispy:
My university professor used to say - "Computing tends to reinvent itself every 20-25 years" and its very true. The evolution of
desktop apps to rich/smart client, SaaS, Web 3.0 etc is all just today's version of terminals connected to mainframes.
I firmly believe in it. Global connectivity IS the future.
"No man is an island" is true in the tech world as well.
The human race has to solve the problems of resource disparity and the gaps in wealth distribution, and make technology accessible to everyone. That's a much harder problem to solve than the technology itself, which is almost here today. The entire world should be living in an always on, always connected metaverse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaverse).
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