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Main Area and Open Discussion => Living Room => Topic started by: 40hz on January 19, 2014, 07:55 AM
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SUMMARY: When all was said and done...very little was said, and virtually nothing was done.
From OS News (http://www.osnews.com/story/27521/Obama_s_changes_to_government_surveillance):
Obama's changes to government surveillance
posted by Thom Holwerda on Fri 17th Jan 2014 23:38 UTC
President Obama announced on Friday that he will place new limits on intelligence agencies' bulk collection of phone call records. But he rejected some other recommendations to rein in surveillance made by a panel of outside advisers.
The NYT (http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/01/17/us/nsa-changes-graphic.html?_r=0) lists the changes. It's insubstantial.
Oh well...we can always get this mess straightened out after the "next election" right?
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Yeah right! No worries. :-\
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I really wonder how this is related to "OS".
Also, US-American elections are a bad joke. Republicans, "Democrats" or...? I wish the Liberal Party had more influence, but no one votes for them. Why not? Stupidity.
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Why not? Electoral College.
On point, however, that was a very good concise summary. Thanks for posting it.
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Hmm...
I really wonder how this is related to "OS".
-Tuxman
Considering the NSA has back-doored Windows - and Microsoft fully cooperates with the US intelligence community when asked - anything involving the NSA is OS related.
BTW... which "Liberal Party" are we speaking about not listening to? There are at least twenty would-be US political parties currently calling themselves that.
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Considering the NSA has back-doored Windows-40hz
... and, according to Edward Snowden, every other major operating system, yes.
which "Liberal Party" are we speaking about not listening to? -40hz
Any!
(Is there a Pirate Party USA?)
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^Of course there is. They even have a snazzy logo. ;D
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Aw neat.
See, this is a good example of a political party which would never had allowed the NSA things to happen. Why didn't they get enough attraction? Right: because they are not "the ones" nor "the others".
Sigh.
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SUMMARY: When all was said and done...very little was said, and virtually nothing was done.
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The NYT (http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/01/17/us/nsa-changes-graphic.html?_r=0) lists the changes. It's insubstantial.
-40hz
Nothing said? They said they're going to continue.
Nothing done? They stayed the course.
Insubstantial? They affirmed that they're going to continue exactly what they're doing now, but perhaps with a minor tweak here or there.
Your tax dollars at work! Perhaps this thread (https://www.donationcoder.com/forum/index.php?topic=32392.0) might be useful. ;)
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Nothing said? They said they're going to continue.
Nothing done? They stayed the course.
Insubstantial? They affirmed that they're going to continue exactly what they're doing now, but perhaps with a minor tweak here or there.
-Renegade
The speech was supposed to be about reforms and changes to be made to government surveillance programs.
Therefore: Nothing of substance was said. Nothing of any substance will be done. And whatever else was being offered as a proposed course of 'action' is insubstantial when viewed in that context.
8)
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To me their intentions are and have been made crystal clear in the handling of the standards for commercial encryption issue. It was carefully ignored. e.g. The security of and for "We The People" is irrelevant to the NSA.
So all of the security technologies available to us today are in reality completely pointless academic waste of time/money/energy placeboes. Because regardless of how complex they are locks only keep out honest people ... And that assumes they were designed to work correctly in the first place.
The web was a much safer place when Anonymous was running amuck.
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The web was a much safer place when Anonymous was running amuck.
-Stoic Joker
Agree. At least they had no agenda against the people as a whole.
And they didn't have multi-billlion dollar budgets, or armed thugs at their beck and call, to make it all happen. :-\
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Nothing said? They said they're going to continue.
Nothing done? They stayed the course.
Insubstantial? They affirmed that they're going to continue exactly what they're doing now, but perhaps with a minor tweak here or there.
-Renegade
The speech was supposed to be about reforms and changes to be made to government surveillance programs.
Therefore: Nothing of substance was said. Nothing of any substance will be done. And whatever else was being offered as a proposed course of 'action' is insubstantial when viewed in that context.
8)
-40hz
I was trying to point out the utter insanity there.
They don't give a shit.
They perfectly well plan to fuck you in the ass up through your throat and through your nose/mouth/ears as hard as possible.
They hate you.
They want to fucking destroy you.
They are actively trying to ruin as much as they can.
They need to be... <signal lost... />
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The SnowdenGate revelations about the NSA would seem to be what is arguably just another huge example of what, in hindsight, appears to have been a continuing government-mandated onslaught on the American Constitution over many years. It has apparently all been happening in various guises, whilst the American people were wide-awake, and it's apparently been happening right under their noses.
The action/inaction of the Senate and now Obama regarding NSA surveillance would seem to demonstrate that the political leaders are evidently not going to do anything to rectify matters or reverse any damage already done to the Constitution and people's rights/freedoms, so one probably needs to accept this and get used to it.
Apparently nothing materially effective has been done or seems likely can/will be done about it by the people either, presumably variously due to (say) apathy, a lack of interest, a lack of spine or a lack of any real sense of individual empowerment.
The only individual effort recently seems to have been Snowden's, and sadly that would not seem to have achieved much other than to confirm that things were apparently already much worse than we might have otherwise supposed.
Therefore, it could be true to say that it was already "game over" even before Snowden's revelations, and those revelations merely announced the fact into our awareness.
If that is the case, then no amount of belated shouting, invective, screaming or throwing of tantrums at the enormous reinforced concrete walls of the Establishment is going to make a blind bit of difference. One does not really have a choice under such circumstances. One is probably in an anechoic chamber anyway.
My suggestion would be to focus one's cognitive surplus on what is important to oneself and that which one can effectively exert some beneficial and positive influence over - including, for example (say), one's family and loved ones, one's work, one's hobbies, one's friends.
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Perhaps so. But I'd rather die on my feet, than live on my knees. Because my generation wasn't taught to just give up and bend over on cue.
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Perhaps so. But I'd rather die on my feet, than live on my knees. Because my generation wasn't taught to just give up and bend over on cue.
-Stoic Joker
This. :Thmbsup:
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Perhaps so. But I'd rather die on my feet, than live on my knees. Because my generation wasn't taught to just give up and bend over on cue.
-Stoic Joker
This. :Thmbsup:
-40hz
Double this :Thmbsup:
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Perhaps so. But I'd rather die on my feet, than live on my knees. Because my generation wasn't taught to just give up and bend over on cue.
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-Stoic Joker
That sounds great! :Thmbsup:
I mean it - it really does - and it echoes my own sentiments exactly, but it does not seem to indicate how - given that what I wrote was probably generally correct (not disputed anyway) - you might achieve some useful result with large amounts of:
...belated shouting, invective, screaming or throwing of tantrums at the enormous reinforced concrete walls of the Establishment...
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-IainB
For example of invective, refer what @Renegade said above.
Nor does "I'd rather die on my feet..." make much sense in that no-one has suggested you are going to have to die. What I suggested was leading a possibly more useful and focussed life, rather than expend one's energies and cognitive surplus (life) impotently railing against the machine.
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Inurement by gilded cage ... Are the bars really that noticeable if we like it here. It's almost as easy as boiling a frog. It's such a small request...
When you're getting screwed, take the time to protest it then. Don't just let it go.
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Nor does "I'd rather die on my feet..." make much sense in that no-one has suggested you are going to have to die.
-IainB
Considering how it's become fairly easy to get one's self killed for not showing sufficient deference to a police officer (in the USA) these days, it's not all that far fetched however. Just sayin'. 8)
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..When you're getting screwed, take the time to protest it then. Don't just let it go.
-Stoic Joker
Absolutely. It should have been protested several years ago when these things (the bars) were being put in place around us, under our noses, but everybody was too distracted by the fearful necessity to fight "the war against terror" (who conjured up that phrase, I wonder?), or something else equally distracting/fearful.
Just because someone has now drawn our collective attention to the awful fact that we have already been screwed and that we are already in a cage of our own government's making and have been for some time, it would seem to be somewhat belated to make a protest - one which would be guaranteed to be ineffective/impotent at such a late stage. It is a fait accompli. Game over, sleepyheads.
Get on with life and make the most of it before @40hz's postulated policemen accidentally kill you for loitering with intent, or thinking too hard, or something.
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Game over, sleepyheads.
Get on with life and make the most of it before @40hz's postulated policemen accidentally kill you for loitering with intent, or thinking too hard, or something.
Dunno...Sounds like the philosophy expressed in the song lyric: "Life is a Cabaret (old chum!)"
If you can live your life like that, all well and good, I suppose.
But I really can't. :)
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Dunno...Sounds like the philosophy expressed in the song lyric: "Life is a Cabaret (old chum!)"
If you can live your life like that, all well and good, I suppose.
But I really can't. :)
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-40hz
Sooo...wotcha' gonna' do 'bout it? :tellme:
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Dunno...Sounds like the philosophy expressed in the song lyric: "Life is a Cabaret (old chum!)"
If you can live your life like that, all well and good, I suppose.
But I really can't. :)
______________________
-40hz
Sooo...wotcha' gonna' do 'bout it? :tellme:
-IainB
No comment. Loose lips and ships... ;)
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Yes, I think there is the implied assumption that nothing is being done...when perhaps something is, but it just isn't evident on this board.
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..If you can live your life like that, all well and good, I suppose...
-40hz
By the way, your supposition is incorrect.
Good luck.
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..If you can live your life like that, all well and good, I suppose...
-40hz
By the way, your supposition is incorrect.
Good luck.
-IainB
Really? Well...it wouldn't be the first time if so. ;D
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Nothing said? They said they're going to continue.
Nothing done? They stayed the course.
Insubstantial? They affirmed that they're going to continue exactly what they're doing now, but perhaps with a minor tweak here or there.
-Renegade
The speech was supposed to be about reforms and changes to be made to government surveillance programs.
Therefore: Nothing of substance was said. Nothing of any substance will be done. And whatever else was being offered as a proposed course of 'action' is insubstantial when viewed in that context.
8)
-40hz
I think we're simply going to disagree on that.
My spidey-sense is telling me that it was supposed to be theatre, and nothing more.
The evidence appears to be on my side:
http://www.storyleak.com/tor-developer-fears-nsa-interception-amazon-purchase/
Andrea Shepard, a Seattle-based core developer for the Tor Project, suspects her recently ordered keyboard may have been intercepted by the NSA.
Following the purchase of a new IBM Thinkpad Keyboard from Amazon.com, Shepard discovered her package to be taking a strange detour to the East Coast, revealed by a screenshot of her shipment tracking information.
Paranoid? Possibly. However... What is more likely?
No. The speech was not supposed to address anything. It was mere theatre to distract people and attempt to reassure them that everything is just fine. The NSA will continue to do what they are doing. If there are "reforms", they will only escalate what they are doing now - they will not give an inch. And if they do give an inch, they will take a mile somewhere else while they use the inch as a media distraction to cover their sins.
It's not the terrorists that hate you for your freedom... Look closer to home for that...
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^ seems to me you're both agreeing there - just looking at it from different perspectives...
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^ seems to me you're both agreeing there - just looking at it from different perspectives...
-tomos
Yes. The main difference is that I make no presumption of government acting in good faith. They don't have a track record to support that assumption.
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The TechDirt perspective:
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140124/10564825981/nsa-interception-action-tor-developers-computer-gets-mysteriously-re-routed-to-virginia.shtml
It's a bit better.
But don't worry about the NSA... JUSTIN BIEBER!!!
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140124/07221725975/journalism-msnbc-cuts-off-congresswoman-talking-about-nsa-to-get-to-breaking-news-about-justin-bieber.shtml
Really? REALLY?!?
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OMG REN, JUSTIN BIEBER'S IN COURT-I DIDNT KNOW!!!
Thanks for the heads up lol
Other news distinctly suspicious :-\