Apple scored a sweeping legal victory over Samsung Electronics on Friday as a U.S. jury found the Korean company had copied critical features of the hugely popular iPhone and iPad and awarded the U.S. company $1.05 billion in damages.
As for the countersuit, the jury found Apple did not violate any of Samsung's wireless standards or feature patents.
This verdict doesn't even matter in the long run. This was just another clash.
This case was going to be appealed, no matter who won, the second it started. This is just one more encounter on the case's way to the Supreme Court. Samsung has lost this skirmish, but not the war.
...
Antarctica may be the only continent where the two aren't locked in battle.
...
This case really shows only one thing. The patent system, especially when it comes to software, is utterly and totally broken. While I tend to side with Samsung—come on Apple you really believe that your patenting the rectangle makes sense in any sane world?--the whole fouled up patent system is doing nothing but blocking innovation, raising end-user prices, and enriching no one except law firms.
As you’ve likely heard, Apple and Samsung continue to duke it out in what commentators have called the “patent trial of the century.” The case involves more than three dozen devices (such as iPhones, iPads, and Galaxy phones and tablets) and various patents, allegedly covering Apple’s designs, “double-click-to-zoom,” 3G technology, and various other functionalities. But what’s really at stake?
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Apple v. Samsung is not the problem in itself, but it’s a symptom of a broken system. You can find some of our proposals to fix it at defendinnovation.org.
The patent system is in crisis, and it endangers the future of software development in the United States. Let's create a system that defends innovation, instead of hindering it.
- A patent covering software should be shorter: no more than five years from the application date.
- If the patent is invalid or there's no infringement, the trolls should have to pay the legal fees.
- Patent applicants should be required to provide an example of running software code for each claim in the patent.
- Infringers should avoid liability if they independently arrive at the patented invention.
- Patents and licenses should be public right away. Patent owners should be required to keep their public records up-to-date.
- The law should limit damages so that a patent owner can't collect millions if the patent represented only a tiny fraction of a defendant's product.
- Congress should commission a study and hold hearings to examine whether software patents actually benefit our economy at all.
EDIT: Actually, $1,049,343,540. But who's counting after a billion?No worries, I'll take the change :P-Renegade (August 24, 2012, 09:25 PM)
It will be interesting to see what happens in the European and Australian courts LOL-Carol Haynes (August 25, 2012, 06:51 AM)
It will be interesting to see what happens in the European and Australian courts LOL-Carol Haynes (August 25, 2012, 06:51 AM)
I rather doubt that we'll actually find out the exact amounts of the bribes... ;D-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 07:11 AM)
Isn't there some way I/we/people could make known to Apple what I/we/people think of them ? No ...?-joiwind (August 25, 2012, 07:22 AM)
Isn't there some way I/we/people could make known to Apple what I/we/people think of them ? No ...?-joiwind (August 25, 2012, 07:22 AM)
What makes you think for one minute Apple could possibly care what anybody who doesn't completely agree with them really thinks? They never have before. They had a ideological walled garden long before they built their technical one. They've always had an "Us vs Them" mindset.
When you're dealing with self-confessed "genius" you get a lot of that. :-\
Apple was built in the image of a man who never got over the fact his parents put him up for adoption - and who wanted to be seen as an innovative genius - even though he was the single least technical and creative member in a group of true computer wizards.
There is not enough payback in the entire world for a person with that much baggage. And Apple's mindset reflects that.-40hz (August 25, 2012, 07:28 AM)
Isn't there some way I/we/people could make known to Apple what I/we/people think of them ? No ...?-joiwind (August 25, 2012, 07:22 AM)
What makes you think for one minute Apple could possibly care what anybody who doesn't completely agree with them really thinks? They never have before. They had a ideological walled garden long before they built their technical one. They've always had an "Us vs Them" mindset.-40hz (August 25, 2012, 07:28 AM)
Apple was built in the image of a man who never got over the fact his parents put him up for adoption-40hz (August 25, 2012, 07:28 AM)
Why bother with bribes? Why not just threaten to extradite any non-cooperative judiciary en masse to the United States to stand trial for impeding US law - or better yet, to simply be detained indefinitely and without charges for being "found" to be a threat to US "national security?"-40hz (August 25, 2012, 07:18 AM)
[Now I'm wondering if I patent rounded corners on a triangle... :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:04 AM)
[Now I'm wondering if I patent rounded corners on a triangle... :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:04 AM)
Go for it! (I'd do it now while there's still time.) ;D-40hz (August 25, 2012, 09:22 AM)
That Korean verdict is just nutty...-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:04 AM)
I will patent the CIRCLE WITH ROUNDED CORNERS~! ;D :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:51 AM)
Come on. This is farce.
While I was scratching my head it occurred to me to patent that gesture. Had I done so earlier I'd have reaped a handsome reward, just from those baffled by these patent wars.
(http://images.zaazu.com/img/scratch-head02-idea-animated-animation-smiley-emoticon-000415-medium.gif) (http://"http://zaazu.com")-cranioscopical (August 25, 2012, 02:46 PM)
Lets see: you got an American business + Amercan law being abused to stifle competition and "protect" (largely non-existent) American jobs + election year nationalism playing in the background + California court and jury versus an 'evil' and 'thieving' South Korean company who is arguing for rationality and fairness, and maybe just a touch of sanity? Hmm...tricky...:(
Did anybody seriously expect any different an outcome? :-\
Oh well. It ain't over yet folks! That was just the opening act.-40hz (August 25, 2012, 06:08 AM)
Pessimism: a world where we spend all our lives looking over our shoulders in case we may have infringed some obscure, never used, BS patent owned by some troll company.-superboyac (August 25, 2012, 11:25 PM)
I will patent the CIRCLE WITH ROUNDED CORNERS~! ;D :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:51 AM)
Where's your point?
While I was scratching my head it occurred to me to patent that gesture. Had I done so earlier I'd have reaped a handsome reward, just from those baffled by these patent wars.
(http://images.zaazu.com/img/scratch-head02-idea-animated-animation-smiley-emoticon-000415-medium.gif) (http://"http://zaazu.com")-cranioscopical (August 25, 2012, 02:46 PM)
I'm writing this post after the FOURTH group of Starbucks patrons have made the connection that Samsung is now the same as Apple. They don't know the details, they don't really care, what they know is Apple is saying that Samsung is the same as Apple ... and with one simple Google Search, you get prices that are basically half for what seems to be the same products -- for nearly everything.
Two of these groups (including the husband/wife) asked me about my Samsung laptop, the second group noticed my Galaxy phone (also by Samsung)... Best billion dollar ad-campaign Samsung ever had.
:(
It's all happening now, isn't it? My hope is that these are just the part of the growing pains of a transition into a freer and nicer society. The information/computer age seems to have matured and we are now dealing with what that means for us.
Optimism: a world with free access to education and information and implementation of your good ideas.
Pessimism: a world where we spend all our lives looking for the next stupid thing to copyright to make enough money where life is enjoyable.-superboyac (August 25, 2012, 11:25 PM)
An INFINITE number of sides! I will patent the CIRCLE WITH ROUNDED CORNERS~! ;D :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:51 AM)
I will patent the CIRCLE WITH ROUNDED CORNERS~! ;D :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:51 AM)
Where's your point?
[...]-cranioscopical (August 25, 2012, 02:46 PM)
My point? ...-Renegade (August 26, 2012, 01:57 AM)
I will patent the CIRCLE WITH ROUNDED CORNERS~! ;D :P-Renegade (August 25, 2012, 09:51 AM)
Where's your point?
[...]-cranioscopical (August 25, 2012, 02:46 PM)
My point? ...-Renegade (August 26, 2012, 01:57 AM)
did he mean the corner on the circle :-\ (but that was rounded, so now I'm confussed...)-tomos (August 26, 2012, 06:45 AM)
Too late. I just patented the point.
Please contact me to arrange licensing before creating any geometric constructs.
:P-40hz (August 26, 2012, 12:13 PM)
Too late. I just patented the point.
Please contact me to arrange licensing before creating any geometric constructs.
:P-40hz (August 26, 2012, 12:13 PM)
My intermediate thought was:
"Of that billion, How much was the judge paid?" There are MANY ways in which you can buy a judge. Some with money, some without. Some indirect, some direct.
Then I remembered: "Never blame evil that with stupidity can explain."
So instead of thinking that the judge was corrupt, I ended up thinking that the judge was just a useful moron.-rxantos (August 26, 2012, 09:59 PM)
“No one is trying to stop them from selling smartphones,” he said. “All we’re saying is: make your own. Make your own designs, make your own phones, and compete on your own innovations.”-http://thenextweb.com/apple/2012/08/22/apple-v-samsung-closing-arguments-make-phones-v-apple-trying-mislead-you/?awesm=tnw.to_b3lw
That's what I call teamwork! :Thmbsup:did he mean the corner on the circle :-\ (but that was rounded, so now I'm confussed...)MISSION ACCOMPLISHED~! ;D-tomos (August 26, 2012, 06:45 AM)-Renegade (August 26, 2012, 07:22 AM)
Especially when, as also written in the Jury instructions, damages are not supposed to punish, but only to compensate for losses.-Mark0 (August 27, 2012, 11:36 AM)
There is no innocent multi-billion company, none. However there is doing business and then there is abusing the system (be it patents or whatever)-rgdot (August 27, 2012, 06:59 PM)
There is no innocent multi-billion company, none. However there is doing business and then there is abusing the system (be it patents or whatever)-rgdot (August 27, 2012, 06:59 PM)
That's what that link is about... Samsung is an abuser also. Especially as even as much as we complain about the separation of corporate interests and politics in America, in South Korea, there is no separation.-wraith808 (August 27, 2012, 07:16 PM)
I would say we live in a world where we always have to search for the lesser evil. There is little to no 'good' left.-rgdot (August 27, 2012, 07:32 PM)
I would say we live in a world where we always have to search for the lesser evil. There is little to no 'good' left.-rgdot (August 27, 2012, 07:32 PM)
Considering the rather fine line between lesser and different, seems to me that it's damned difficult just to find lesser evil :-\ :huh: :mad:.-barney (August 27, 2012, 09:50 PM)
If Samsung tells Apple where to stick their contract, then
1) Samsung loses a lot more revenue in the long term
2) Samsung's word as a manufacturer becomes mud
It's to their benefit to keep that separation of producer vs. manufacturer in place.
(And that enemy of my enemy is my friend has been shown historically to be hilarious in a black comedy type manner...)-wraith808 (August 28, 2012, 11:34 AM)
It's amusing to me that Apple has painted themselves into a corner with their "innovative design" when the future of personal computer interfaces and functionality will probably more closely resemble something like this:-40hz (August 28, 2012, 01:39 PM)
I think most people underestimate Samsung right now.-Renegade (August 28, 2012, 11:39 AM)
As bad as politics are in the US, they aren't *that* overt.-wraith808 (August 28, 2012, 05:40 PM)
Wonder if that's true:
http://en.paperblog.com/samsung-pays-apple-1-billion-sending-30-trucks-full-of-5-cents-coins-294795/-fenixproductions (August 29, 2012, 06:11 AM)
@Renegade
Mostly hoax but I am curious does required amount of such coins really exist.-fenixproductions (August 29, 2012, 06:22 AM)
With the America Invents Act of 2011, which was signed by President Obama on September 16, 2011[8] The law will switch U.S. right to the patent from the present "first-to-invent" system to a "first-to-file" system for patent applications filed on or after March 16, 2013 [9] Many legal scholars[10][11][12] have commented that such a change would require a constitutional amendment. Article I, Section 8, Clause 8 of the US Constitution gives Congress the power to “promote the Progress of ... useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to ... Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective ... Discoveries.” These scholars argue that this clause specifically prohibits a first-to-file system because the term "inventor" refers to a person who has created something that has not existed before.
Under the first-to-invent system, when two people claim the same invention, the USPTO would institute an interference proceeding between them to review evidence of conception, reduction to practice and diligence.
(http://i.imgur.com/gBDpn.jpg)-Mark0 (August 31, 2012, 08:10 AM)
Japan Court Rules in Favor of Samsung in Apple Lawsuit
1:20 PM - August 31, 2012 by Jane McEntegart - source: Reuters
Samsung wins in Japan after heavy blow of US loss.
Samsung may have just suffered a massive blow in its battle against Apple, but the company was today handed a win by the Japanese courts. According to Reuters, Tokyo District Court Judge Tamotsu Shoji today ruled that Samsung's devices did not violate an Apple-owned patent involved in synching mobile devices and computers. The news outlet cites the judge as saying Samsung's products don't infringe on Apple's technological scope.
^ Haven't we seen this twice before in this thread? LOL ... never too much?/me gave up caring about Apple vs Samsung, its a futile effort, so doesn't read topics, instead he just posts random things just for the hell of it ;D-wraith808 (August 31, 2012, 06:46 PM)
^ Haven't we seen this twice before in this thread? LOL ... never too much?/me gave up caring about Apple vs Samsung, its a futile effort, so doesn't read topics, instead he just posts random things just for the hell of it ;D-wraith808 (August 31, 2012, 06:46 PM)-Stephen66515 (August 31, 2012, 06:52 PM)
It's just adults behaving like (poorly raised/behaved) elementary school kids. :P-Renegade (August 31, 2012, 09:54 PM)
It's just adults behaving like (poorly raised/behaved) elementary school kids. :P-Renegade (August 31, 2012, 09:54 PM)
Uh-h-h-h ... ya wanna maybe make that pre-school :P :P :P?!?-barney (August 31, 2012, 10:05 PM)
Surely not a real ad. They don't get this good! ;D-Mark0 (August 31, 2012, 08:45 AM)
Oh my... :facepalm:-Mark0 (August 29, 2012, 01:09 PM)
We didn't look at any singular aspect that closely...
The iPad is powered by a 206Mhz Intel SA-1110 system-on-chip processor and an in-built 64 SDRAM module. It offers some expandability with a slot for Flash memory cards and PCMCIA cards. To operate the devices, users are given a stylus and the pad provides handwriting recognition for both English and Korean.
Blast from the past:
LinuxDevices.com - LG demonstrates wireless Linux Web pad at CeBIT
By Rick Lehrbaum 2001-03-23 (http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/LG-demonstrates-wireless-Linux-Web-pad-at-CeBIT/)The iPad is powered by a 206Mhz Intel SA-1110 system-on-chip processor and an in-built 64 SDRAM module. It offers some expandability with a slot for Flash memory cards and PCMCIA cards. To operate the devices, users are given a stylus and the pad provides handwriting recognition for both English and Korean.
How dare you, Apple! :P-Mark0 (September 01, 2012, 06:37 AM)
Did MPEG4 exist in 2001 ?-Carol Haynes (September 01, 2012, 06:04 PM)
So why aren't LG having some fun in court!-Carol Haynes (September 02, 2012, 05:55 AM)
Maybe the idea is to let Apple clear the field first? Once Apple establishes everybody infringed on Apple all LG needs to do is show Apple infringed on LG and they'd have a clean sweep with minimal legal effort since if A=B and B=C then A=C.
8)-40hz (September 02, 2012, 08:25 AM)
Maybe the idea is to let Apple clear the field first? Once Apple establishes everybody infringed on Apple all LG needs to do is show Apple infringed on LG and they'd have a clean sweep with minimal legal effort since if A=B and B=C then A=C.-40hz (September 02, 2012, 08:25 AM)
Maybe the idea is to let Apple clear the field first? Once Apple establishes everybody infringed on Apple all LG needs to do is show Apple infringed on LG and they'd have a clean sweep with minimal legal effort since if A=B and B=C then A=C.-40hz (September 02, 2012, 08:25 AM)
It's a sound strategy ... Low exposure/high gain, and everybody loses ... Especially us.-Stoic Joker (September 02, 2012, 10:31 AM)
This is in the believe it or not category, but the foreman in the Apple v Samsung trial is *still* talking about the verdict and why the jurors did what they did. And the more he talks, the worse it gets for that verdict.
Groklaw - Apple v Samsung Foreman Gets More Things Wrong ~pj (http://Apple v Samsung Foreman Gets More Things Wrong ~pj)This is in the believe it or not category, but the foreman in the Apple v Samsung trial is *still* talking about the verdict and why the jurors did what they did. And the more he talks, the worse it gets for that verdict.
I would quote, but the article is very small so it's probably better to just give a quick look.-Mark0 (September 05, 2012, 06:23 AM)
Groklaw - Apple v Samsung Foreman Gets More Things Wrong ~pj (http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20120904190933195)This is in the believe it or not category, but the foreman in the Apple v Samsung trial is *still* talking about the verdict and why the jurors did what they did. And the more he talks, the worse it gets for that verdict.
I would quote, but the article is very small so it's probably better to just give a quick look.-Mark0 (September 05, 2012, 06:23 AM)
Maybe he's never heard of the loose lips sink ships rule.-Stoic Joker (September 05, 2012, 06:52 AM)
Maybe he's never heard of the loose lips sink ships rule.-Stoic Joker (September 05, 2012, 06:52 AM)
What would be really hysterical is if Korea pulls a Judo Throw with the increasing emerging info on the trial flaws and gets it overturned. Bets on whether that will happen? Hmm.-TaoPhoenix (September 05, 2012, 07:13 AM)
Am I being naive and missing the point (easily done when you are as daft as me) but that must be a joke? Did MPEG4 exist in 2001 ?1998, apparently (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG#Standards) - dayum!-Carol Haynes (September 01, 2012, 06:04 PM)
Apple Stole Clock Design For iOS 6, Swiss Federal Railways Says
The United States Patent and Trademark Office has dealt a blow to Apple in its legal battle with Samsung Electronics over smartphone patents, declaring that a patent that helped Apple win $1.05 billion in damages against Samsung in a jury trial should not have been granted.
U.S. Office Rejects 2nd Apple Patent (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/20/technology/patent-office-rejects-apple-patent-used-against-samsung.html?_r=0)The United States Patent and Trademark Office has dealt a blow to Apple in its legal battle with Samsung Electronics over smartphone patents, declaring that a patent that helped Apple win $1.05 billion in damages against Samsung in a jury trial should not have been granted.
More at link (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/20/technology/patent-office-rejects-apple-patent-used-against-samsung.html?_r=0).-wraith808 (December 20, 2012, 06:44 AM)
Of the six patents that were the basis of the ruling against Samsung, this is the second that the patent office has concluded, on re-examination, should not have been granted.
Of the six patents that were the basis of the ruling against Samsung, this is the second that the patent office has concluded, on re-examination, should not have been granted.
So far?
Is the Patent Office ... just completely broken?-Renegade (December 20, 2012, 07:23 AM)