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Author Topic: Would you pay for WinZip?  (Read 11591 times)

zridling

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Would you pay for WinZip?
« on: August 30, 2005, 11:15:56 PM »
Vector Capital (a venture capital firm) recently bought WinZip and in their first press statement said the free ride is over for unregistered users. Throughout its history, WinZip continues to work after its trial period expires. But now that using WinZip will cost $29 plus $7 a year for "upgrade insurance," would you pay for it?

mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2005, 11:38:48 PM »
the moment i hear yearly fee i change the channel.

Sentinel

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2005, 12:31:38 AM »
As far as I'm aware nearly all of the people I've ever met use WinZip because: -

1. It was recommended by somebody else or trial version was bundled with the PC and the user doesn't even know there are alternatives.

2. Because they think it is free (just click away any little popup on entry as though it was never there).  In fact we chose to buy a rather large number of units just to legally cover us against users we know are using WinZip illegally within our Enterprise.

$29 dollars is probably fair if you love the product, and $7 *may* be fair if there are frequent updates and it is just upgrade protection, not software leasing (the ultimate evil!).  I'd rather pay per major upgrade for software like this though.

It is quite likely that this will push a number of users onto other products, but then again most people will stick to the version they have now (I know of people happily using versions back to 3.0 still) and never know about the change in policy, just because that's how the WinZip user base typically are.

I doubt that Vector Capital will lose out though as the system WinZip has been using up to now has given them massive market share but probably not the level of income one might expect.

Oh, and personally I wouldn't use it, even for free.  There is something undefinable about the interface I just don't like, and the Zip format is old and tired - large file support is hardly a cutting edge update.
Designated "proofreading free" zone.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2005, 12:41:14 AM by Sentinel »

AbteriX

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2005, 01:45:49 AM »
I on my own use better a freeware and donate for it.
So i could share my soft (with my experience how to use) with others.
An commerial product i didn't could give away 'cus of the licence.
I use IZArc wich support more archive format and have the feature
to unpack several archives at once.

mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2005, 02:11:16 AM »
i'm actually quite fond of winzip, but i will not pay a yearly update for such a thing.

Carol Haynes

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2005, 03:06:23 AM »
i'm actually quite fond of winzip, but i will not pay a yearly update for such a thing.

Quite - the whole point about paying for something that most used for free was that you got free updates.

Sounds like the company have stabbed themselves in the foot.

I'll be sticking to the version I have got and if I need updates I'll continue to use WinRAR.

zridling

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2005, 07:14:25 AM »
Sentinel makes a good point: Next to RAR and 7z, ZIP is looking as fresh as an old man's pasty legs.

Renegade

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2005, 07:34:37 AM »
Oh... Jeez... Figure what I'm going to say... NO!

Well, I've been happy with what I'm using for years (ALZip), and now I even work for the company! So, I'm not planning on ever paying for WinZip. I can issue myself a million licenses of ALZip if I want! Heck, the only limit on the number of license I can issue myself is how much the data type will hold, which is a lot!

Hell... I'll issue everyone at DonationCoder an ALZip license for free! I'll talk to mouser about this and how I can give people free commercial licenses.

Cheers,

Ryan



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mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2005, 08:04:58 AM »
that would be wonderful ryan!

ps.
am i the only one who has a warm place in their heart for winzip?
i mean historically, were they not the first to get the archive interface down right ? (ie right click unzipping into separate folders, explore zip files like directories,etc.) and one of the first companies to say that even after the expiration time of the shareware it would still run?

Carol Haynes

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2005, 09:31:44 AM »
am i the only one who has a warm place in their heart for winzip?
i mean historically, were they not the first to get the archive interface down right ? (ie right click unzipping into separate folders, explore zip files like directories,etc.) and one of the first companies to say that even after the expiration time of the shareware it would still run?

No you aren't alone - but unfortunately to good guys have sold out to idiots ... their funeral  :-\

Veign

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2005, 09:44:36 AM »
I like Winzip and one of the few programs I don't look for a freeware version of.

Why?

Because Winzip has done right for me through the years by providing a great application with useful upgrades in most versions that come out.  Paying $29 +$7 year seems fair to see the direction that Winzip will take.

If the money further advances the application / technology is it worth it?  Is to me...

Will I continue to do it blindly through the years?  No.  Gonna see what, if anything, comes from this new policy in the way of new and cool things with the application...

The only concern is how much better can Winzip get - is there anything that I feel is lacking. 

I may be alone on this one as most here seem to gravitate towards freeware and my feeling is use the best software to get the job done  - even if its commercial.

mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2005, 09:47:16 AM »
a warm place in my heart still not gonna get me to pay any yearly subscription fee for anything but a constantly updated security app.

Carol Haynes

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2005, 09:55:58 AM »
Will I continue to do it blindly through the years?  No.  Gonna see what, if anything, comes from this new policy in the way of new and cool things with the application...

The only concern is how much better can Winzip get - is there anything that I feel is lacking. 

I may be alone on this one as most here seem to gravitate towards freeware and my feeling is use the best software to get the job done  - even if its commercial.

I bought WinZip (and the EXE generator) but there has been very little development really in the last few years, certainly not worth an annual subscription. Given that WinZip was sold as "buy now - free updates for ever" I wonder how legal the new policy is anyway?

I also bought WinRAR and now tend to use that for everything (though I still have both installed on my system).

Personally I am happy to see commercial software thrive (just as I like to see free-, share-, donation-ware products out there too) but I think companies have to be realistic. When there are a plethora of companies putting out free, cheaper and better rival products it just seems plain stupid to me to start charging a subscription !!

I think GetRight have had a good policy over the years - buy once, free updates ... if you have been using it for ages consider an occasional donation to show your ongoing appreciation. I don't know how many do this but I have ...

Veign

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2005, 09:57:24 AM »
That's the only part that did concern me a bit.  Why pay $7 if I don't want to upgrade every year.

I just noticed that the $7 is optional so its not a worry for me anymore...

Veign

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2005, 10:13:18 AM »
I also bought WinRAR and now tend to use that for everything (though I still have both installed on my system).

Personally I am happy to see commercial software thrive (just as I like to see free-, share-, donation-ware products out there too) but I think companies have to be realistic. When there are a plethora of companies putting out free, cheaper and better rival products it just seems plain stupid to me to start charging a subscription !!

I think GetRight have had a good policy over the years - buy once, free updates ... if you have been using it for ages consider an occasional donation to show your ongoing appreciation. I don't know how many do this but I have ...

I guess one would have to weigh how many new users are buying the application over how many are upgrades from existing users.  If new users are high enough then offering free upgrades is not as much of an issue. 

The problem is the fact that people will not pay for an application if they are not forced too.  There are a rare few (posters on this board) that actually make a donation but most just don't.  I have several donation type applications and have 100's of downloads a day and people just won't donate.  Even the application I created for coding snacks on this board, the person I did the application for didn't donate a dime.

At least the subscription is optional and you only need to pay $29 for the application - fair price for such an application.

Didn't WinRAR and WinZIP go in different directions on the newer ZIP standard that they implemented?  This means the ZIP format that both are using are incompatible with each others applications.  I believe it had to do with an implementation of an encryption method. Not sure just something I remembered from a few years back.....

mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2005, 10:34:17 AM »
it is *very* hard to get people to donate - it's just ingrained into all of our heads that some software is free and some is commercial, and it's very hard to get into a mindset where you give money when you don't have to.

i think this site is already making progress towards building a community of users and coders who support each other, but clearly we have a long way to go.

m_s

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2005, 10:53:38 AM »
Getting a little personal: I'm a Buddhist, and have lived and worked within a Buddhist community for the last ten years, and I must say that it is the economic model of donationcoder that has attracted me even more than the topnotch software and excellent reviews.  I'm fascinated by the idea of donationcoder, which I consider a reflection of the Buddhist precept of dana or generosity. 

Veign

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2005, 11:02:11 AM »
Maybe you should create a Press Release section where you create press releases on various Donationware applications or just in general about donationware and distribute these to various news places (like CNET).  The press releases will have to be very well written and maybe you could get some really good exposure.

Basically make people aware.

If this is something that interests you (mouser) you can email me - some of the PR stuff I have is not for public eyes.


mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2005, 11:11:32 AM »
thanks for those comments m_s -
i should say that there are tons of people making their software available for free without fanfare, and of course tons of people devoting their lives to helping people.  i don't want to pretend like what we are doing here is some great thing.  if i could afford to work on this site and not ask for money, i would so much prefer to not have to deal with money at all.  i don't much like it, or capitalism, or all of the corruption and greed that this society seems to fetishize. my only desire is to be able to do what i am good at in a way that does not make this world worse, and to be part of a community.  i don't have any fantasy about making enough money from my software and this site to live on - that's probably never going to be an option - i'm just hoping that people continue to respond to the site in a way that will offset some of the work involved, and that we can grow the site and the community and be a resource for users and coders who want to try to make a go of this approach to software.  and i do want this site to be an example of the idea that maybe if your goal is not to extract the most money from people's pockets, in the fastest way possible, then maybe there are alternative ways to do things..  so i really do appreciate your comments.  and i do view you guys+gals as equal players in this experiment - and i expect you to help keep this site honest and on track with these aims.

veign - thanks i appreicate that - and i will be taking you up on that offer for assistance.  the one thing that we still have to do before i think we are justified trying to get people to take note of our site, and we are slowly making progress on this front, is bring more software authors to be part of this site in a more official capacity.. it might soon be time to revisit this issue and have another round of discsussions on the best way to do this that would benefit everyone.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2005, 11:16:00 AM by mouser »

mouser

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2005, 11:21:33 AM »
one thing i want to make clear-
i don't begrudge shareware authors trying to make a living from selling software -
in fact what i'm troubled most by is how impossible it seems to be to survive in this game by taking a middle ground.
it's depressing beyond belief that marketing plays such a huge role in sales; if you are a big rich company, then you just get richer because you can dominate the advertising and marketing.  it's hard for the little guy to break through.

wouldn't it be so nice if there was enough support for donation-based software that donation-based authors could actually spend their life coding software and survive on the revenue?  note i say survive - no one who wants to become rich is going to choose a donation-based approach, and that's fine.  but if we could get to a time where a software author could make enough to actually survive and pay pills and be even at the poverty line, i think you'd find a whole new world of programmers who would be more than happy to do that with their lives. and who would be quite satisfied having a community of users to interact with.

m_s

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2005, 11:28:23 AM »
I really appreciate the model and the motivation...  I've lived in a different, parallel economy for the last ten years, working with the idea that we take what we need and give what we can - that's why I'm excited by donationcoder.  I have been enthusiastically recommending it to friends since I discovered the site, both for what it contains (in the sense of great software and reviews), and for what it stands for (and here I mean a break from the old ways, a new way of doing business).  And also: I've been reading various forums for the last few months, after staying clear of them for the first 11 years of my surfing the internet - well, it only became surfing when I got broadband a few months back, before then it was just paddling - and I must say I feel there's something different about dc, and I think that does have to do with a different ethos, a different way of doing things.  Perhaps it's a sentimental idea, but I get much more of a feeling of a circle of friends, if only in possibility - that's something it could become, in a way I don't see happening on any of the other forums I'm reading.

zridling

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2005, 12:12:55 PM »
I second that emotion. This is truly a unique corner on the net. Looking at middle ground, if you want to be depressed, imagine how many tens, if not hundreds of thousands of users the text editor PSPad has and then go look at Jan Fiala's PSPad Donation Page and make sure you blink twice — about $1700 in over two years.

That's a downright shame, given how many users crow on and on about how great it is. But then, how many of us who are good with computers haven't been asked a million times by family members: "Can't you make a living at that?"

Uh, no mom. Not unless you know someone who will pay me, now get off my back!

jpfx

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2005, 05:28:46 PM »
I've 'grown' into paying for software. But I'm still much more inclined to pay the small guy than the big guy. Maybe because my voice has a chance to be heard with one and no chance at all with the other.

As for winzip... no chance now personally and no chance at work unless a new version becomes the 'de facto' standard.
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« Last Edit: September 20, 2005, 05:30:45 PM by jpfx »

Nighted

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Re: Would you pay for WinZip?
« Reply #23 on: September 26, 2005, 02:53:44 PM »
Not anymore...maybe 8 years ago. WinRAR totally wastes WinZip as far as features go. Plus WinRAR doesn't make you pay extra for a self-extracting archive. It has better compression, the ability to view folders as FOLDERS as opposed to a path in WinZip.

I still use WinZip though...I don't have the heart to let it go. It's still a great app but it does need some updates to get the power users back on board...although when you've a user base like them and as many copies sold, maybe you become a bit aloof to the competition...sound like any other software companies out there??? ;)
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