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Author Topic: Chess?  (Read 1598 times)

tomos

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Chess?
« on: September 27, 2017, 02:06 PM »
Any Chess lovers here?
I just know the *very* basics of chess, but have started watching and really enjoying a YT chess channel:
ChessNetwork -- I particularly enjoy his analysis of famous chess games.
Screenshot - 2017-09-27 , 20_47_44.pngChess?
https://www.youtube..../ChessNetwork/videos

Also discovered a great site (www.chessgames.com) where you can 'replay' a game e.g.
Screenshot - 2017-09-27 , 20_57_38.pngChess?
Nigel Short vs Jan Timman -- "A Long Walk Off a Short Peer"

Related video from ChessNetwork:

Contro

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2017, 03:54 PM »
I like Chess !!!!!!

What is the best free chess software ?

 :-*

Note : The video is wonderful !
« Last Edit: September 27, 2017, 04:02 PM by Contro »

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2017, 05:25 PM »
Mouser tipped me off to this!

I'm pretty up on chess lately. I play decently well, so maybe tomos and contro we have to cajole you guys to visit the DC chat.

I'm far from clear how we only about about eight regular chatters out of all of DC but maybe 2018 (with this a New Chatters for the New Year NCNY ) new thing could be cool.

I live on an alternating 18 hour day and Australian time, and mouser is famous for his 3am "good mornings" and "Happy lunch" at 5pm.

So both of those topics are things I could rampage on for 1000 words!


tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2017, 04:12 AM »
I'm pretty up on chess lately.

hi Tao, do you have any sites to recommend?
Do you play online?

tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2017, 04:17 AM »
What is the best free chess software ?

Arena looks nice.
I suspect it is what is used in the video above -- but amn't sure about that.

Screenshot - 2017-09-28 , 11_16_53.pngChess?

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2017, 05:18 AM »
hi Tao, do you have any sites to recommend?
Do you play online?

Yeah I was sayin' in chat that was a bit of a "phone in post" the first time, just to prove I'm inching back into watching the board.

I have Arena and I'm pretty sure that's it too, without firing it up.

I do play online, and I play on several sites. I have official accounts on Chess.com and LiChess and Playchess. I've played on ICC (Internet Chess Club) for decades, but I let that one lapse.

As for Contro's question, "best free chess software" goes all over the map. "Strongest free chess computer player" is probably Stockfish. But I used to have a small hobby of playing weaker older chess programs because it can be less dispiriting if you actually have a chance. Also, if you can get an engine to more accurately mimic what you might actually see (to a point), that's sometimes "better".

What that complex statement means comes up in a now decade long famous discussion of "what is a computer move". After people stopped laughing at computers about 1997 (Kasparov) and up to about 2003 (Kramnik was about the last one to reliably hold draws in a big match), what transpired is everyone and their chess playing insects under the floorboard started cranking computers at the 8,000 older chess books and discovered they didn't need the old days of $70 an hour lessons anymore.

Then came the rise of the "computer move". One of the most famous is "conventional wisdom" says if you "fianchetto" your Bishop, which is sticking it on the longest diagonal "sitting next to the king" that was nearly the 4th strongest piece on the board after the Queens.

Then came the computer who ditched it for "no reason for a crappy little knight" ... to create this fantastic result where exactly every square was somehow radioactive for the opponent, then you win because you have a hazmat suit and your Russian girlfriend is wearing a bra designed for ex Chernobyl survivors and the bra can unhook into two face masks!
(Not kidding!) Then you win. Then your opponent whines. Then you shrug and drink another redbull and watch more Naka.

So sometimes older computers still don't "drop pieces" "inhuman" but the moves are almost recognizable.


tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2017, 05:49 AM »
^ I kind of followed that lol

So sometimes older computers still don't "drop pieces" "inhuman" but the moves are almost recognizable.

meaning inhuman in the sense they willing to sacrifice a lot?

Contro

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 06:37 AM »
What is the best free chess software ?

Arena looks nice.
I suspect it is what is used in the video above -- but amn't sure about that.

Moz2 - 28_09_2017 , 12_37_18.pngChess?
Downloading and installed. Look good !!!!!!

Moz2 - 28_09_2017 , 12_37_18.pngChess?

Contro

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 06:46 AM »
I download also StockFish https://stockfishchess.org/download/ , but I don't know how to manage
 :-[

Note : It seemed I will need something else : What you're getting: just the Stockfish engine. You will need to use your own UCI-compatible chess program.

What is it ?


TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2017, 07:01 AM »
^ I kind of followed that lol

So sometimes older computers still don't "drop pieces" "inhuman" but the moves are almost recognizable.

meaning inhuman in the sense they willing to sacrifice a lot?


Not exactly, there are several classes of "inhuman".

The lowest level is simply that without sacrificing, you attack and they simply don't lose a piece or get checkmated either. You might have a good chance against a living player but it keeps finding these "how the hell do you do that" moves and escapes.

The next level up is sorta in the middle of the game yes, those sacrifice combos, that "only make sense on the final two moves".  The first two moves have you going "yeah, so... show me" and then it's kinda neat.

The one I am talking about is with no special combo it just DOES things, some of which overturn 100 years of "established wisdom" except it just somehow works. Besides the weird one I mentioned, a famous category is insane combos that somehow just all amount to getting one piece. Then you just lose from level 1 see above.

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2017, 07:02 AM »
(edit - tired - didn't read.)

There are several, but see above, look for Arena, because I think it's supposed to be easy to just "add engine". I think even poor ol' me managed it once. : )

tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2017, 10:51 AM »
The one I am talking about is with no special combo it just DOES things, some of which overturn 100 years of "established wisdom" except it just somehow works. Besides the weird one I mentioned, a famous category is insane combos that somehow just all amount to getting one piece. Then you just lose from level 1 see above.

Below a couple videos from another channel I started following (agadmator's Chess Channel). I like him a lot -- he's got a very relaxed style, but is much faster moving than the other channel above.

Following on from your quote there:
Two interesting untypical games (especially the first). Both with interesting back-stories, both played by humans :p


Bobby Fischer's Secret Online Match vs Nigel Short in 2000


This is Sultan Khan - The Servant who Defeated Champions

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2017, 03:01 AM »
Sorry Tomos,
Be careful about the "Secret Fischer" thing - it's one of the urban legends and other people's research say it's pretty likely it was a (now aging and vanished) computer of the time.

In a complex "roll-forward to roll-back" kind of time jump, modern cheat detection concepts show things like high matches between moves from a computer engine and that story. Also "it's not 1994 calling" either, so a famous trick is to intersperse other moves in between the computer ones.

Fischer was simply in a state of human collapse, and those kind of factors also sadly lead to this kind of thing being unlikely Fischer pulverizing a fresher modern top GM (grandmaster). He was one of the only "urban legends" the game had. Nearly every other top GM is "accounted for".
« Last Edit: October 08, 2017, 03:13 AM by TaoPhoenix »

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2017, 03:10 AM »

"Much faster moving" - what do you mean by that?

Also, chess channels is a fascinating topic, and before I say a whole lot answering "the wrong question" I need some clarification what you like and don't like in a chess channel.

Your first clue:
How strong is the presenter?

"National Master" - this tend to be about the 2250-2375 level, certainly enough to hold the airspace, but it also depends heavily what they are showing. I'm about 3 grades below that, but when showing famous material drawn from existing games especially backed by already existing grandmaster annotations and this decade's twist of computer checking, you can "back your way" into a chess lecture.

So I don't know how "strong" (the word in the culture) agadmator is. But having the Fischer item presented straight up is a little unfortunate. However, there aren't too many of those.

Sultan Khan is a little more obscure - several decades older, and also dating from a time in chess culture where we now cover more ground in 5 weeks than they did in a year "back in the day".

I'll have more to remark on current channels soon when I hear back from you!

Contro

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2017, 05:26 AM »
 :-*

I am thinking in chess.
Is a mental sport. So I will practice in my sport area.
That is simple. While deciding the next move I will excercise with the hands and feets in front of the tactile screen.

I will a photo to clarify this and make clear how before 30.10.2017 my weight will be less than 90 kilograms.

Who will gain the party ?

 :-[

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2017, 07:26 AM »
:-*

I am thinking in chess.
Is a mental sport. So I will practice in my sport area.
That is simple. While deciding the next move I will excercise with the hands and feets in front of the tactile screen.

I will a photo to clarify this and make clear how before 30.10.2017 my weight will be less than 90 kilograms.

Who will gain the party ?

 :-[

Well fidgeting with your hands isn't necessarily efficient exercise!

Many scientists agree you have more energy to play if you are in shape, but you have to concentrate first! Otherwise you make a bad move, lose the game, then get lots of exercise punching pillows!

 ;D

Contro

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2017, 09:06 AM »
We can't have everything.
But play only chess is a high price to pay.

So :

20171008_104945.jpgChess?20171008_104956.jpgChess?

Only two additional rules :

1. No limit time to play.
2. Excersize with weights while thinking.

I am reading entire books by now with this method.

"Mens sana in corpore sano"

 :-*

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2017, 10:17 PM »

So what'cha got going tomos?

And do ya ever wanna visit the DC chat to talk chess!?


tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2017, 08:33 AM »
do ya ever wanna visit the DC chat to talk chess!?

will try during the week

TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2017, 07:21 PM »
So, semi bumping this thread.

Chess.com was laughable about three years ago, then they managed to get some cash flowing, and have started hosting blitz championships with the elite grandmasters (GM) and really scored a coup when they got arguably the second best bullet super speed GM on the planet, Hikaru Nakamura, starting new stream games live with commentary and he SO knows what he's doing. (World Champion Magnus Carlsen is actually quite terrifying in his own right, but tends not to play online.)

It's a nice change of pace because what used to happen is talented enough grandmasters basically ground down with the brutal effort curve at that level, because somewhere on the run up if you're good enough to start edging past low master in talent, it stops being a fun hobby! 0.o

Put another way, anyone about two grades up above me can "snap" a good game against hobbyists, but then they start nudging up against the pros. So then they retire from actually playing, and join the ranks of instructors and lately, web commentators.

So it's nice to see the blitz championships with all the legit players, and Hikaru is just something to behold. The funniest of all is "people" are starting to create some cultural growth in the game - a quite talented GM from Canada named Eric Hansen collected a few more titled masters under the "brand" "Chessbrahs" and their streams are fun because they slide into low R rating for language, which chess desperately needs to stop being stodgy.

So then the epic grudge matches between Eric Hansen and Hikaru Nakamura "Naka" are next level commentary. On a few occasions the "visiting masters" (Hikaru plays a few other masters online in his shows) have even left the audio stream on and Hikaru explains how he's going to win ON THE FLY.

"Oh, yeah, he's trying to put his knight there, he began trying to set that up a couple moves ago, but it's not going to work because he forgot I have Knight h5, then Rook Takes Knight Takes Queen Check Queen takes Rook takes, takes takes, push, and then he can't stop my pawn. So I'm just waiting for him to resign while I run him out of time on the clock. So hello you guys in the chat...."

\0/


TaoPhoenix

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2017, 09:12 PM »

There's some good chess streams coming up for November ...


tomos

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Re: Chess?
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2017, 09:13 AM »
There's some good chess streams coming up for November ...
please let us know more (how/where/when to access)
Sounds fun what you were describing in the previous post.

Below a couple videos from another channel I started following (agadmator's Chess Channel). I like him a lot -- he's got a very relaxed style, but is much faster moving than the other channel above.
added link in the above quote --
I'm still watching a good few of his videos. For me, it's interesting to be shown "what would happen if" etc. and he has a good style I find. He's rated around the 2000 mark himself.  The first presenter I linked to (post#1 'Chessnetwork') is rated a lot higher (IM even, but not 100% sure), but his presentation was too slow for my taste.

I have no problem with where they get the ideas they present -- I just want something accessible (and entertaining).

I do find myself slowly copping on to what the next logical move might be in not very complex situations. But then the most interesting moves can seem pretty illogical until you see what follows.

Sultan Khan is a little more obscure - several decades older, and also dating from a time in chess culture where we now cover more ground in 5 weeks than they did in a year "back in the day".

I have heard that 'modern' classical chess is often about grinding down and can be pretty boring. At my level, *any* chess game is of interest. But, again, the more dramatic ones are more entertaining. And I find the post-analysis of much more interest than the couple of 'live' videos I've seen. A good example is this great game live:
https://youtu.be/L9nKxauDbVs?t=8m23s
(cueued to random middle of game)   --   those commentators do my head in lol