Home | Blog | Software | Reviews and Features | Forum | Help | Donate | About us
topbanner_forum
  *

avatar image

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
  • September 28, 2016, 08:40:12 AM
  • Proudly celebrating 10 years online.
  • Donate now to become a lifetime supporting member of the site and get a non-expiring license key for all of our programs.
  • donate

Author Topic: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis  (Read 3248 times)

40hz

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2007
  • **
  • Posts: 11,763
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« on: November 10, 2014, 09:02:10 AM »



 8)

Jibz

  • Developer
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,119
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2014, 11:43:05 AM »
 :-*

Stoic Joker

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 6,265
    • View Profile
    • www.StoicJoker.com
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2014, 11:58:03 AM »
Okay, so I had to Google for the uninterested vs. disinterested bit and quickly ran across Merriam-Webster

Quote
Usage Discussion of DISINTERESTED

Disinterested and uninterested have a tangled history. Uninterested originally meant impartial, but this sense fell into disuse during the 18th century. About the same time the original sense of disinterested also disappeared, with uninterested developing a new sense—the present meaning—to take its place. The original sense of uninterested is still out of use, but the original sense of disinterested revived in the early 20th century. The revival has since been under frequent attack as an illiteracy and a blurring or loss of a useful distinction. Actual usage shows otherwise. Sense 2 of disinterested is still its most frequent sense, especially in edited prose; it shows no sign of vanishing. A careful writer may choose sense 1a of disinterested in preference to uninterested for emphasis <teaching the letters of the alphabet to her wiggling and supremely disinterested little daughter — C. L. Sulzberger>. Further, disinterested has developed a sense (1b), perhaps influenced by sense 1 of the prefix dis-, that contrasts with uninterested <when I grow tired or disinterested in anything, I experience a disgust — Jack London (letter, 1914)>. Still, use of senses 1a and 1b will incur the disapproval of some who may not fully appreciate the history of this word or the subtleties of its present use.

I give up.  :(

TaoPhoenix

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 4,548
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2014, 03:14:45 PM »

Ow!

I do get tiny internal cringes when I see store signs with "basic" grammar errors with the apostrophes and stuff. But maybe it's a good lesson to end the even momentary better-than-you attitude upon seeing them, and just move on to the actual point of the day's activity.


Renegade

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,214
  • Tell me something you don't know...
    • View Profile
    • Renegade Minds
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2014, 04:16:44 PM »
My major f'ing psychotic hatred (as opposed to a pet peeve) is not spelling or grammar, but the inability to communicate with a sufficient degree of precision with the fallout being ambiguity or meaninglessness, and then having someone get upset because I've asked for clarification because what was previously said was unintelligible.

Spoiler
But, FWIW, just to be pedantic... :P

"...the old pedantic me would have insisted on 'none of them is of importance'."

Errr... "they *are* not important"? :P

(You'll find that both the plural and singular forms there have advocates.)



Clarity is good. Ambiguity is for politicians and poets. :P

Here's some more Stephen Fry for y'all.  8)



Also...

http://www.gutenberg...les/12/12-h/12-h.htm  8)

Quote
'And only ONE for birthday presents, you know. There's glory for you!'

'I don't know what you mean by "glory,"' Alice said.

Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. 'Of course you don't—till I tell you. I meant "there's a nice knock-down argument for you!"'

'But "glory" doesn't mean "a nice knock-down argument,"' Alice objected.

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.'

'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you CAN make words mean so many different things.'

'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master—that's all.'

Alice was too much puzzled to say anything, so after a minute Humpty Dumpty began again. 'They've a temper, some of them—particularly verbs, they're the proudest—adjectives you can do anything with, but not verbs—however, I can manage the whole lot of them! Impenetrability! That's what I say!'

'Would you tell me, please,' said Alice 'what that means?'

'Now you talk like a reasonable child,' said Humpty Dumpty, looking very much pleased. 'I meant by "impenetrability" that we've had enough of that subject, and it would be just as well if you'd mention what you mean to do next, as I suppose you don't mean to stop here all the rest of your life.'

'That's a great deal to make one word mean,' Alice said in a thoughtful tone.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker
« Last Edit: November 10, 2014, 04:38:46 PM by Renegade »

Stoic Joker

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 6,265
    • View Profile
    • www.StoicJoker.com
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2014, 05:20:22 PM »
My major f'ing psychotic hatred (as opposed to a pet peeve) is not spelling or grammar, but the inability to communicate with a sufficient degree of precision with the fallout being ambiguity or meaninglessness, and then having someone get upset because I've asked for clarification because what was previously said was unintelligible.

Marklar!

Renegade

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,214
  • Tell me something you don't know...
    • View Profile
    • Renegade Minds
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2014, 05:31:45 PM »
My major f'ing psychotic hatred (as opposed to a pet peeve) is not spelling or grammar, but the inability to communicate with a sufficient degree of precision with the fallout being ambiguity or meaninglessness, and then having someone get upset because I've asked for clarification because what was previously said was unintelligible.

Marklar!

Shazbot!
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Stoic Joker

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 6,265
    • View Profile
    • www.StoicJoker.com
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2014, 10:07:52 PM »
My major f'ing psychotic hatred (as opposed to a pet peeve) is not spelling or grammar, but the inability to communicate with a sufficient degree of precision with the fallout being ambiguity or meaninglessness, and then having someone get upset because I've asked for clarification because what was previously said was unintelligible.

Marklar!

Shazbot!

Not quite, but close enough - Now check your IMs FFS

Edvard

  • Coding Snacks Author
  • Charter Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,880
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2014, 04:47:57 PM »
I quite agree with Mr. Fry on many points, even as I consider myself, not a grammar 'nazi'... perhaps a grammar 'conservative'.  I have no problems with language being used unconventionally for the sake of entertainment or even 'wrong' use of grammar when it actually contributes to clarity.  The recent plague (yes, plague I say...) of using the word 'of' to replace the contraction of 'have' as seen here is an example of something I just can't let go as any sort of 'correct'.  I have others, but in the spirit of the topic, I'll stop there.
;)

TaoPhoenix

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 4,548
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2014, 08:50:00 PM »
I quite agree with Mr. Fry on many points, even as I consider myself, not a grammar 'nazi'... perhaps a grammar 'conservative'.  I have no problems with language being used unconventionally for the sake of entertainment or even 'wrong' use of grammar when it actually contributes to clarity.  The recent plague (yes, plague I say...) of using the word 'of' to replace the contraction of 'have' as seen here is an example of something I just can't let go as any sort of 'correct'.  I have others, but in the spirit of the topic, I'll stop there.
;)


I think I might have a good guess for this one:

Verbally, it sounds like it is "of", but it takes some wee bit of erudite learning to know it. Lit types are probably more passingly familiar with poetry, and could me more ready to look for a construction like "could've".

The newish one that I used to rankle on was "ur". I used to be more vocal "Ur is a Mesopotamian City name, not a word!"

But I am learning that while texting, people are getting more forceful abbreviating things.


Edvard

  • Coding Snacks Author
  • Charter Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,880
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2014, 09:59:56 PM »
In texting, I couldn't care less.  Economy of verbosity is the name of the game there.  As long as you have the good sense to not use the same language on your résumé, meh... whatevs.

I think the things that get to me worst are the very same types of things as the 'of' phenomenon... phoneticisms that turn into grammatical faux pas; e.g. "loose" vs. "lose" (yet another plague!), or "At your beckon call", or "One in the same". *shudders*

I'll once again stop before I go too far.

bit

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2013
  • **
  • Posts: 686
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Stephen Fry's eloquent response to Grammar Nazis
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2014, 10:46:11 PM »
Sometimes the entire subject leaves me feeling like Nova trying to spit out one intelligible word:
'Beneath the Planet of the Apes' - Nova speaks.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2014, 11:10:26 PM by bit »