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Author Topic: Outpost and WinXP SP2  (Read 16920 times)

tenseiken

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Outpost and WinXP SP2
« on: June 14, 2005, 01:36:55 PM »
Have any of you tried installing Outpost on WinXP SP2?  I get an error message saying the service is damaged or some such BS every time I try.  I've already contacted support about it, and they assure me that they're working on it, but it's been almost a week now and I'm getting impatient and feeling vulnerable without a firewall.  Have any of you encountered this problem before?  If so, have you found a workaround for it?
-John

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2005, 02:08:09 PM »
have you checked the outpost forum yet?
sp2 has been out for a long time, there is no way that outpost isn't designed to work with it, so something else must be at issue.

have you tried clean uninstall and reinstall?

JeffK

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2005, 02:21:15 PM »
I am not running Outpost ATM but have used it with Win XP2.  My Outpost version is 402.

Jeff

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2005, 04:29:09 PM »
mouser: I'll look at their forums.  And yeah, I've cleanly uninstalled and reinstalled several times now.

jeffk: I'm not sure of the build number I'm using... I've tried both 2.5 and 2.7 though.
-John

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2005, 09:30:49 PM »
Every version of Outpost has given me BSODs.  I have plans to check back on it in the year 2018.
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »

JeffK

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2005, 09:39:40 PM »
Every version of Outpost has given me BSODs.  I have plans to check back on it in the year 2018.
:D

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2005, 09:49:02 PM »
No BSODs for me yet.  Actually, I just managed to get it working again.  The only thing I did differently on this install was send it to the default directory (I have a hard drive I use solely for 3rd-party software, but I went ahead and used C: this time).  I assume that was what the problem was, but that seems like a pretty silly thing to cause such a large problem.
-John

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2005, 09:54:58 PM »
Agnitum uses SFN extensively in the registry (and probably elsewhere) to make Outpost work, so it wouldn't surprise me at all that the path could make or break that house of cards.  I rarely use the default installation directory, and have seen that sort of thing happen before.
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2005, 12:15:15 AM »
i use non default install dir also, and also on D not C, and not had any trouble.

but SP2 i don't have, as it did me bad in other ways.

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2005, 01:43:11 AM »
Although it seems plausible, I have a hard time believing that they don't know anything about the problem.  The info I gave them in response to their questions pretty much told them I was using a non-standard directory to install it to.  Surely they would have said something about it if they thought that was the problem.
-John

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2005, 01:53:58 AM »
i wouldnt count on the official agnitum support system to help much - they have a pretty bad track record.
now the forums are another story, and can be very helpfull.

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2005, 07:30:50 AM »
Although it seems plausible, I have a hard time believing that they don't know anything about the problem. The info I gave them in response to their questions pretty much told them I was using a non-standard directory to install it to. Surely they would have said something about it if they thought that was the problem.

You're assuming they read your message in the first place.  In my experience (which includes several incidents with Agnitum), they like to ignore their customers, even (or perhaps especially) after they've paid up.  This is why I almost grit my teeth every time someone goes on about what a great solution Outpost is.  Shitty support really, really, really pisses me off.  But I'm being naughty here, again.  I'll STFU.   (P.S. I'm talking about Outpost Pro; I know you can't expect support for freeware.)
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »
« Last Edit: June 15, 2005, 07:32:33 AM by Scott »

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2005, 08:24:07 AM »
ive complained plenty about agnitum support...
but then when you take into consideration the unofficial forum..
i wonder if, relatively speaking, agnitum isnt still better in total support scenario than most others..

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2005, 09:12:57 AM »
I agree the de-facto "support" forum in place is good to have, but Agnitum doesn't get credit for support offered by its customers.  And the forum is essentially useless for the types of problems I've had--things like BSODs, which are inherent product defects.  Another customer might be able to help by pointing to a software conflict or something like that, but it's all a waste if the vendor ignores the whole thing.

It's so absolutely maddening to me to use a product, encounter a problem with it, and try to get even a little bit of info--but be ignored.  Then to sit there, wondering if a reply will come.  Should I continue using it?  Should I remove it?  Should I follow up?  Did they not get my message?  Spam filters...  Could've lost the message.  I'll try again.  Oops, ignored again it seems.  Another crash.  Should I remove it now?  Two more weeks.  Nothing.  How much time from my family has this cost me?

Speaking of "oops", I forgot about that whole "STFU" thing.  :o
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »
« Last Edit: June 15, 2005, 09:16:00 AM by Scott »

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2005, 09:30:26 AM »
i guess ive learned to not expect much from any official tech support of any product, at least when it comes to me experiencing problems.
(like i said i've hade my own small struggles with outpost, but i still love it)

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2005, 11:43:56 PM »
I'm starting to get BSODs while running Outpost now (none otherwise).  I recently switched from Win2k Pro to WinXP Pro, and had no problems before, both with the installation and use.  After scouring Agnitum's forums and seeing a dozen or so threads about BSODs, I'm starting to question the wisdom of purchasing Outpost (discounted or otherwise).  It doesn't seem like the underlying problem, whatever that may be, is being worked on by the developers... or if it is, it's just not being fixed.  I certainly don't want to use the integrated Windows firewall, and I don't really want to switch back to Sygate, but I'm not being left with many choices...
-John

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2005, 12:53:24 AM »
here's what i can tell you, and i need to repeat, i am not a fan of official agnitum support team, and im not a salesman for outpost :)

1) i've been using outpost for several years now, and it has been rock solid stable for me.  ie it never crashes, never bluescreens.
now obviously you've got an issue, and you're not the only one given the forum, but it does mean that in general its not a buggy app, and given the volume of traffic on the forum it shouldnt be surprising to find some others with bluescreens.

2) outpost is actively developed, and win xp sp2 is a big user base, so i would be quite sure they care about making it stable on this platform.

i can only suggest to keep looking to try to figure out what is making it freak out - clearly its a problem not with you but with the app, but maybe you can try to figure out what is triggering it.. some other app may be trying to make a specific connection, or something like that..  actually there was a known bluescreen issue that a friend figured out a cause for.. it had to do with a certain cygwin-compiled app trying to establish a connection.. see if you can figure out what is causing the bluescreen... try disabling all plugins.

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2005, 04:03:21 PM »
Agnitum fixes (or tries to) BSODs in many of its releases.  I've run every firewall under the sun, and I've never seen another one with such an ongoing propensity for serious stability issues.

After becoming tired of devoting several hours a month to configuration and other related hassles, I decided to give up on software firewalls indefinitely.  I don't run one at all now, and they can all kiss my ass.

P.S.  I don't want someone to tell me that I should run a software firewall, at all costs.
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2005, 04:40:37 PM »
you should run a software firewall, at any cost.

JeffK

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2005, 05:18:51 PM »
Scott, you should run a software firewall, not at any cost, but at the cost of some smarty pants people on a forum telling you you should run a software firewall at any cost.

Jeff

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2005, 06:25:27 PM »
More info about Agnitum's support (or lack thereof).  I got an email today, 9 days after the original support ticket was started, saying that my question had been passed to the developers.

...

Ho-kay.

I think I may just do without a software firewall for a while too.  I figure making it through my router would be tough enough for most malicious people.
-John

mouser

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2005, 06:49:29 PM »
that sounds like the official agnitum tech support team i remember, lol.
you'd think if they have these form letter replies the least they could do is send them to you more expiditiously.

ps.
imho hardware firewalls/routers are useless for almost every possible danger you should be worried about.
if you are an isp at risk for denial of service attacks, a hardware firewall is important, but for a home user, they are useless, and a software firewall is what you need.

Scott

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2005, 07:37:29 PM »
More info about Agnitum's support (or lack thereof). I got an email today, 9 days after the original support ticket was started, saying that my question had been passed to the developers.

That's about what happened to me last time I sent an email.  Then I waited.  And waited.  And waited.  And waited.  And waited some more.  Then I sent a follow-up.  Still nothing.  This was months and months ago.  Agnitum can kiss my ass.

Regarding not running a software firewall...  Give me a break.  Software firewalls are more a threat to me than malware is.  I've never had malware make my system crash over and over, suck my wallet dry, or waste my time the way software firewalls have.  Besides, the real malware can bypass them all anyway.  Routers are indeed useless for outbound stuff, but they're very useful for blocking typical threats from the outside, which is still a big deal these days.
« Next Edit: Tomorrow at 12:13:47 AM by Scott »
« Last Edit: June 17, 2005, 07:39:33 PM by Scott »

tenseiken

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Re: Outpost and WinXP SP2
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2005, 10:10:05 PM »
Yeah, I've already sent one follow-up and they responded to that saying basically the same thing they said again in the email I got today.  So I suppose that this is twice now that my question has been sent to the developers. *sigh*

And yeah, I know that the router doesn't do anything about outbound traffic, but I think I'm pretty good at keeping that in check on my own.  I always keep an eye on what processes I'm running, and I look into anything that doesn't look right.  Inbound stuff is what I worry about--and given the trouble I have to go to to allow FTP clients to connect to my server over the router, I really doubt that someone could just bust in without my permission.
-John