Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
What the Heck is Happening to Windows? Article on Windows 8 Disaster
kilele:
Mmm, some nice ideas :) I hope some relevant folks incorporate some or all of these!
-ewemoa (March 20, 2014, 01:39 AM)
--- End quote ---
Glad you find them interesting, all the process of designing user interfaces must be really entertaining. You can read more ideas that I've added to my post from above :
https://www.donationcoder.com/forum/index.php?topic=37268.msg351603#msg351603
I have watched a few videos of Win8.1 and seems that now M$ is doing a nice work listening to the users community.
Vurbal:
I think it's a little generous to call the problems with the Win8 interface PR related. They didn't successfully communicate the user benefits of the interface because their reasons for the changes had nothing to do with solving user problems. The entire point was solving Microsoft's impending revenue stream problem. It's the same reason they came up with Office 365.
The vast majority of Microsoft's profits come from volume licensing of Windows and Office. When they finally accepted the reality those revenue streams aren't sustainable in the long term they started flailing around for replacements. One was convincing individuals to license Office rather than buying it. The other was taking a cut of third party software sales via a walled garden. That's the whole reason Steve Ballmer went off the rails on his iPhone = brilliant / Android = confusing tangent after years of dismissing the iPhone.
Having said that, I find the Windows 8 desktop interface refreshing because eliminating the Start Menu stripped away more than a decade of mostly kludge. It leaves a lot more room for people who have a better idea (or even an ounce of give a damn) about what users want and need to do the job right by designing from the ground up. Unfortunately I think it doesn't go nearly far enough.
IMO Windows needs a total ground up redesign, not unlike what Apple did with OS X. The result would be a quick and somewhat painful death as it's being replaced by something leaner, meaner, and free of the virtual Rube Goldberg machine which is the registry. The alternative is a slow and agonizing death as people abandon the platform altogether.
As much as I appreciate the overall design brilliance of *nix based operating systems, I also believe in alternative approaches as a necessary component of technology development. Windows has too much legacy cruft baked into its core to be viable in the long term. However there is also a lot of interesting and useful technology that's been added over the years to prop up that legacy framework. An operating system built around those bits and the lessons learned along the way could be brilliant.
40hz:
One was convincing individuals to license Office rather than buying it.
-Vurbal (March 20, 2014, 09:57 AM)
--- End quote ---
To be honest, IMO that's the only part of their new business model that makes even small sense within an admittedly limited number of use cases. Where it fits, it fits very well. For the rest of us...uh...I doesn't.
Attempting to create a walled garden isn't something that's going to be tolerated willingly. Especially now that enough developers have seen what Apple's iStore arrangement got them. One locked platform is bad enough. If Microsoft thinks to follow in Steve Jobs footsteps, they'll have a long uphill battle ahead of them. And at this juncture, they really can't afford to get into one.
The Win 8 desktop brings nothing of significance to the mix. It's different for the sake of different, ugly to look at, and makes little sense without a touchscreen. To call it an improvement over the past is like saying Alcatraz was better than Levinworth Penitentiary because at least Alcatraz is in California and by the ocean. Microsft has to get off the way of thinking that says "Now sucks less!" is the same thing as "New and Improved!" when it comes to product design. (And while we're on the subject...could Microsoft please hire at least one designer who has some sense of color esthetics? Because whoever came up with that Fisher-Price color palette for Windows 8 either needs an eye exam- or a new job. Preferably in the fast food or hospitality industry.)
IMO Windows needs a total ground up redesign, not unlike what Apple did with OS X.
-Vurbal (March 20, 2014, 09:57 AM)
--- End quote ---
Exactly. They could just license the Mach kernal (like Apple) did and wrap their own nonsense around it. Like Apple did. Seriously, why reinvent the wheel? The requirements and design principles of an OS are clearly understood and pretty well time-tested by now. There is a right way to do an OS.
Where the creativity and "Oooo-ahh!" comes in is in with the user interface. If you want to spend effort and resources coming up with something "insanely great" (or whatever ::)) put the effort into the design and testing of the user interface. That and providing reliable hardware drivers. Do that and your millions of customers will love you forever - even if a few thousand consultants will "hates you forever gollum...gollum" for putting them out of business by your doing so.
Of course Microsoft could just use the elegant Xfce windows manager...nah! Too easy. Too obvious.
Oh yeah...one more thing Microsoft? Ditch the Registry if you're still thinking in that direction? That was yet another "innovation" that never really worked that well in practice. The simple fact that Microsoft itself frequently violated their own guidelines regarding the Registry - and also never fully (publicly) documented it - says all that really needs to be said about it.
What Microsoft needs to do is sit down and code an OS that both works and provides what's needed. Not constantly try to wow people with things they neither want or know how to use. Leave that for your app developers.
8)
P.S. Microsoft - Either bring back stand-alone Flight Simulator or open up the source code for non-commercial use? Do at least something genuinely generous for once? That could be the start of a whole new "genuine advantage."
wraith808:
IMO Windows needs a total ground up redesign, not unlike what Apple did with OS X.
-Vurbal (March 20, 2014, 09:57 AM)
--- End quote ---
I don't trust Microsoft to do it well.
Vurbal:
One was convincing individuals to license Office rather than buying it.
-Vurbal (March 20, 2014, 09:57 AM)
--- End quote ---
To be honest, IMO that's the only part of their new business model that makes even small sense within an admittedly limited number of use cases. Where it fits, it fits very well. For the rest of us...uh...I doesn't.
-40hz (March 20, 2014, 11:12 AM)
--- End quote ---
And there certainly are use scenarios where it makes a lot of sense. Enterprise licensing isn't particularly cost effective if you're just looking at the cost of the software itself but combined with management and maintenance efficiencies it can be a significant bargain. Likewise if you include good support, and my experience with Microsoft's enterprise support was always good, it can also be a good value for many consumers.
Attempting to create a walled garden isn't something that's going to be tolerated willingly. Especially now that enough developers have seen what Apple's iStore arrangement got them. One locked platform is bad enough. If Microsoft thinks to follow in Steve Jobs footsteps, they'll have a long uphill battle ahead of them. And at this juncture, they really can't afford to get into one.
--- End quote ---
What Steve Ballmer and Steven Sinofsky completely missed was that Apple's walled garden wasn't a feature per se. It was something their customers are okay with because it adds to the overall experience of iOS. The reason Apple users are willing to accept their tight control over third party software is the superior out of the box experience for pretty much all their devices, from desktops and laptops down to smartphones and set-top boxes. It's not better for everyone, certainly not for me, but if what you mostly need is "it just works" it definitely is.
The Win 8 desktop brings nothing of significance to the mix. It's different for the sake of different, ugly to look at, and makes little sense without a touchscreen. To call it an improvement over the past is like saying Alcatraz was better than Levinworth Penitentiary because at least Alcatraz is in California and by the ocean. Microsft has to get off the way of thinking that says "Now sucks less!" is the same thing as "New and Improved!" when it comes to product design. (And while we're on the subject...could Microsoft please hire at least one designer who has some sense of color esthetics? Because whoever came up with that Fisher-Price color palette for Windows 8 either needs an eye exam- or a new job. Preferably in the fast food or hospitality industry.)
--- End quote ---
Just to be clear, I was referring to the traditional desktop. The Start Screen is obviously a completely different matter. It's arguably the ultimate object lesson to explain the philosophy of making everything as simple as possible, but not simpler. It's not just that their design team doesn't seem to have had anyone with actual UI expertise, or at least no one they were listening to. Puking the Start Menu up as a flat list on the Start Screen has to be one of the most monumentally retarded design blunders of all time.
IMO Windows needs a total ground up redesign, not unlike what Apple did with OS X.
-Vurbal (March 20, 2014, 09:57 AM)
--- End quote ---
Oh yeah...one more thing Microsoft? Ditch the Registry if you're still thinking in that direction? That was yet another "innovation" that never really worked that well in practice. The simple fact that Microsoft itself frequently violated their own guidelines regarding the Registry - and also never fully (publicly) documented it - says all that really needs to be said about it.
--- End quote ---
I already mentioned this but it really can't be over emphasized. If you sit down and try to detail the problems in Windows you'll find that the registry is an integral part of nearly every one. More importantly it's an integral part of why they can't fix them without starting from scratch.
What Microsoft needs to do is sit down and code an OS that both works and provides what's needed. Not constantly try to wow people with things they neither want or know how to use.
--- End quote ---
The really frustrating thing for me is I know they have the in-house expertise to do just that. It's purely a question of whether their management has the vision or will to walk away from short term revenue and bet on the future. If they wait until that revenue stream dries up they likely won't have the necessary financial reserves to accomplish it. Waiting until you're desperate to take chances is an almost surefire recipe for failure.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version