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Google: Gmail users shouldn't expect email privacy

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wraith808:
The interesting point here is that Americans have always assumed - and the laws previously defaulted - to a presumption of privacy in lieu of notice or explicit laws stating otherwise. That's one of the things that was supposed to be so different about this country.

Our current government is now working overtime to stand that concept on its head and disabuse us of the notion we, as US citizens, are morally and legally entitled to personal privacy.

-40hz (August 16, 2013, 03:37 PM)
--- End quote ---

And *this* is my point.  By conflating the two, we're reducing our rights.  If we don't secure it, then it's OK to look.. and that's not the America that I grew up in.

Jibz:
Much like app103's picture implies, I think it should have been

Email users shouldn't expect email privacy

instead ;D.

app103:
it's not a felony for every postal worker between the mailbox you dropped it into and the recipient to read it.
-app103 (August 16, 2013, 01:55 PM)
--- End quote ---

Actually, I'm pretty sure it is. They've arrested postal workers in the past for reading and rummaging through other people's mail without a warrant to do so.
-40hz (August 16, 2013, 03:37 PM)
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I have not heard of a single case of a postal worker being fired or brought up on charges for reading a postcard, which is a lot different than opening an envelope or package. We are talking about something where the message sits out in the open, usually right next to the destination address. How would one even know the postal worker did or did not look at the message, even if they had a video tape of the incident? How would one know if they only looked at the address or not?

Last I heard if you leave something for your neighbor in their mailbox, that ain't got a stamp on it ... It's a felony. Pretty much anything that involves a mailbox (including kicking one) is considered a felony, because the mailbox itself is considered federal property.
-Stoic Joker (August 16, 2013, 03:47 PM)
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Fine! Let's change my example to hand to hand delivery and keep the post office, postal workers, mailboxes, all federal property and anything related to such, out of it.

And let's change it from an unsealed envelope to a postcard or an unfolded post-it note while we are at it.

Does anyone still expect any privacy or security? Are you about to write down the pin code for your credit cards, the passwords for your web server, or the location and combo for a lock on a box containing $10,000 in cash? Would you even write how much you missed the person at the destination and what sexual acts you plan on performing on them the next time you see them, in full detail?

And if not, then why not?

40hz:
I have not heard of a single case of a postal worker being fired or brought up on charges for reading a postcard, which is a lot different than opening an envelope or package.
-app103 (August 16, 2013, 04:04 PM)
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Apologies. I was talking about a letter.

Does anyone still expect any privacy or security?
-app103 (August 16, 2013, 04:04 PM)
--- End quote ---

I think that asks a bigger question: Why shouldn't we expect it? Seriously.

A lot of the arguments I hear about privacy and security always beg the question that we're somehow "asking for it" for doing the electronic equivalent of walking into a bar with a dress that's a little too short or a blouse that's a little too tight.

I don't buy that, nor do I concede the point that I should have to do anything much other than say "this is not intended for sharing or pubic perusal" and "mind your own business please."

I refuse to accept the argument that a certain level of craven behavior is the norm and absolutely must be expected. Because if I go down that road, then I'd be justifying much of what our government is currently doing and saying. Because their attitude is that we can't be trusted and must always be regulated and monitored and dealt with by those who are "the real Americans" and the "True Patriots."

And cynical as I may be under most circumstances, I still do not accept that attitude, either as a given, or as an unassailable truth.

I make contingency arrangements in the event of the worst. But I still keep hoping for the best. And I'm happy to say people surprise me (in good ways) at least half the time.


         "We can't 'get it together' Piglet. It is together..."

 :)

app103:
I think that asks a bigger question: Why shouldn't we expect it? Seriously.
-40hz (August 16, 2013, 05:07 PM)
--- End quote ---

So, you are saying that in my example of a hand to hand delivered postcard or post-it note, that you would expect privacy and security? You would not expect anyone along the chain to read it, and funny looks from a prudish neighbor that was part of the delivery chain would come as a complete surprise and shock to you, and you would expect the $10,000 in cash to remain perfectly safe, and feel no need to change the pin on your credit cards?

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