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Knight to queen's bishop 3 - Snowden charged with espionage.
TaoPhoenix:
Update: In response to EFF's FOIA lawsuit, the government has released the 2011 FISA court opinion ruling some NSA surveillance unconstitutional.-TaoPhoenix (August 22, 2013, 02:09 AM)
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:huh: ...So...isn't that the same FISA court that was giving - Instead of Just Saying No.. - them the warrants to do the sneaky unconstitutional stuff in the first place?
-Stoic Joker (August 22, 2013, 06:43 AM)
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Yes, though that's why I called it a knight fork, aka a move that creates new avenues in different areas. So by "wiggle", that includes the original permission, casting doubt on the court itself. But it's also an area where indeed the U-Word showed up, and I don't believe they can hold together the argument that the court was "unauthorized to use the U-Word" because that just sinks their whole board position. It's still tight, but they can wiggle the original permission, but this might be the (delayed) answer to that. In other words, they allowed it, running a very tight argument of "you didn't ask if that is even allowed, so we didn't rule on that then".
I'm scrambling the terminology a bit, but it's like they had a "lower court hat" on to do the original permission, then a "high court hat" on the review. But that's just a vague guess. Really, this new ruling makes their side much stickier to "logically" hold. It nudges them close to a tyrannical caricature, which is generally more brittle and one day breaks sooner.
TaoPhoenix:
...Since the constitution is out the window...
-Stoic Joker (August 22, 2013, 12:45 PM)
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See, that's another finesse I was trying to grasp at. It's like we're wandering around Dante's 7 circles of hell. To be sure, the constitution was made into a paper airplane and sent sailing into the rotunda pit in the middle of the circles of hell, but had not in fact landed. (My kingdom for an art work representation editorial cartoon!! Artists?)
See, "Da C Document" was being *ignored*. Pretty badly. But I really am emphasizing that uttering the actual word of "Unconstitutional" brings it out of "Pshaw & hand waving wink-nudge space" into "Dialog space". The first is maybe a 4th circle of hell. Pretty bad. But once the U-Word shows up in an official ruling, only top level courts can use that, and *that* is *very hard* to hand wave away. (They did it last month with the Voting Rights thing, but you see how long that takes). To forcibly override a legit ruling that uses the word "Unconstitutional" is like holding a gun to a mathematician and asking him to divide by zero.
And yes, the Internet is on Snowden's side. Look how fast a random fella like me found this news through one typical news aggregator system. Before even about 2009 this wouldn't have been possible zeitgeist-wise because the Main Media could have squashed it. But the Internet doesn't *quite* get squashed, not at this level.
So now that "We know that they know that we know that they know that we know" etc, the U-Word is here, so they could still be nasty enough to nuts-kick it like Renny likes to say, but they *can't un-do it*.
Stoic Joker:
So now that "We know that they know that we know that they know that we know" etc, the U-Word is here, so they could still be nasty enough to nuts-kick it like Renny likes to say, but they *can't un-do it*.-TaoPhoenix (August 22, 2013, 03:52 PM)
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I hear Ya man...I really do. And maybe I really am just subconsciously trying to defend my "right" to be a stupid lazy American. But I just friggin tired of the ever vigilant necessity to constantly have to fight with some special interest jackass, or aspiring world dictator for the basic rights that this country was (allegedly..?) founded on.
As Ren has said many times: Don't want your rights taken away? Then don't piss on somebody else's. But we have this constant drone of ass-clowns that want to be protected from their own stupidity but constantly and consistently gagging to get more dumb-f***ing laws on the books that serve only to beg to be abused.
Why?!? WTF is wrong with these people??
They just had some crap on the news the other day about a kid that is now "facing charges" because he punched a bully. Pat the kid on the back, commend them for growing a spine and Let. It. GO!!! Because otherwise we're just going to breed yet another useless generation of sniveling idiotic litigious cowards.
IainB:
Hmm. If this (below) is true, then what are the implications?
(Copied below sans embedded hyperlinks/images.)
12 year-old NSA spying system revealed that catches 75 percent of US Internet traffic
August 21st, 2013 by Sarah A. Downey
NSA companiesLooks like the NSA lied.
The Wall Street Journal’s Siobhan Gorman and Jennifer Valentino-Devries broke the story this morning that the NSA’s systems can access about 75% of all Internet traffic in the US. Not only that, but it can save the content of emails and Internet phone calls sent from one US citizen to another.
The revelation contradicts previous NSA statements, including some by NSA Director James Clapper, that the NSA doesn’t intercept the actual contents of emails and other communications, and that the NSA doesn’t intercept purely domestic (US to US) traffic.
The surveillance programs, with whimsical code names including “Blarney, Fairview, Oakstar, Lithium and Stormbrew,” collect and filter information directly from US telecommunications companies, including AT&T and Verizon. Major companies like Cisco, Boeing, and Juniper provide the gear to build the systems.
Similar to PRISM, the spying program Edward Snowden revealed that lets government analysts access data from web companies like Google and Facebook, these programs only work because they integrate directly with wireless and Internet providers. Once again, private companies are demonstrated to power the surveillance that feeds the government.
Clapper NSA memeThe government can spy on people “reasonably believed” to be outside the US, which is a low legal bar and easy standard to meet. But NSA officials admit that many of the communications they intercept and store are actually between US citizens, and thousands of other serious surveillance errors happen each year.
The program is largely secret and regulates itself. Civil rights and privacy activists argue that the NSA should have better, more public oversight.
The fallout from 2013′s “Summer of Snowden” has been widespread. Analysts estimate that newfound distrust in US data companies will cost $180 billion, although privacy companies like us and DuckDuckGo have seen major growth in the number of people using our tools. President Obama’s approval rating has dropped, especially among young voters between 18 and 29. Last week, the President announced plans to reform NSA programs to better protect privacy.
On a final note, you can’t stop the NSA from tracking you, but you can make it harder. Here’s how.
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IainB:
Those undersea (submarine) cables that got snagged by the deep-sea trawlers...
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