Home | Blog | Software | Reviews and Features | Forum | Help | Donate | About us
topbanner_forum
  *

avatar image

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
  • December 04, 2016, 06:16:06 AM
  • Proudly celebrating 10 years online.
  • Donate now to become a lifetime supporting member of the site and get a non-expiring license key for all of our programs.
  • donate

Last post Author Topic: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?  (Read 184236 times)

phitsc

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 1,187
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #775 on: November 09, 2015, 07:58:54 AM »
Communications of the ACM had an interesting article titled 'Bitcoin: Under the Hood' a while back. I found it a very worthwhile read (I knew basically nothing about how Bitcoins work). I'm afraid I can't post it here but you can find it like so (as a pdf):

'bitcoint under the hood Aviv Zohar'

@Renegade
Does that mean by posting that address above you can now no longer do private transactions? or does one usually own multiple addresses? or is there such a thing as private and public addresses?

Concerning addresses: as long as I write down my address (or addresses) somewhere, I can always get back my bitcoins? (even if the machine 'hosting' my wallet dies)
Does one usually install multiple wallets on different machines/devices, all working with the same address? Is it possible to manage / work with multiple addresses using the same wallet?

Renegade

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,220
  • Tell me something you don't know...
    • View Profile
    • Renegade Minds
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #776 on: November 09, 2015, 10:11:04 AM »
@Renegade
Does that mean by posting that address above you can now no longer do private transactions?

Well, if anyone looks at that address, they can see what goes in and out of it. However, that doesn't mean that they know where it comes from, or where it goes.

or does one usually own multiple addresses?

Yes. A wallet contains many addresses. However, once you start getting up into the thousands of addresses, it's a good idea to create a new wallet to "clean out" your old one.


or is there such a thing as private and public addresses?

All addresses that have transactions associated with them are listed on the blockchain. However, that doesn't mean that you know who owns them.

So, it's "pseudononymous" as opposed to anonymous.

e.g. I can create an address and not tell anyone about it, so nobody knows it. However, if I do a transaction with that address, then it is listed on the blockchain, but nobody knows that I own it.


Concerning addresses: as long as I write down my address (or addresses) somewhere, I can always get back my bitcoins? (even if the machine 'hosting' my wallet dies)

Yes and no.

No, because you're describing it the wrong way.

But, yes... with the following qualifications.

You need to write down your private keys -- those will "unlock" your addresses, and then you can always get your bitcoins back.

Make certain to back up your wallet (it contains your private keys) multiple times. You can never be too paranoid. :)



Does one usually install multiple wallets on different machines/devices, all working with the same address?


That's possible, but please, please, please... don't even think about that until much later when you understand everything much, much better. I'm not going to explain any of that because it's just too much to go over.

But yes... it is possible.

The practical answer is "no". You would create multiple wallets with different addresses.

e.g.:

1) "Big" wallet with 100 BTC -- This wallet is offline in "cold storage"
2) Desktop wallet with 5 BTC -- This wallet has a small amount of BTC. It's the equivalent of keeping $2,000 or so in your sock drawer or home safe at home.
3) Mobile wallet with 0.82 BTC -- This is just like your normal wallet that you take with you everywhere. It doesn't have "all" your money/BTC, but it has enough for you to buy gas, groceries, lunch, beer, etc.


Is it possible to manage / work with multiple addresses using the same wallet?

Yes. Wallets actually create new addresses behind the scenes, and you'd never even know that they were there unless you started to dig down deep.

e.g. I have address ABC with 1 BTC in it. I spend 0.4 BTC on something, so that 0.4 BTC goes to Joe's address (XYZ), and the remaining 0.6 BTC goes into a new address in my wallet (DEF) that collects "unspent change".

You can think of "addresses" a bit like "envelopes of money" that you keep in your wallet. Or imagine that your wallet is a magic wallet that can create infinite "pouches" inside of itself with infinite space, kind of like Dr Who's TARDIS.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #777 on: November 09, 2015, 11:35:45 AM »
@Deozzan - Check your wallet. I just sent you about $10 in bitcoins. By the time you see this message, it will be in your wallet.

Wow, thanks!

I only asked that you PM me so that the transaction would be just between you and me.

Bitcoin is "pseudoanonymous". That means that it's not 100% anonymous, but close. As long as nobody knows our addresses, they can't track us.

[...]

Here's an address for me where you can send some just to test:

1F1Eiruf9yzCH49jvjxtajVuzV6mBP3tef

If you privately send me some bitcoins, and then I turn around and send some of it back to one of your public addresses, won't that link your public address to the private addresses, just by following the chain back a bit?

I guess there's a link there, but there's no proof that a payment to that public address came from me unless I publicize the address I'm paying from. And there's no proof who the owners of the other addresses belong to. Right?

But I wonder do the "Full Node" wallets get paid anything - like from the transaction fees - for their troubles (space usage etc.)?

No. They don't get paid anything. It would be nice if they did, even if it was only a satoshi (0.00000001 bitcoins) now and then. But I think that's all down to the trust model. Really the only person who can be trusted to have done what they say they have done is a miner who successfully finds the hash. And that is why whichever miner finds the hash gets the reward. They provide proof (the hash) that they've done the work, and in the work, they include the transaction that gives themselves their reward.

Or at least that's my understanding of it. I could be wrong about some of the details, but I'm pretty sure about the answer to your question: No, nodes do not get paid for their service.


Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #778 on: November 09, 2015, 11:52:25 AM »
I'm confused about transaction fees. I've read that they're completely optional, but I can't figure out how to make a transaction without including transaction fees. Maybe that's because the client I'm using (Bitcoin Core) doesn't allow that? It has an option I've checked to "send as zero-fee transaction if possible" but when I click send the confirmation screen shows the fee added in there automatically anyway.

The fees are fairly minimal. But when I'm only sending a few cents (in USD) anyway to get a feel for how it works, it kinda sucks losing even a penny of it in fees. Feels kind of like handing a dollar bill to a friend, then having him hand it back and it only being worth 98 cents.


tomos

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Posts: 10,315
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #779 on: November 09, 2015, 01:02:25 PM »
I'm confused about transaction fees. I've read that they're completely optional, but I can't figure out how to make a transaction without including transaction fees. Maybe that's because the client I'm using (Bitcoin Core) doesn't allow that? It has an option I've checked to "send as zero-fee transaction if possible" but when I click send the confirmation screen shows the fee added in there automatically anyway.

The fees are fairly minimal. But when I'm only sending a few cents (in USD) anyway to get a feel for how it works, it kinda sucks losing even a penny of it in fees. Feels kind of like handing a dollar bill to a friend, then having him hand it back and it only being worth 98 cents.

still a whole lot better than e.g. paypal ...
Tom

Stoic Joker

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 6,294
    • View Profile
    • www.StoicJoker.com
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #780 on: November 09, 2015, 01:56:46 PM »
Quote from: Stoic Joker on Today at 07:58:43 AMBut I wonder do the "Full Node" wallets get paid anything - like from the transaction fees - for their troubles (space usage etc.)?No. They don't get paid anything.

Shit ... That's what I was afraid of. The more I think about it, it seems like I looked into it back when...and then forgot the answer because it was depressing.


It would be nice if they did, even if it was only a satoshi (0.00000001 bitcoins) now and then.

Right along the same lines I was thinking. Somebody presumably has to be getting to customary 0.0001 satos trans fee...why not the folks processing the transactions.

#! ...That'll teach my to think.

phitsc

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 1,187
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #781 on: November 09, 2015, 02:54:57 PM »
Thanks Renegade! :Thmbsup:

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #782 on: November 09, 2015, 04:44:56 PM »
Somebody presumably has to be getting to customary 0.0001 satos trans fee...why not the folks processing the transactions.

The fee does go to the folks processing the transactions: The miners!


And a bit of a niggle: A satoshi is the smallest unit of bitcoin, which is 0.00000001 bitcoins. The customary transaction fee is ~0.00001 bitcoins.


Stoic Joker

  • Honorary Member
  • Joined in 2008
  • **
  • Posts: 6,294
    • View Profile
    • www.StoicJoker.com
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #783 on: November 09, 2015, 10:46:07 PM »
Somebody presumably has to be getting to customary 0.0001 satos trans fee...why not the folks processing the transactions.

The fee does go to the folks processing the transactions: The miners!

I'm not quite sure that's entirely the case, as there's a fixed number of BTC to mine. So (yes many years in the future), after all the coin has been mined there would be no point in continuing to mine ... So the currency would become worthless because no one would be processing the transactions. Unless there is something else going on in the way of verification ... Got a map of this one Renegade??


And a bit of a niggle: A satoshi is the smallest unit of bitcoin, which is 0.00000001 bitcoins. The customary transaction fee is ~0.00001 bitcoins.

As always customs seem to very, and the wallet default charge I keep running across is ~$0.05 USD or 0.0001 BTC
1000satos.jpg


...Or maybe I just have a knack for getting screwed *Shrug* I don't know..

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #784 on: November 10, 2015, 01:43:57 AM »
Somebody presumably has to be getting to customary 0.0001 satos trans fee...why not the folks processing the transactions.

The fee does go to the folks processing the transactions: The miners!

I'm not quite sure that's entirely the case, as there's a fixed number of BTC to mine. So (yes many years in the future), after all the coin has been mined there would be no point in continuing to mine ... So the currency would become worthless because no one would be processing the transactions. Unless there is something else going on in the way of verification ... Got a map of this one Renegade??

As I understand it, the miner gets the new coin reward which, as you said, is very gradually moving to zero. But the miner also gets the fees from all the transactions included in the block he creates when he successfully mines a new block. This provides incentive for miners to continue mining even when the new coin reward is zero. Right now, since the fee is so small, it's probably an almost negligible incentive for mining, especially when compared to the new coin reward. But someday (again, probably many years/decades in the future) there will be so many daily/hourly transactions happening that the miners will be making much more money from fees than from new coin rewards. The more ubiquitous bitcoin becomes, the more fees will be paid out to miners for their services of verifying all transactions for the rest of us.

Bitcoin absolutely depends on miners always mining, forever! If everybody stopped mining, Bitcoin would die because no new transactions would be verified. Miners are the people who create new blocks for the blockchain, which verifies all transactions inside said blocks.

I recommend reading the original paper on Bitcoin by Satoshi Nakamoto.It will give a brief overview of the overall system and how it works. It's only 9 pages (one of which is cited sources/references) and relatively easy to understand in plain English. I was concerned that it would be above my head since I know little of cryptography and mathematics, but I followed it fairly easily, for the most part.

See especially the second paragraph (found on page 4 of the PDF) in the quote below:

By convention, the first transaction in a block is a special transaction that starts a new coin owned by the creator of the block [the miner]. This adds an incentive for nodes to support the network, and provides a way to initially distribute coins into circulation, since there is no central authority to issue them. The steady addition of a constant of amount of new coins is analogous to gold miners expending resources to add gold to circulation. In our case, it is CPU time and electricity that is expended.

The incentive can also be funded with transaction fees. If the output value of a transaction is less than its input value, the difference is a transaction fee that is added to the incentive value of the block containing the transaction. Once a predetermined number of coins have entered circulation, the incentive can transition entirely to transaction fees and be completely inflation free.

The incentive may help encourage nodes to stay honest. If a greedy attacker is able to assemble more CPU power than all the honest nodes, he would have to choose between using it to defraud people by stealing back his payments, or using it to generate new coins. He ought to find it more profitable to play by the rules, such rules that favour him with more new coins than everyone else combined, than to undermine the system and the validity of his own wealth.

Blockchain.info has some stats for the past 24 hours showing that (as of this edit) 4,025 BTC were mined and ~29.5 BTC in transaction fees were earned by miners. But that's only for ~160,000 transactions. Add a couple zeroes to the end of that number and you can see how it won't be hard for earnings from transaction fees to greatly outweigh new coins being generated, especially since the reward is scheduled to reduce by half next year.

« Last Edit: November 10, 2015, 05:46:44 AM by Deozaan »

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #785 on: November 10, 2015, 05:39:08 AM »
As always customs seem to very, and the wallet default charge I keep running across is ~$0.05 USD or 0.0001 BTC

My primary/only experience with this is from the Bitcoin Core program, which says the minimum fee is 0.01 mBTC/kB, and the recommended fee is 0.052mBTC/kB, which is still roughly half of what you are coming across.

Your 0.1 mBTC fee is roughly ten times as high as the 0.0113 mBTC fee I paid when sending a test payment. :-\

Perhaps because the Bitcoin Core program is a full-node client (meaning it stores and transmits the entire blockchain, therefore improving the P2P network) the transaction fee is lower as a result of providing a bit of a service to the Bitcoin platform? I have no idea if that's correct, but it's the only reason I can think of for the discrepancy in the fees.



By the way, does anyone know what the "kB" means in the fee? What does x BTC/kB mean? A fee of X bitcoins per kilobyte of data transmitted in the transaction?

« Last Edit: November 10, 2015, 05:48:28 AM by Deozaan »

highend01

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #786 on: November 10, 2015, 07:21:42 AM »
Is there any cheap (regarding transaction + exchange fees) and reliable exchange platforms where I can use my paypal account to buy bitcoins? I need about 50$ (orig currency: €) until friday so it shouldn't take to long to approve the payment method. Not something from china if possible... :)
« Last Edit: November 10, 2015, 07:28:19 AM by highend01 »

Renegade

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,220
  • Tell me something you don't know...
    • View Profile
    • Renegade Minds
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #787 on: November 10, 2015, 08:47:17 AM »
@Deozzan - Check your wallet. I just sent you about $10 in bitcoins. By the time you see this message, it will be in your wallet.

Wow, thanks!

You're welcome! Now, go forth, and do transactions~!  ;D

If you privately send me some bitcoins, and then I turn around and send some of it back to one of your public addresses, won't that link your public address to the private addresses, just by following the chain back a bit?

With your empty wallet, yes, but not necessarily if you already have a well-used wallet. Again, wallets can have many addresses, and unless you specifically pick an address to send from, it's more or less random which address (envelope) gets used.


I guess there's a link there, but there's no proof that a payment to that public address came from me unless I publicize the address I'm paying from. And there's no proof who the owners of the other addresses belong to. Right?

Right. :)

I'm not quite sure that's entirely the case, as there's a fixed number of BTC to mine. So (yes many years in the future), after all the coin has been mined there would be no point in continuing to mine ... So the currency would become worthless because no one would be processing the transactions. Unless there is something else going on in the way of verification ... Got a map of this one Renegade??

Yep!

Every 4 years (about) the reward for miners halves. So, while it is 25 BTC per block now, in a bit it will be 12.5 BTC.

There is a soft limit on the number of miners out there. This is going to be a bit difficult for some people to grasp, but it really is very, very simple. Here goes...

Miners mine for rewards. This is critically important.

Miners mine for rewards. It bears repeating.

The reward for finding a block has a value.

The cost to find a block has a value.

As the cost to find a block approaches the value of the reward, more miners will begin to stop mining. As it goes above, there will be a sharp cut-off of miners who stop, i.e. Only professional miners that have planned for this scenario will continue, along with amateur miners who are simply in it for fun on a small scale.

So, that is the "soft limit" on how much mining is done.

But that only explains the block reward partially.

In addition to the block reward, miners also receive transaction fees for finding a block.

As Bitcoin becomes more popular, there will be more transactions, and more fees. So you can imagine the declining reward as a \ line on a graph, and the increasing transaction fees as a / on a graph. Exactly how those plot doesn't particularly matter. (See below.)

What will happen is that even when the block reward reaches zero, the transaction fees will have long ago surpassed the block reward in terms of value.

So the intersection of those two lines on the graph represents the point in time when the transaction fees become larger than the block reward.

Hence, a block reward of zero reaches zero importance in terms of value to miners.

I'm confused about transaction fees. I've read that they're completely optional, but I can't figure out how to make a transaction without including transaction fees. Maybe that's because the client I'm using (Bitcoin Core) doesn't allow that? It has an option I've checked to "send as zero-fee transaction if possible" but when I click send the confirmation screen shows the fee added in there automatically anyway.

The fees are fairly minimal. But when I'm only sending a few cents (in USD) anyway to get a feel for how it works, it kinda sucks losing even a penny of it in fees. Feels kind of like handing a dollar bill to a friend, then having him hand it back and it only being worth 98 cents.


That's because Bitcoin is transparent, where dollars, euro, and other fiat currencies are opaque.

Don't think in terms of $$$ or BTC. That's always the wrong way to think about things. The value XYZ is an arbitrary number that could mean anything.

Instead, think of $$$ or BTC in terms of **PURCHASING POWER**. That is the real measure that we should think of.

So, if I give you $1 today, in 1 year you have $0.92~$0.97 (about) in terms of actual purchasing power thanks to inflation.

(The central banks aim at 2% inflation per year, but they are failing miserably.)

But, it's worse than that.

If you take your (let's say) $0.95 and go to purchase anything using your credit or debit card or Paypal, etc., there are transaction fees. Those can be as low as 2.5% (sometimes lower, but it depends - they can also be much higher). So, assuming 2.5%, the $1 I gave you gets you $0.92625 of purchasing power.

And that assumes that you don't carry a balance on your credit card, which can easily have an interest rate of 30% or more.

And that doesn't even get into Quantitative Easing... The inflation rate is currently being artificially surpressed because all the central banks are engaged in QE. That is, all the major fiat currencies are being devalued (debased) at the same time, giving it the appearance that inflation isn't as bad as it actually is. If/when the bubble goes pop, it's going to be devastating.

The example to look at is the Swiss Franc. A while back the Swiss decoupled the Swiss Franc from the euro. Previously, it had been pegged to the euro. The unpegging sent the franc soaring by 30% against the euro (and other currencies).

That was a major event in terms of what it showed, although it was rather small in scale as Switzerland is a small country. If that happened to the Chinese RMB, the Japanese JPY, or the USD, it would be a global bloodbath.

Anyways... the small transaction fee in bitcoin transactions is extremely tiny. The only difference is that you can see it and that nothing is hidden from you.

If you could readily see the cost of using fiat currencies, you would be horrified.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2005
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,220
  • Tell me something you don't know...
    • View Profile
    • Renegade Minds
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #788 on: November 10, 2015, 08:49:18 AM »
Is there any cheap (regarding transaction + exchange fees) and reliable exchange platforms where I can use my paypal account to buy bitcoins? I need about 50$ (orig currency: €) until friday so it shouldn't take to long to approve the payment method. Not something from china if possible... :)

People ask that all the time. I don't know the answer, but I do have "an" answer.

Try Localbitcoins.

https://localbitcoins.com/

I think that's probably the best way to get smaller amounts of bitcoins.

You can also check to see if there is a Bitcoin ATM near you.
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

highend01

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #789 on: November 10, 2015, 02:09:50 PM »
Thanks Renegade.

Unfortunately Localbitcoins doesn't provide any options to buy bitcoins via paypal here in my area...

Anyone interested in a personal exchange? I'd pay 44$ via paypal to get back 40$ in bitcoins (10% fee).

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #790 on: November 10, 2015, 03:39:06 PM »
Thanks Renegade.

Unfortunately Localbitcoins doesn't provide any options to buy bitcoins via paypal here in my area...

Anyone interested in a personal exchange? I'd pay 44$ via paypal to get back 40$ in bitcoins (10% fee).

How soon do you need it? I'd be willing to go through the effort of buying some bitcoins, but I'm not sure how soon I could get them. I'm checking out Localbitcoins.com right now.


Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #791 on: November 10, 2015, 03:41:39 PM »
I'm confused about transaction fees. I've read that they're completely optional, but I can't figure out how to make a transaction without including transaction fees. Maybe that's because the client I'm using (Bitcoin Core) doesn't allow that? It has an option I've checked to "send as zero-fee transaction if possible" but when I click send the confirmation screen shows the fee added in there automatically anyway.

The fees are fairly minimal. But when I'm only sending a few cents (in USD) anyway to get a feel for how it works, it kinda sucks losing even a penny of it in fees. Feels kind of like handing a dollar bill to a friend, then having him hand it back and it only being worth 98 cents.

That's because Bitcoin is transparent, where dollars, euro, and other fiat currencies are opaque.

[...]

Anyways... the small transaction fee in bitcoin transactions is extremely tiny. The only difference is that you can see it and that nothing is hidden from you.

I understand that the transaction fee is very small and how great that is compared to our current systems (PayPal, credit cards, etc.). But my question still remains:

I've read/heard that they're completely optional, but I can't figure out how to make a transaction without including transaction fees. Are transaction fees optional or aren't they?


highend01

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #792 on: November 10, 2015, 03:42:45 PM »
@Deozaan

I could wait 'til saturday.

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #793 on: November 10, 2015, 03:54:11 PM »
@Deozaan

I could wait 'til saturday.

Looking at Localbitcoin, there's only one user in my area willing to sell bitcoins for cash, and the exchange rate isn't favorable. He's selling them for anywhere between $40-$80 over the current value (as per Blockchain.info.

It's one of the downsides to living out in the boonies... Adoption of the latest tech-related stuff tends to lag behind.


highend01

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2011
  • **
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #794 on: November 10, 2015, 04:03:25 PM »
Quote
e's selling them for anywhere between $40-$80 over the current value
Crazy...

Anyone else that can sell me ~40$ in bitcoins?

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #795 on: November 10, 2015, 04:38:16 PM »
Quote
selling them for anywhere between $40-$80 over the current value
Crazy...

Anyone else that can sell me ~40$ in bitcoins?

To be fair, he probably listed them at the price they were a couple of days ago. Right now BTC is steadily dropping in value compared to the USD. It's gone down about $10 since I started looking for ways to buy BTC locally (about an hour).

I'm still trying to find other ways to get some bitcoins at a fair exchange rate.


Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #796 on: November 10, 2015, 04:46:46 PM »
or does one usually own multiple addresses?

Yes. A wallet contains many addresses. However, once you start getting up into the thousands of addresses, it's a good idea to create a new wallet to "clean out" your old one.

How do you do this? Just send all your bitcoins to a new wallet? Wouldn't that essentially link all those addresses to one address (the new one) all at once?


Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #797 on: November 10, 2015, 05:14:55 PM »
Anyone else that can sell me ~40$ in bitcoins?

I'm still trying to find other ways to get some bitcoins at a fair exchange rate.

I just signed up for Coinbase and told them all my darkest secrets to verify my identity, only to find out that if I try to purchase some bitcoins right now, the soonest the BTC will be available to me will be next Tuesday. :(

EDIT: I added a credit card and now I can buy $25 of BTC instantly, once per week. Still not quite good enough. :(

« Last Edit: November 10, 2015, 05:22:19 PM by Deozaan »

4wd

  • Supporting Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • **
  • Posts: 4,473
    • View Profile
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #798 on: November 10, 2015, 08:29:56 PM »
Just signed up with CoinJar to have a play, here's their current exchange rate based on current Bitcoin.info @ US$317.80 = 1BTC

2015-11-11 13_21_40.pngDoes anyone here use Bitcoins?

Let's me link my bank account (AU or UK) to direct convert ... now if only I had some money in it  ;D

Their Hedge option looks particularly interesting since BTC is currently dropping.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2015, 08:00:02 PM by 4wd »

Deozaan

  • Charter Member
  • Joined in 2006
  • ***
  • Points: 1
  • Posts: 7,713
    • View Profile
    • The Blog of Deozaan
    • Read more about this member.
    • Donate to Member
Re: Does anyone here use Bitcoins?
« Reply #799 on: November 10, 2015, 09:46:04 PM »
I was fascinated by the concept of the proof-of-work that miners have to do, so I started working on a little test of something of my own:

Spoiler
I wrote something similar to what I understand the Bitcoin mining requirements to be. This is not mining real bitcoins. It's just a simulation of mining Deocoins!

Started mining with a goal average time of 5 seconds (5000ms) to find each hash:

Hash 1 found: 01D2FB457E9A3CB81B582DD05FEC877B174D6C4A8C9D31C4717A3ACA351D5CC6
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.0037843 (avg: 3ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 39
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 2 found: 00F1713C3A00FCE197B141F47069520962FBF251F33049CE5091A486B3617E90
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.0019995 (avg: 2ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 67
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 3 found: 0007A6C794B9D7D9006777DC9F66EDDC8E48D688CB28B5A87C1D3F8FCC4C0661
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.1313240 (avg: 45ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 3935
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 4 found: 00009BFFF5E31A1915CB3CFF8BDDDBA61E744173810299FE51B0C98F46EFE2EE
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.7161587 (avg: 212ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 19862
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 5 found: 000009E43D1C4C1862F8A3B314C07353E8438444C288E8AB951A7D3D9F50F809
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:28.9602109 (avg: 5962ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 815994
Decreasing difficulty.

Hash 6 found: 0000ADB894B73D247FEB7DF8714362ECEFC280AD619CFBFC01CF00668009C8C6
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:01.0944133 (avg: 5150ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 31145
Decreasing difficulty.

Hash 7 found: 0002CE61B2BA3AFD0E917426DBAEA5C528F64B06BABDD662EAF9D7831DADABFC
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.1992439 (avg: 4443ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 5706
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 8 found: 0000BC18227D8857A7095DAD44AAE2142FAD4F3EED1E5E23F5EF93B595B7ACCB
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:02.4294819 (avg: 4191ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 68096
Increasing difficulty.

Hash 9 found: 000000450668CB46307CFAACE4CEFA5B5AEF34C4C359C49CB7EA2DD7331EDFFF
Time taken to find hash: 00:00:00.5069369 (avg: 3782ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 14226
Increasing difficulty.

It has been working on hash #10 for quite a long time now, so far with no luck.

EDIT: It finally found hash #10. The reason it took so long was because 1) it was difficult to find and 2) while I was waiting for it to find it, I  did other things with my computer, and the application was set to pause if it didn't have focus. When I finally realized my mistake, I changed it so it wouldn't pause when not focused and it finally found the result a few minutes later:

Hash 10 found: 00000015BF4EC882AAF49DF77830131A0CD1BF6C65BD94ED9C8D273B398A3DF8
Time taken to find hash: 01:42:02.7429996 (avg: 615678ms)
Number of hashes attempted to find this one: 19,381,467
Decreasing difficulty


« Last Edit: November 10, 2015, 11:05:07 PM by Deozaan »