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Last post Author Topic: instant linux on winxp  (Read 14202 times)

kalos

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instant linux on winxp
« on: September 02, 2012, 08:48:45 PM »
hello!

I want to have a linux OS on my winxp, without a boot live cd or something, just as I run a portable app or it would still be ok if I have to install it

it must be 100% functional and I should be able to install and work with any linux app

any hint?

thanks!

ewemoa

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2012, 09:04:31 PM »
Have you considered the likes of virtualbox, vmware, and such?

Renegade

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2012, 09:14:05 PM »
Have you considered the likes of virtualbox, vmware, and such?

+1

That's about the easiest way.

You can download LOTS of different Linux distros at the VMware site and use the VMware Player for free.

However, you need to have memory and CPU to use a VM. If not, a live CD/USB boot is probably better.
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Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

40hz

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2012, 10:24:07 PM »
Take a look at Wubi.

No need for disks, keys. or virtual machines. Wubi installs Ubuntu inside Windows where it can run like any other app.

Get it here.

ewemoa

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2012, 10:35:22 PM »
Does Wubi have a mode of operation that works while Windows is running?

From the Wikipedia page:

  "Wubi adds an entry to the Windows boot menu which allows the user to run Linux."

My memory of its operation was that it required a choice at boot time.  May be I missed something or things have changed?

Josh

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2012, 11:10:41 PM »
WUBI runs a Linux install off of an existing Windows partition. You have to BOOT into the OS.

ewemoa

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2012, 05:13:30 AM »
Thanks for the clarification.  I think then that Wubi may not fit:

Quote
I want to have a linux OS on my winxp, without a boot live cd or something, just as I run a portable app or it would still be ok if I have to install it

Or may be I'm missing something.

NigelH

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2012, 07:13:43 AM »
Kalos, you didn't mention "fast" nor exactly what you want to run on Linux

So, Qemu may be able to run some Linux distro/app that you want - very slowly though.
Perhaps Bochs as well

Here's a Qemu example to run Puppy Running Linux on Windows Like Normal Programs
(Edit: looks like it is a really old article - may still be of relevance/interest though)


If your CPU supports KVM, you may have a better chance of success (performance wise) . See What_do_I_need_to_use_KVM
Quote
You will need an x86 machine running a recent Linux kernel on an Intel processor with VT (virtualization technology) extensions, or an AMD processor with SVM extensions (also called AMD-V).
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 07:19:57 AM by NigelH »

tomos

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2012, 08:42:31 AM »
You can download LOTS of different Linux distros at the VMware site and use the VMware Player for free.

note (in case) - the latest VMWare player (5) is not free for commercial use
(I dont know was the previous version or not, there seems to be a lot of confusion).
http://communities.v...read/415383?tstart=0

It's very weird - in order to use it commercially, you have to buy Fusion - which is a Mac programme....
Tom

40hz

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #9 on: September 03, 2012, 12:53:45 PM »
Thanks for the clarification.  I think then that Wubi may not fit:

Quote
I want to have a linux OS on my winxp, without a boot live cd or something, just as I run a portable app or it would still be ok if I have to install it

Or may be I'm missing something.

Guess I misunderstood the request. :-[

Ok...if you want simultaneous OS instances (one being Windows, the other Linux) then the only way to do it AFAIK is by using some species of virtual machine.

There is a Linux variant called Cooperative Linux that incorporates an unusual flavor of VM into the distro itself to make this happen. Cooperative Linux has spawned a few remixes, the most well known being andLinux..

Quote
andLinux is a complete Ubuntu Linux system running seamlessly in Windows 2000 based systems (2000, XP, 2003, Vista, 7; 32-bit versions only). This project was started for Dynamism for the GP2X community, but its userbase far exceeds its original design. andLinux is free and will remain so, but donations are greatly needed.

andLinux uses coLinux as its core which is confusing for many people. coLinux is a port of the Linux kernel to Windows. Although this technology is a bit like running Linux in a virtual machine, coLinux differs itself by being more of a merger of Windows and the Linux kernel and not an emulated PC, making it more efficient. Xming is used as X server and PulseAudio as sound server.

andLinux is not just for development and runs almost all Linux applications without modification.

The Cooperative Linux website can be found here. Latest version was released late December of last year.

The andLinux website can be found here.

Can't vouch for how well these work since I'm already quite happy using VMware for this sort of thing so I've never personally tried either. But if you want side-by-side Linux and Windows, and you're feeling adventurous, one of these might be the  ticket.
 8)
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 01:00:01 PM by 40hz »

uliandim

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2012, 03:53:54 PM »
I am using VMWare Workstation for this purpose... So you can get it from here.

kalos

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2012, 04:24:30 PM »
I downloaded the VMWare Player (free)
what do I do next to have an ubuntu (preferably xfce)?

40hz

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2012, 05:09:43 PM »
I downloaded the VMWare Player (free)
what do I do next to have an ubuntu (preferably xfce)?

Download the Xubuntu CD, create a virtual machine and install it on that. Or easier, download an Xubuntu virtual appliance and simply run that.

There's tons of how-tos and videos that a quick Google search will spot for you. Most are for Ubuntu proper, but the procedure for installing and running under VMware is the same for all Ubuntu versions.

Example here:



Luck! :Thmbsup:

kalos

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2012, 04:05:45 PM »
I tried that, but it wants me to have at least 20GB free, which I dont :/

is there any other solution for instant linux on winxp?

maybe an online linux?

or a usb live linux? (since I dont have CD player)

40hz

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2012, 05:00:39 PM »
^Virtually all the major distros can now be launched from a USB key. But you'll still need to boot into it. No way around that without running some sort of VM. The rule is: one operating system per machine. The machine can be real or virtual. But there's nothing that runs two operating systems on a single machine simultaneously. Which makes sense, because if you think about it, an instance of an OS is the machine. The computer isn't the hardware. That's just a technical detail. The computer is the software that's running.

Fortunately, Linux generally boots up much faster than Windows does. So unless you're hopping back and forth every 20 minutes it shouldn't be that big a deal.

Here's how to do put it on a key to run Xubuntu 12.04

It's very easy and no optical drive is needed. Download the iso and the Universal USB Installer app. Just follow  the directions in the how-to link above.  8) :Thmbsup:
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 05:14:09 PM by 40hz »

skwire

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #15 on: September 04, 2012, 05:20:18 PM »
I tried that, but it wants me to have at least 20GB free, which I dont :/

Just because it says it wants 20GB doesn't mean you have to give it 20GB.  Did you try it with a smaller amount?

kalos

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #16 on: September 04, 2012, 05:39:14 PM »
I tried that, but it wants me to have at least 20GB free, which I dont :/

Just because it says it wants 20GB doesn't mean you have to give it 20GB.  Did you try it with a smaller amount?

but I can only give it 1GB, will it work?

@40hz
thanks for the great info! btw, is there a ready to deploy usb ubuntu image file to just extract it to a usb and make it work?
UPDATE: unfortunately this requires me to boot from USB stick
isnt there a way to have it in a usb stick and run it from there while I am on winxp?
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 05:48:05 PM by kalos »

40hz

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2012, 05:50:53 PM »
UPDATE: unfortunately this requires me to boot from USB stick
isnt there a way to have it in a usb stick and run it from there while I am on winxp?

AFAIK...no

Sorry. :(

re: System Requirements for Xubuntu

Quote
Minimum system requirements

To install or try Xubuntu within the Desktop/Live CD, you need 256 MB of memory. Installing with the Alternative CD requires only 64 MB. Once installed, it is strongly recommended to have at least 512 MB of memory, but you can run with 256 MB too.

When you install Xubuntu from the Desktop CD, you need 4.4 GB of free space on your hard disk. The Alternate Install CD only requires you to have 2 GB of free space on your hard disk.

Shades

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #18 on: September 05, 2012, 08:06:15 AM »
PortableUbuntu

You will still need to clear up some space on your hard disk, but that one allows you to run Ubuntu and Windows XP at the same time. If memory serves me right, it requires 2GByte of hard disk space. Unfortunately it is not maintained anymore, and the original site is not available anymore, but you can still download it from the link above.

Not sure if it comes with Ubuntu 7 or 8, but you can update it to the latest version 12 using Ubuntu's own update system. Will take a while and a lot of downloading though. this one is also usable from a pen drive/USB stick. Actually, it can really help with eradicating malware from a Windows PC as you can delete Windows files with PortableUbuntu that are normally inaccessible through Windows.

As always I end with the warning that one has to be careful with software like this, it is easy to make an error in areas of the Windows OS that only a re-installation can repair. 


Paul Keith

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #19 on: September 05, 2012, 09:16:35 AM »
I'm surprised QemuPuppy didn't work for you.

It's been awhile since I tried it but it is the most thought free Linux OS I've ever tried.

No knowledge required. Not even what resources to cut when a virtualized window is open. Just copy paste to usb and click like a regular portable app.

kalos

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #20 on: September 05, 2012, 11:39:52 AM »
I'm surprised QemuPuppy didn't work for you.

It's been awhile since I tried it but it is the most thought free Linux OS I've ever tried.

No knowledge required. Not even what resources to cut when a virtualized window is open. Just copy paste to usb and click like a regular portable app.

it sounds very nice

however I need ubuntu
basically, I wont to run some linux programs, which I know they run in ubuntu
if I can be sure they will run the same way in QemuPuppy, it would be fine!

Paul Keith

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #21 on: September 05, 2012, 11:59:36 AM »
Don't quote me on this but:

Quote
Lucid Puppy is dubbed Woof and it is fully compatible with the Ubuntu software repositories, allowing users to install any application or package that is available in the Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid Lynx) operating system.

http://news.softpedi...u-10-04-176685.shtml

It's actually old puppy news and is still not as Windows user friendly as possible to test but an average Linux user would probably find it simple enough to understand. It just really depends whether you consider Ubuntu's programs to really be Ubuntu native apps and how rare are the software we're talking about here. Plus Qemu is still Qemu and Puppy is still Puppy. It's not going to look like Ubuntu even if you can put the software in it.

http://bkhome.org/woof/index.html

Quote
For a long time I have dreamt of a "magical script" that could download packages of some other distro, cut them right down to Puppy-size, then build a Puppy Linux live-CD -- and do all of this totally automatically.

 Finally free of front-line responsibility for managing the Puppy project, I had time to pursue this dream. The result is Woof.

 This is what Woof does:

Download another distros packages, so we don't have to host them anywhere (although in some cases the distro may not have a suitable package so we still need some of our own PET packages).

Totally automatially build a Puppy live-CD iso file, with your choice of packages.

Totally automatically build the 'devx' SFS file (which is how Puppy provides support for C/C++/Vala/Genie/Fortran compiling).

Support multiple distros.

Easily upgrade to a new version.

The end result is Puppy Linux

f0dder

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2012, 07:08:12 AM »
I'm using a 8gig virtual disk for my XUbuntu 12.04 VM (which I use for web-banking, and other things that require the scandalous NemID system). That's even slightly overkill, since the installed system uses about 3.8gig. The VM is only used for those web-based things, though, so doesn't have a lot of extras installed (but then again, even XUbuntu comes with a relatively fat base package).
- carpe noctem

Paul Keith

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2012, 09:19:07 AM »
Can you expand more on how it helps you with web-banking?

f0dder

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Re: instant linux on winxp
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2012, 09:38:48 AM »
Can you expand more on how it helps you with web-banking?
Certainly.

First, let's get the obvious out of the way: it doesn't help a whole lot if the host machine has been compromised. With that out of the way...

The above-mentioned NemID has been shoved down our throats. It was commissioned by the big financial interests, and being run by a private (and, it unfortunately seems, darn incompetent) company. If it was just a banking system, it would be kinda OK - at least it offers two-factor authentication. BUT:

1) it's becoming mandatory for interacting with the government - so it should be classified as critical infrastructure (yet still being run by a private company, and iirc hosted by a company owned by a US company... patriot act...)
2) it's used for digital signature stuff. While technically there's cryptographic certificates involved, they're stored in escrow, giving us no control over them. While this might be safer than having a password-protected keyfile for 99% of the Danish population, it's scary that we have no alternative.
3) not only does NemID require a Java plugin (keep in mind how many security holes Java has had over the years), it has a signed Java applet that's really just a boostrapper, which downloads an unsigned java applet at runtime... and this unsigned applet contains native libraries invoked via JNI.
4) the company behind is extremely arrogant, having claimed that any possible attacks were purely theoretic, etc. Didn't take long before we saw the first real-world MITM attacks against it.
5) <tinfoil-hat>being shoved down our throats, and designed how it is, it would be the perfect trojan-launching vessel for the PET.</tinfoil-hat>

So yeah, I definitely want to keep that piece of crap contained in a VM. Also means I can keep the Java plugin out of the browser I use for everyday stuff, and thus be a helluva lot safer in general browsing. Just like my main browser, the one in the VM also has AdBlockPlus+NoScript+Certificate Patrol+Ghostery - and it's only used for web-banking and other NemID-requiring sites.
- carpe noctem