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Author Topic: Staple of people from State and Europe !  (Read 9244 times)
Renegade
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« Reply #25 on: August 09, 2012, 02:31:07 AM »

Kangaroo tacos last night (and the night before -- I make enough for 2 days) and now pasta & kangaroo sauce~! tongue Nom nom nom nom nom~! tongue

This is my kangaroo pasta sauce from a few weeks ago that I'd meant to post before:



It really is a heck of a lot nicer than beef.
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« Reply #26 on: August 09, 2012, 04:18:34 AM »

Seems processed wheat products in any form is bad:

http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/2012/08/

http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf

Ska
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« Reply #27 on: August 09, 2012, 06:09:25 AM »

Kangaroo tacos last night (and the night before -- I make enough for 2 days) and now pasta & kangaroo sauce~! tongue Nom nom nom nom nom~! tongue

This is my kangaroo pasta sauce from a few weeks ago that I'd meant to post before:
 (see attachment in previous post)
It really is a heck of a lot nicer than beef.

You guys eat a lot of your transportation devices don't ya  Grin
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« Reply #28 on: August 09, 2012, 07:00:32 AM »

Quote
Yes, I'm amazed that with all that weight up there, the USA hasn't slid down the face of the planet and become the new land "down under".  tongue

It's because we're the most decadent, lazy society on Earth. And, the mentality of the dining-out (and -in, for that matter) American public is "you call that a full portion!?" When it comes to food portions, Americans tend to have a Texan attitude. We want it 'bigger and better'. Not to disparage the dedicated minority of US citizens who take their health seriously and even ... *shudder* ... exercise regularly.
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« Reply #29 on: August 09, 2012, 07:01:19 AM »

Ren, can I have the Kangaroo Taco recipe?
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« Reply #30 on: August 09, 2012, 08:05:03 AM »

Ren, can I have the Kangaroo Taco recipe?

I'll take a picture & post it next time. We usually have it once every week or two.

So, let's hop on that recipe~! Grin

Ingredients:

  • Kangaroo
  • Water
  • Taco seasoning
  • Avocado
  • Sour cream
  • Bell peppers (green, red, yellow, whatever)
  • Onions (yellow and red are nice)
  • Coriander
  • Iceberg lettuce
  • Tomato

Take 500 grams of kangaroo mince (hamburger) and put it in the fry pan. Do NOT turn on the heat yet. Add the taco seasoning (1 package) and about 200 ml of water (this is the secret ingredient to wicked amazing taco meat - sounds dumb, but it works) on top. Next, mix the water, meat, and seasoning all together. Make sure to chop the meat up and kneed it all together (this is particularly important for beef). Now, turn on the heat to medium. Do NOT turn it on high as high heat destroys nutritional value, and doesn't cook nearly as nice. Ideally, keep the heat as low as possible. It takes longer, but it's worth it. Stir while cooking until the water is half to mostly gone. This is a matter of taste, and more water simply makes it juicier. Don't overcook it and make it dry though.

Kangaroo is very different from beef though. It's much leaner and softer. It takes a bit more time to kneed the meat and water together compared to beef, which tends to soak up the water much easier. The freaky thing is that it's leaner, organic, healthier, and half the price of beef! I really see no reason to buy beef at all anymore since I finally discovered just how great kangaroo is. Healthier and half the price? And it's nicer meat to eat? Very tender!

I'll also sometimes use a few twists of fresh black pepper, or use some black pepper essential oil. (The black pepper essential oil I use is therapeutic grade (Young Living), and not just a nice smell. These kinds of oils can be used in cooking, but I wouldn't use some no-name brand as many cut their oils and god knows what's in it -- they're not meant for eating, etc.) Black pepper cuts down on the smell of the meat, which is needed more for beef, but kangaroo has its own smell too. (In pasta sauce, I use oregano or basil essential oil as well.) Oh, if you do use essential oil, it's measured in drops - like 1, 2, 3. Not much at all.

I tried putting in a few drops of lime juice the other night -- it worked really well! Not a lot, but just enough to blend in and give the meat a bit more zest. (I'm continually experimenting.)

That lasts for 2 meals for 2 people. If we don't have tacos the next night, the meat is good for pasta sauce.

For the taco seasoning, check the packages when you buy them. Some are 1/4 or 1/3 sugar! The ones we use are 5% (4.7% actually) and sometimes 10% sugar. I've never seen any with less sugar than 4.7%. I still need to learn how to make this myself. Same goes for taco sauce.

For the rest, I chop up an avocado and put that in a bowl. Probably around 150 grams of sour cream in another bowl. These generally last for 1 meal. You can really do a lot more here though. My wife likes them separate, so I don't go all out and make guacamole by mixing the two and seasoning them. 

On the veggie side, coriander (cilantro), green & red bell peppers (capsicum), 1 small onion (yellow/cooking), 1 small red salad onion (or other sweet onion), 2~4 leaves of iceberg lettuce, 1 medium sized tomato - all diced either finely or coarsely to taste - we generally go with a medium dice. For the lettuce, I chop it into diamonds - across the grain, then diagonally - this makes it easier to put on the tacos. Chopping it in thin strands doesn't quite work as well, but whatever works for you. For the coriander, I like to chop it up stems and all, and a bit finer as it's so leafy that you kind of need it to be a bit finer to easily put it in your taco.

We're using pickled jalapenos as my wife doesn't really like hot food all that much, and fresh ones are a bit hot for her. I like fresh jalapenos, but... If you want to "cool down" fresh jalapenos, just take the seeds out. Jalapenos aren't really all that hot compared to some other peppers.

Also, my wife isn't all that keen on cheese, so we don't use any. Most people would have cheese, and probably cheddar or colby.

We just buy shells though. Sometimes I get wraps as well as I like them, but often can't eat the whole package before they go stale. I like the stand up shells as they are easier to deal stuff, and you can put more in there! tongue

For taco sauce, we're using store bought. I still need to learn how to make taco sauce and how to preserve it well enough as we can't go through a gallon of the stuff all that quickly between the two of us.

If we don't have tacos as left-overs, I throw out the lettuce and use the rest in pasta sauce. There, it's just meat, veggies, a bottle of (usually organic) pasta sauce, a bottle of passatta (tomato sauce), etc. etc. Slow cooked. It's always better the second day though. The first day is fine, but the second day the flavours have blended much better and it tastes MUCH better.


We tend to eat tacos a lot as it is one of the few things that I can competently cook (at the sound of being immodest, I do a good job with tacos - which can't be said for some other things). It's mostly just chopping veggies, which is pretty hard to screw up. tongue cheesy
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« Reply #31 on: August 09, 2012, 08:10:47 AM »

Quote
Yes, I'm amazed that with all that weight up there, the USA hasn't slid down the face of the planet and become the new land "down under".  tongue

It's because we're the most decadent, lazy society on Earth. And, the mentality of the dining-out (and -in, for that matter) American public is "you call that a full portion!?" When it comes to food portions, Americans tend to have a Texan attitude. We want it 'bigger and better'. Not to disparage the dedicated minority of US citizens who take their health seriously and even ... *shudder* ... exercise regularly.

I remember when I was a kid, my parent took my sister and me somewhere in the US. I forget where - we went fairly often as it's only a couple hour drive away from where we lived in Canada. Anyways, we're at some breakfast place, and I'm looking at the menu, and at the prices. And I see that the prices are WAY too low. Even after the exchange rate. So, I figure I'll have the LARGE stack of blueberry waffles. They can't be that large at THAT price...

Wrong. Very wrong.

It was a MASSIVE stack of waffles. Obscene. I think I ate like half or so less.

Totally false advertising. Instead of "large", they should have written "skyscraper". tongue Grin

Portions here are nicely sized.
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« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2012, 08:26:36 AM »

@Ren - it's a vicious circle here in the US. In order to make money running a small restaurant you need to price almost any entree at about $10 per. For dinner that's not a problem. But in order to justify the price for a lunch or breakfast they need to deliver huge servings to make it seem worthwhile to the average customer Small wonder obesity (especially in kids) is a major health issue here...
 undecided
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Renegade
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« Reply #33 on: August 09, 2012, 09:38:23 AM »

@Ren - it's a vicious circle here in the US. In order to make money running a small restaurant you need to price almost any entree at about $10 per. For dinner that's not a problem. But in order to justify the price for a lunch or breakfast they need to deliver huge servings to make it seem worthwhile to the average customer Small wonder obesity (especially in kids) is a major health issue here...
 undecided

Pretty much. Sad It's quite sad. I think part of the problem is that most people just aren't educated at all about food or nutrition. Then, they eat "food-like-products", and not real food. Things get so processed that they, well, that's another rant. smiley

Good food isn't really all that more expensive. Sure, you can buy a 75 g bag of chips/chocolate/sugar for $2 (or whatever), but you can also get a 200 g apple for $1. AND you can eat the packaging! (Well, if you wash it, and better if it's organic...)

If you think about it for a moment, we process food, strip out the nutrients, add in a chemical-shitstorm, then call that "value added" and "good for the economy", and end up selling inferior products for more money!  ohmy tongue Like, on what planet is that sane?

When I was a kid, nutrition education boiled down to exactly this - no more - no less:

<insert_food_name /> is good for you.
<insert_junk_food_name /> is bad for you.

???  tellme

Yeah, like any kid with half a brain will believe that kind of drivel. Ahem... Why? Just bad education.


Seems processed wheat products in any form is bad:

Carbs give me food coma. If I don't want to fall asleep, I can't eat them. Pasta, bread, rice... Sad But I do like them still! smiley (Something that I need to change in my diet, but man... it's hard...)
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« Reply #34 on: August 09, 2012, 09:45:49 AM »

This is kind of OT, but still about food, and totally hilarious~!

http://reason.com/blog/20...g-ban-on-coca-cola-end-of

Quote
Bolivia’s minister of foreign affairs declared last week that December 21, the cyclical end of the Mayan calendar, would usher in a “new era free of capitalism,” and because he is not completely disconnected from reality, he did the media savvy thing and pegged his pronouncement to Coca-Cola, specifically that “December 21 has to be the end of Coca Cola, and the beginning of mocochinchi .”



Coke! Banned in Bolivia!

Can you imagine the illegal Coke trade? tongue
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« Reply #35 on: August 09, 2012, 11:52:00 AM »

Coke! Banned in Bolivia![/b]

Can you imagine the illegal Coke trade?

(Bolivia...as in Bolivian Marching Powder Bolivia?)

Don't you mean the bidirectional Coke trade? They'll be swapping 8balls for a 12-pack (and shit-can both economies) by the time it's over.
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« Reply #36 on: August 09, 2012, 01:17:52 PM »

Kangaroo?  huh You guys actually eat that cutie jumpy animal?

Y U NO Eat house lizards on my wall.  mad
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« Reply #37 on: August 09, 2012, 02:26:58 PM »

Fresh, raw milk has a far higher nutritional content, but is illegal in many places. (I wonder why that is...?)

Because Brucella, Campylobacter, Listeria, Mycobacterium bovis (a cause of tuberculosis), Salmonella, E. coli, Giardia, Shigella, Streptococcus pyogenes, Yersinia enterocolitica, and norovirus are not nice things to end up infected with and steps should be taken to keep them out of our food supply. One way of doing this is the pasteurization of milk.

In the US, from 1998 through 2009, 1,837 people became sick from drinking raw milk, 195 became sick enough to require hospitalization, and 2 died. And that's just the cases that were recognized and reported to the CDC as being caused by raw milk consumption. There were probably many more cases that went unreported.

And raw milk does not have a "far higher" nutritional content. If you need the amount of additional nutrition provided by raw milk, just taking an extra sip of the pasteurized stuff should more than supply it. And if you want that "beneficial bacteria" then just eat a probiotic yogurt made from pasteurized milk...all the beneficial stuff without any of the harmful bacteria, viruses, or parasites.

http://www.cdc.gov/foodsa...-and-answers.html#rawmilk

And historically speaking, Diphtheria was also something that could be acquired by drinking raw milk. And with the number of irresponsible parents that are shunning vaccination out of fear of autism, we could see a return of that disease if unvaccinated children start drinking raw milk.
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« Reply #38 on: August 09, 2012, 03:18:32 PM »

Additionally, we lose our ability to process milk at a very early age.  Our bodies simply do not process it, but pass it through.  Adults get no benefit whatsoever from milk, raw or pasteurized.  Calcium?  Vitamin D?  Not from milk.  It has both, but our bodies cannot extract it.  Folk who are lactose intolerant simply have a greater reaction to it, are more sensitive to it than most, but we all are lactose intolerant insofar as our bodies using milk is concerned.  Just a very little research can validate this if you disbelieve  tongue.  (Had to research this some time back - library stuff, pre-Web - because of remote family problems.)
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« Reply #39 on: August 10, 2012, 05:57:18 AM »

In the US, from 1998 through 2009, 1,837 people became sick from drinking raw milk, 195 became sick enough to require hospitalization, and 2 died.


Hehehehe~! We're in for some fun... Grin


1600 reported cases of Salmonella Enteritidis infections were associated with contaminated shell eggs in 136 days or 0.37 years. Compared to 11 years for the milk example above, that extrapolates (linearly) to 47,235. Outlaw eggs now? (Source: http://www.foodsafety.gov...eep/types/eggs/index.html)

https://en.wikipedia.org/...poisoning#United_States_2

Quote
Each year in the U.S. 31 major food borne pathogens cause 9.4 million cases of food borne illness, 55,961 hospitalizations, and 2612 deaths.

For 11 years, that's 615,571 hospitalizations and 31,344 deaths. Raw milk then accounts for 0.006% there.

30 deaths from eating cantaloupe in 3 months in 2011 in Colorado. Linear extrapolation: 669 times more than raw milk. (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/...eaks_in_the_United_States)


http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/...e/5/5/99-0502_article.htm

Quote
In the United States, foodborne diseases have been estimated to cause 6 million to 81 million illnesses and up to 9,000 deaths each year.

Extrapolating for 11 years, raw milk is responsible for 0.002% of that.

Above yielded 0.006%, and now 0.002%. Close - in the same order of magnitude at least.

http://www.australianfood...ood-poisoning-statistics/

Quote
In the United States, 1 in 3 or 76 million people contract food poisoning annually. That’s 1,461,538 cases per week, 208,219 per day, 8,675 per hour, 144 per minute, 2 per second.

1,837 cases for raw milk is about 167 per year. That's 0.0002% of cases. i.e. For 1 incident of raw milk sickness (not hospitalization or death), there are over 455,000 incidents from other foods.

Some other deaths:

https://en.wikipedia.org/...odborne_illness_incidents

Which include sprouts, cold cuts, peanuts, spinach, meat, green onions, etc. etc.

http://www.cpsc.gov/library/playgrnd.pdf

Quote
From January 1990 through August 2000, CPSC received reports of 147 deaths to children younger than age 15 that involved playground equipment.

Playground deaths are then about 14.7 per year, compared to raw milk at < 0.2 per year.


http://www.colorlines.com...1/killed_by_the_cops.html

Quote
About 9,500 people nationally were killed by police during the years 1980 to 2005–an average of nearly one fatal shooting per day.

At about 1 per day, that's a lot more than 1 every 2,000 or so days. You're more likely to be killed by a cop than raw milk.

Automotive deaths in US from 1999 to 2009 for a direct year-range comparison: 494,056. i.e You are about 250,000 times more likely to die in/from a car. (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/...le_deaths_in_U.S._by_year)


http://www.rightdiagnosis...e/electrocution/stats.htm

Quote
0.63 per million people died from electrocutions in the US 2001 (US Consumer Product Safety)

I'll compare those on 2 lines so that it's a bit easier to see - electrocutions first, then raw milk:

0.63
0.00000000058

That's 9 orders of magnitude. 9. Nine. Orders of magnitude. Wow. Thomas Edison was right! We should make electricity illegal right now~! tongue Damn that Nicola Tesla for tricking us all~! cheesy

I can play this game forever~! cheesy tongue

The case against raw milk is so utterly flimsy and entirely politically based, as to be so far beyond laughable that it's simply stunning.

Your risk of getting sick from raw milk is so infinitesimally small as to be of no significant consequence.

Outlawing raw milk and raiding farmers with goon-squads equiped with fully automatic weapons... Over the top. This is food fascism. The people that need to be arrested are those that trample on other people's freedoms.

The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.

If I want to eat dog, then that's up to me. Not the state. Same for milk.


I could go on and address a lot of other things you mentioned, but have to get going. (I'd love to jump on the nutrition and vaccine thing, but... time... Sad )
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« Reply #40 on: August 10, 2012, 02:33:44 PM »

Your risk of getting sick from raw milk is so infinitesimally small as to be of no significant consequence.
Believe me, if that (getting sick) happened to me, I'd not consider it, "... of no significant consequence."  tongue
Nor, I suspect, did the folk to whom it happened.

The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.
No argument whatsoever.  However, opinion seldom trumps reality  tongue tongue.


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« Reply #41 on: August 10, 2012, 03:09:00 PM »

The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.
I guess this depends a bit on where you live, but around here, the state pays for medical bills. And I don't want to pay the medical bills of the guy who decides to have his every meal at mcdonalds tongue (even though I do have to, since there's nothing stopping this particular example)
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« Reply #42 on: August 11, 2012, 04:48:58 AM »

The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.

They don't. They have never told people what they can and can't eat. You are free to buy your own cow and milk it and drink all the raw milk you want. There is no law in any state in the US that would stop you from consuming raw milk from your own cows.

However, there are laws in a lot of US states that forbid you from selling that milk to other people without it being pasteurized first, and a federal law that forbids transporting it across state lines unless it is heading to a pasteurization facility.

And all the crap you spouted about how safe raw milk is isn't going to console the parents of the children that became sick after 2 kindergarten classes (about 30 kids) went on a trip to a small old fashioned organic dairy farm in NJ (early 90's) where the kids got to watch the cows being manually milked, and each child was given a small cup of raw milk, fresh from the cow, in violation of state law. The entire group of kids got sick, with many of the kids being hospitalized, and a few deaths. A lot of those kids will suffer life long health problems over a shot glass worth of raw milk. Go tell the parents of the kids that died, just how safe raw milk is and see what they say. See how they feel about the laws in our state that forbid the sale of raw milk.

Quote
Pasteurization, discovered by Louis Pasteur in the late 1800s, is the rapid heating and cooling of a product in order to kill bacteria while keeping the nutrients in place. In fact, the vast reductions seen in infant mortality, birth defects and premature death since the 1900s can be directly linked to the widespread use of pasteurization.

Quote
State laws allowing for raw milk go back for decades and are mostly antiquated structures of a bygone era. In the states that continue to allow raw milk for human consumption, the incidence of dairy-related foodborne illness is much higher than in states that do not allow raw milk sales. The same is true for countries. France, known for its raw milk products, has three times the amount of dairy foodborne illness as does the United States.

Quote
Despite all the potential harm behind raw milk, it still does have its advocates. One of their key arguments is consumer choice. No one disputes the fact in a free society such as ours people should have the independent ability to make choices on what they consume. However, the most common victims of raw milk illnesses are children who do not have a choice on what their parents feed them. Government routinely makes laws to protect the most vulnerable in our society, with a specific focus on kids. We require children to wear bike helmets, prohibit parents from smoking in cars with their children, and new moms cannot take their child home unless they have a car seat. This situation is no different.

http://blog.nj.com/njv_gu..._should_not_legalize.html
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« Reply #43 on: August 11, 2012, 09:21:33 AM »



Your risk of getting sick from raw milk is so infinitesimally small as to be of no significant consequence.
Believe me, if that (getting sick) happened to me, I'd not consider it, "... of no significant consequence."  tongue
Nor, I suspect, did the folk to whom it happened.


Then why don't we outlaw any of the other things above that I'd mentioned where the risk of death is orders of magnitude greater?


The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.
I guess this depends a bit on where you live, but around here, the state pays for medical bills. And I don't want to pay the medical bills of the guy who decides to have his every meal at mcdonalds tongue (even though I do have to, since there's nothing stopping this particular example)


Good point. I think that I'd go way, way off topic if I said anything about state medical insurance though.


The state has ZERO business in telling people what they can and cannot eat. None.

They don't. They have never told people what they can and can't eat. You are free to buy your own cow and milk it and drink all the raw milk you want. There is no law in any state in the US that would stop you from consuming raw milk from your own cows.


So, just make it impossible for people. That makes sense. Heck, it's not illegal to "smoke" pot, but it's illegal to have it.

And FYI - there are MANY laws that prevent people from owning cows.


However, there are laws in a lot of US states that forbid you from selling that milk to other people without it being pasteurized first, and a federal law that forbids transporting it across state lines unless it is heading to a pasteurization facility.


Every law passed, is a freedom lost.

In this case, it's simply making it impossible for people to drink raw milk. In realityville, we call this "authoritarianism" or "fascism" or something like that.


And all the crap you spouted about how safe raw milk is isn't going to console the parents of the children that became sick after 2 kindergarten classes (about 30 kids) went on a trip to a small old fashioned organic dairy farm in NJ (early 90's) where the kids got to watch the cows being manually milked, and each child was given a small cup of raw milk, fresh from the cow, in violation of state law. The entire group of kids got sick, with many of the kids being hospitalized, and a few deaths. A lot of those kids will suffer life long health problems over a shot glass worth of raw milk. Go tell the parents of the kids that died, just how safe raw milk is and see what they say. See how they feel about the laws in our state that forbid the sale of raw milk.


I'll put this succinctly - the risks from raw milk are so small compared to other normal human activities, that it is simply not worth addressing with tax payer money, and most certainly not something that should be encumbered by (bad) legislation.

Trying to hype up the very small number of cases is just fear-mongering.

You're more likely to die crossing the street.

The whole "think of the children" argument just sets off my BS alert.

There are risks in every activity. Heck, you risk being abducted by aliens while you sleep in your bed. Outlaw beds? Grin Ok, that's a bit silly, but never-the-less, everything incurs a risk. The risk with raw milk is simply incredibly low.

But like I'd pointed out above, the risks from raw milk are simply not comparable as they are orders of magnitude smaller.

Why are governments spending literally countless millions of dollars fighting farmers?


Why not address a real problem?


However, I suppose that I should attempt a solution... For those that are unwilling to accept any risk from any activity, this can be solved by dying. You only get to do it once, so if you get it over and done with, you will have no worries about anything~! Ok... that's idiotic... but it is the only way to avoid all further risk. Well, unless you are worried about what the mortician and undertaker do... I suppose even death has its risks. cheesy


Quote
Pasteurization, discovered by Louis Pasteur in the late 1800s, is the rapid heating and cooling of a product in order to kill bacteria while keeping the nutrients in place. In fact, the vast reductions seen in infant mortality, birth defects and premature death since the 1900s can be directly linked to the widespread use of pasteurization.

Quote
State laws allowing for raw milk go back for decades and are mostly antiquated structures of a bygone era. In the states that continue to allow raw milk for human consumption, the incidence of dairy-related foodborne illness is much higher than in states that do not allow raw milk sales. The same is true for countries. France, known for its raw milk products, has three times the amount of dairy foodborne illness as does the United States.

Quote
Despite all the potential harm behind raw milk, it still does have its advocates. One of their key arguments is consumer choice. No one disputes the fact in a free society such as ours people should have the independent ability to make choices on what they consume. However, the most common victims of raw milk illnesses are children who do not have a choice on what their parents feed them. Government routinely makes laws to protect the most vulnerable in our society, with a specific focus on kids. We require children to wear bike helmets, prohibit parents from smoking in cars with their children, and new moms cannot take their child home unless they have a car seat. This situation is no different.

http://blog.nj.com/njv_gu..._should_not_legalize.html


Think of the children!

Yeah. BS alert going off full blast at this point.

Alcohol is still sold, but it is possible that people could bottle feed their infants Jack Daniels...

That was just so ridiculous. Government protect people? Gee. That's really working out well now, isn't it? tongue

http://geke.us/VennDiagrams.html
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« Reply #44 on: August 11, 2012, 10:53:04 AM »

I came across a picture that was screaming for a caption...



tongue Nom nom nom~!

I so love bacon... I really missed it when I first left Canada. Now, not so much. I just about never eat it, but it's still mighty tasty~! tongue Grin
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« Reply #45 on: August 13, 2012, 10:18:35 PM »

When I was in my schooling years, a professor proved, statistically, that I actually detested something I liked.  His aim was not to persuade me to change my mind.  It was to demonstrate that anyone even semi-competent at math could make statistics mean whatever that person wanted them to mean.

Statistics are like Aristotelian statements:  they are useless without qualifiers.  My favourite Aristotelian syllogism goes like this (substitute your own food preferences):
Premise one - Nothing is better than ice cream,
Premise two - Crackers are better than nothing,
Conclusion - Crackers are better than ice cream.

OK, two (2) unqualified statements lead to an untenable conclusion, but the apparent logic is unassailable.

Same thing applies to statistics - meaningless w/o appropriate qualifiers.

For instance ...
Once every four (4) years, I am a part of the nationwide statistic base.
Once every two (2) or six (6) years, I am a part of the statewide statistic base.
Apart from that, I am a part of a communitywide statistic base.

Recently, there was report of West Nile virus, three (3) cases.  Now, that number is insignificant on even a statewide scale, much less national or global.  But it's pretty damned significant within the community.  See, statistical numbers take all feeling and conscience out of whatever is being judged.  Instead of calculating percentages, count the number of deaths or illnesses directly involved. 

As an example, I know folk who are allergic to peanuts - ingestion will be serious and could be fatal.  Statistically, they don't count ... too many decimal places ... but the folk around them, close to them would damned well be impacted should they happen to slip, or eat  something they don't know has peanuts in it.

Statistics dehumanize reality (and sometimes morality).  That can be a helpful if you have to deal with a lot of tragedy.  But statistics aren't worth a damn in any kind of argument except between statisticians.  Numbers simply don't replace, nor compare to, facts.


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« Reply #46 on: August 14, 2012, 03:49:49 AM »

3 Kinds of Lies:

  • Lies
  • Damn lies
  • Statistics cheesy

Grin

Quote
Premise one - Nothing is better than ice cream,
Premise two - Crackers are better than nothing,
Conclusion - Crackers are better than ice cream.

I'd stick that in as a red herring. i.e. The topics of discussion are entirely different. You can rewrite them and sub in the appropriate meaning:

1) There is not another thing that is better than ice cream.
2) Crackers are better than not having anything.

You can't get to the conclusion from those 2.

But this gets to one of the big problems in modern medicine (allopathic medicine) - epidemiology. It's basically just statistical analysis.
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« Reply #47 on: August 14, 2012, 06:23:46 AM »

On the topic of fresh milk... this is... errr... you might not want to click if you have, uh, sensitivities... Let's just say some people are pretty weird.

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« Reply #48 on: August 14, 2012, 08:57:39 AM »

Looks kinda fake (the object that is being suckled upon, I mean)  Wink
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« Reply #49 on: August 14, 2012, 09:10:39 AM »

Looks kinda fake (the object that is being suckled upon, I mean)  Wink

I could barely look at it at first, but I think you're right when I look at it again. Good eye!
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