Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
Used Software Can Be Sold, Says EU Court of Justice
tomos:
Gonna ruin a [semi-]perfect alcoholic buzz with significant amounts of dark coffee :(.-barney (July 04, 2012, 11:45 PM)
--- End quote ---
Which would be improved by the addition of Kahlúa and keep the buzz going a little longer :)
Or just drink the Kahlúa and get your caffeine that way :D
-4wd (July 06, 2012, 07:30 AM)
--- End quote ---
or Irish Coffee :-*
barney:
Gonna ruin a [semi-]perfect alcoholic buzz with significant amounts of dark coffee :(.-barney (July 04, 2012, 11:45 PM)
--- End quote ---
Which would be improved by the addition of Kahlúa and keep the buzz going a little longer :)
Or just drink the Kahlúa and get your caffeine that way :D
-4wd (July 06, 2012, 07:30 AM)
--- End quote ---
or Irish Coffee :-*
-tomos (July 06, 2012, 07:48 AM)
--- End quote ---
A little Jameson's, a little Bailey's, a little Kahlúa, a little BlackJack ... 'twas all good, and greatly augmented my research ... now, if I could just remember what I found ... :-\.
As expected, while the document in and of itself was not lengthy, it had pointers to other elements that had to be followed.
I spend some time over at Mike Mesnick, et al.,'s Techdirt - surprised I didn't see this, or reference to it, over there.
app103:
I thought I remembered something about a court case involving the sale of secondhand software in the USA: Court smacks Autodesk, affirms right to sell used software
-4wd (July 05, 2012, 05:14 AM)
--- End quote ---
That case involved software originally sold on physical media, and the original physical media was being resold. The exact same copy that was originally purchased was resold. No reproductions were made. Once the physical ownership changed hands, there was still only 1 copy and the original owner no longer had it in his possession.
In the US, First Sale doctrine only applies to sales in which once you sell the item, you don't have it any more.
It doesn't work the same with digital downloads in the US because you can't transfer ownership of the exact original copy that you downloaded. Transfer of ownership of downloaded digital goods involves reproduction. You upload it to the buyer, and now there is the original file you downloaded, which you still have in your possession, and now the person you sold it to has a copy too, leaving you both in a position to be able to sell the file again and again and again, with the number of copies existing increasing with each sale. That's why First Sale doesn't apply.
4wd:
It doesn't work the same with digital downloads in the US because you can't transfer ownership of the exact original copy that you downloaded. Transfer of ownership of downloaded digital goods involves reproduction. You upload it to the buyer, and now there is the original file you downloaded, which you still have in your possession, and now the person you sold it to has a copy too, leaving you both in a position to be able to sell the file again and again and again, with the number of copies existing increasing with each sale. That's why First Sale doesn't apply.-app103 (July 06, 2012, 07:02 PM)
--- End quote ---
I agree with you about the difference between physical and downloaded digital goods but I'll have to disagree about there having to be two copies in existence if you sell downloaded content - that seems to be from the perspective of corporations. There's nothing stopping the original owner from moving the downloaded content to physical media and then selling that - only one copy exists. As long as only one licensed copy of a particular download exists, I don't really see the difference between it and physical media, (which can usually be just as easily copied), except for a bit of polycarbonate and a loss of a sale to middlemen and corporations, (which is all they're really interested in).
But it all seems to be pretty irrelevant anyway as the corporations got their way in the end: No, you don't own it: Court upholds EULAs, threatens digital resale
Guess I should have searched a bit further :-[
Going hypothetical for a moment, if you buy the software in the USA, (physical/downloaded), and then sell it in the EU - is it illegal ?
What about the other way, buy in EU, sell in USA ?
Renegade:
I thought I remembered something about a court case involving the sale of secondhand software in the USA: Court smacks Autodesk, affirms right to sell used software
-4wd (July 05, 2012, 05:14 AM)
--- End quote ---
That case involved software originally sold on physical media, and the original physical media was being resold. The exact same copy that was originally purchased was resold. No reproductions were made. Once the physical ownership changed hands, there was still only 1 copy and the original owner no longer had it in his possession.
In the US, First Sale doctrine only applies to sales in which once you sell the item, you don't have it any more.
It doesn't work the same with digital downloads in the US because you can't transfer ownership of the exact original copy that you downloaded. Transfer of ownership of downloaded digital goods involves reproduction. You upload it to the buyer, and now there is the original file you downloaded, which you still have in your possession, and now the person you sold it to has a copy too, leaving you both in a position to be able to sell the file again and again and again, with the number of copies existing increasing with each sale. That's why First Sale doesn't apply.
-app103 (July 06, 2012, 07:02 PM)
--- End quote ---
I'll have to side with 4wd on this.
Yes. First sale DOES apply.
No. The software isn't sold.
But what does that mean? It means COPYRIGHT or PATENT.
But software companies aren't selling that. They are selling LICENSES. Big difference.
Once they sell you a license, you OWN that license. So yes. First sale does apply as you can sell your license because it belongs to you.
Let's not confuse the issue of copyright and licensing here.
But, getting around it is very easy. You simply give the software away for free, like a free trial/shareware/trialware/etc., but make certain that it doesn't work, or is limited, then you sell "activations" as a "service". You've already performed the service, and have no further obligation to perform the service again, so you get around "first sale" entirely.
Like I said above, there's more than one way to be a prick. :P
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version