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Author Topic: Is Linux just a hobby?  (Read 28531 times)
superboyac
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« Reply #150 on: July 20, 2012, 04:02:57 PM »

Ok folks!  I have the new Linux Mint 13 running on my vmware beautifully.  I have yawcam set up so you can see me.  I have the audio setup, although I'm going to have to use headphone/mic setup because this is the same computer i do my hardcore recording stuff on (particulars of the setup).  I need to install the screencast software, which is easy. I'll be rather busy this weekend with personal things, so maybe I'll be able to record everything next week.

mouser: can I have the resulting video hosted here directly, like your software screencasts?  I don't want to put it on youtube, I've been angry at them lately.  And it's likely to be a long and large video file.

This will be funny...I have zero idea what I'm doing.  If it's not a button and a wizard, it's going to get real comical real fast.

also, I can't promise there will be nor cursing.  I'll try to keep it under control, but it is a pastime I really enjoy.
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mahesh2k
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« Reply #151 on: July 20, 2012, 04:10:30 PM »

Quote
I have yawcam set up so you can see me.

For a minute, I thought your account got hacked by "wanna see me on cam" girl . tongue
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40hz
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« Reply #152 on: July 20, 2012, 04:21:45 PM »

Quote
I have yawcam set up so you can see me.

For a minute, I thought your account got hacked by "wanna see me on cam" girl . tongue

Hope not. She's vastly overrated IMO.  Grin
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Don't you see? It's turtles all the way down!
superboyac
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« Reply #153 on: July 20, 2012, 04:36:16 PM »

wanna see me on cam
??  I'm not getting this reference.  I just googled it and i still don't get it.  no big deal, doesn't sound terribly interesting anyway.
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superboyac
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« Reply #154 on: July 21, 2012, 01:35:00 AM »

Hey!  I did the screencast!  It's rendering right now, it's about 28 minutes long.  I won't give away the ending, so that's all I'm gonna say.
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superboyac
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« Reply #155 on: July 24, 2012, 08:59:59 AM »

You can watch the screencast here:
http://minus.com/lbaph37Mp5JOcB

You can download it also.  It's about 29 minutes, 80 MB.  I go through attempting a command line installation on Linux Mint.  It's all done in real time, and it's my actual first time trying to do it.
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jgpaiva
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« Reply #156 on: July 24, 2012, 09:54:19 AM »

You can watch the screencast here:
http://minus.com/lbaph37Mp5JOcB

You can download it also.  It's about 29 minutes, 80 MB.  I go through attempting a command line installation on Linux Mint.  It's all done in real time, and it's my actual first time trying to do it.
That made me smile so many times smiley Thanks a lot!
Also, I really wasn't expecting the bonus ending. Nice! cheesy

I really think that the comparison you made,"this is harder than double-clicking the exe and pressing next-next-next", isn't exactly fair since you tried installing from source, so you would have to compare with installing from source in windows also (which would be a pretty similar experience, I guess).
Now, let's try to keep this discussion civilized, guys smiley

PS: did you have anyone operating the camera or is it smart enough to follow you?  undecided
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40hz
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« Reply #157 on: July 24, 2012, 10:41:25 AM »

Aram! The Man!!! Thmbsup


I'm too sexy for my distro...too sexy for my...      ;-))

I've often wished somebody would do a honest to goodness "live" installation and make an unscripted real-time video of it like this one.

Downloading it now. Can't wait to watch it when I get a free half hour. Woo-hoo! Cool
« Last Edit: July 24, 2012, 10:49:12 AM by 40hz » Logged

Don't you see? It's turtles all the way down!
barney
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« Reply #158 on: July 24, 2012, 12:09:38 PM »

It is the elitist attitude that is still present in several old-time Linux users that really detracts from the overall Linux movement.
I would change several old-time to many experienced  tongue, but otherwise am in complete agreement with that statement.  That is what has turned me away from most forms of Linux every time I've tried to mainstream it, not just use it for tech/recovery purposes.

I mentioned the RTFMs earlier that I got in the forae.  There's a little more to that than just the statement.  Almost every time someone makes that recommendation, they are making a number of assumptions.  First, they assume that you have not read the manual - or man pages.  Second, they assume that if you do read that documentation, you will come away with the same understanding they have.  And, to a lesser extent, they are irritated that your questions intrude on reading the really important stuff in that particular forum.

But the bottom line, for me at least, is the quality of the documentation.  There's a lot of information there, but most of it is written by experienced users for experienced users.  I spent a few years as a technical writer, and believe you me, there is an art to it, an art that many people just don't have.  Writing about technical matters in such a manner that non-technical people can read and make sense of the material takes a lot of work.  I understand why the docs are written the way they are, but that does not make them easier to read/interpret.
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Make a good day ... barn
40hz
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« Reply #159 on: July 24, 2012, 02:20:04 PM »

For those new to Linux who may have  been following along...

If you're serious about getting into Linux, check out any of the books put out by Mark G. Sobell. Amazon page here. If you need information, search no further. Here is bedrock.

Start with either Fedora or Ubuntu - and work your way through either his Fedora or Ubuntu specific titles.

You can also supplement either book with one of the O'Reilly "Hacks" titles. There are versions specifically for Ubuntu and Fedora. These give you short well written chapters for dealing with common niggling issues plus instructions for fun/useful stuff to do - all in a handy cookbook format.

If you want to go beyond that, you can then pick up  a copy of his A Practical Guide to Linux Commands, Editors, and Shell Programming. Lots more good stuff here starting at the intermediate user level and moving well into the expert range.

Another superb title (and pretty much the current bible of all things Linux) is UNIX and Linux System Administration Handbook. If you want to do something with Linux as a career, this tome is a must have. And forget the MAN pages. They are written by experts for experts. This book spells things out in plain-speak. Or at least as much as is possible. (Note: Some things are never going to be completely easy to get your head around until you start actively using them. And even then, some parts of Linux are just plain hard to grasp or deal with. Remember: even experts have to RTFM every so often. And when they do, this is the "FM" they usually reach for.)

Also check out the Distrowatch website and prepare to sample the bounty of distros and packages available to a Linux user. And all at no charge.

If you want to experience a very elegant desktop environment, give Linux Mint a try. If you want something a little more 'ninja' try CrunchBang Linux. For full blown bells & whistles check out Pinguy OS or Sabayon.

...or put a second NIC card in an old PC you have gathering dust, and turn it into a full-bore commercial grade firewall network appliance that can easily hold its own against products that would otherwise cost hundreds if not thousands by downloading and installing pfSense or Smoothwall Express on it.

...or build a very capable home server with FreeNAS...

...or network gateway server appliance with Zenytal or ClearOS

...or build a home theater media server using XBMC or a DVR box with MythTV.

Or even better...if you really want to understand how Linux works, try a modern bare metal distro like Arch Linux where you need to set everything up by hand - but end up with a completely customized desktop or server that does exactly what you want it to do the way you want to do it. (And also become an expert user in the process.)

I could (maybe do? undecided ) go on and on... Grin

One of these days I'm going to have to write this all up once and for all and put it in a PDF for download. tongue
« Last Edit: July 26, 2012, 02:23:31 PM by 40hz » Logged

Don't you see? It's turtles all the way down!
superboyac
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« Reply #160 on: July 24, 2012, 02:53:28 PM »

^^Thanks 40, good stuff there.  I'll have to go through those eventually.  Maybe I'll do more videos like that showing me struggling through all this in real time!

PS: did you have anyone operating the camera or is it smart enough to follow you?
It follows me automatically.  It's the new Logitech 920 webcam, I've really been digging it lately.
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mahesh2k
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« Reply #161 on: July 24, 2012, 02:58:56 PM »

Nice video there superboyac.

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wraith808
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« Reply #162 on: July 24, 2012, 04:22:10 PM »

^^Thanks 40, good stuff there.

Definitely agreed on that point!

One of these days I'm going to have to write this all up once and for all and put it in a PDF for download. tongue

What's stopping you?  That's some good info!
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Tuxman
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« Reply #163 on: July 24, 2012, 04:24:46 PM »

^ If you start with Ubuntu, you will learn a lot about how Linux does not work.

(Yay, 1,000th posting!)
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I bet when Cheetahs race and one of them cheats, the other one goes "Man, you're such a Cheetah!" and they laugh & eat a zebra or whatever.
- @VeryGrumpyCat
jgpaiva
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« Reply #164 on: July 24, 2012, 04:56:37 PM »

^^Thanks 40, good stuff there.  I'll have to go through those eventually.  Maybe I'll do more videos like that showing me struggling through all this in real time!
+1!
I'd really like to see more, it's always fun to understand where people have problems with anything on the first time they use it. Even if I'm not developing a OS, it's a learning experience since it allows to predict what kind of stuff works badly.

It follows me automatically.  It's the new Logitech 920 webcam, I've really been digging it lately.
Awesome smiley And it works perfectly!

Also, since I have some more time now, here's the two largest problems I believe stomped you:
1 - directories in unix are case sensitive ("Downloads" and not "downloads" Wink )
2 - you were missing some dependencies. In particular, your distribution runs the Gnomew window manager, and the program you tried to install needs KDEw. This is a common problem, but had you used some package manager instead of installing from source and you wouldn't have this problem.

Also, there's a third way to install stuff (which is mostly painless) that you haven't tried (which is the one that is equivalent to installing stuff in Windows): downloading compiled binaries and installing them using a package manager ("apt-get" or "aptitude", for example). An example of this is Opera.
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mahesh2k
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« Reply #165 on: July 24, 2012, 05:05:42 PM »

Ubuntu has gnome shell (unity) which uses nautilus, KDE uses konqueror and XFCE is on thunar. All these are installed with your distro. I think if you want two pane file managers then you have lots of choices. Some are ugly in UI but still powerful.
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superboyac
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« Reply #166 on: July 24, 2012, 05:31:12 PM »

Also, since I have some more time now, here's the two largest problems I believe stomped you:
1 - directories in unix are case sensitive ("Downloads" and not "downloads" Wink )
2 - you were missing some dependencies. In particular, your distribution runs the Gnomew window manager, and the program you tried to install needs KDEw. This is a common problem, but had you used some package manager instead of installing from source and you wouldn't have this problem.

Also, there's a third way to install stuff (which is mostly painless) that you haven't tried (which is the one that is equivalent to installing stuff in Windows): downloading compiled binaries and installing them using a package manager ("apt-get" or "aptitude", for example). An example of this is Opera.
Perhaps I'll have to explore these methods in the next video.  I want to learn how to install ANY Linux-comaptible program I come across into whatever distro I'm using.  I'm sure that means a fair amount of compiling and other stuff in the terminal, so that's the goal. 
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jgpaiva
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« Reply #167 on: July 24, 2012, 06:42:07 PM »

Perhaps I'll have to explore these methods in the next video.  I want to learn how to install ANY Linux-comaptible program I come across into whatever distro I'm using.  I'm sure that means a fair amount of compiling and other stuff in the terminal, so that's the goal. 
I'm not sure if that's the right way to go about it. Honestly, the "app store" (or whatever it is) method works pretty well for 90% of the cases. The "install from binary" method works for 9.9% of the cases. And then from the remaining 0.1%, 90% works after some "./configure && make install" voodoo. However, I imagine there are hundreds of different and specific ways to install stuff in the 0.01% remaining, which realistically you'll never need unless you require some very specific tool.
What I'm saying is: start with the basics and learn lazily, have fun using linux instead of trying to learn every single manual page because that'll kill your experience for no reason.

So, next time you try to install something in linux from a web site, search for the binaries (if you really want to not use the "app store" tongue ). Since you're using something based on debian, you should be able to find the binaries for pretty much anything. For Krusader, the instructions were here: http://www.krusader.org/get-krusader/

DISCLAIMER: all statistics in this post were made up on the spot, based on my own experience. YMMV
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superboyac
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« Reply #168 on: July 24, 2012, 07:20:48 PM »

So maybe the next video should be me exploring the different ways to install stuff.  I'd be interested in the one application that wasn't in the software manager, and then figuring out the different ways to get it to run.
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mahesh2k
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« Reply #169 on: July 24, 2012, 07:52:14 PM »

.tar.bz, .gzip, type of files works on all distributions and you have to use respective terminal command to install from source.

.deb is debian distro specific file format and you have to use apt-get -i to install them. You're using mint which is under debians branch. That means you can compile this format on distro.

Another option- install gdebi and then use any format supported by debian to install software.
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Tuxman
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« Reply #170 on: July 25, 2012, 12:59:46 AM »

...or build a very capable home server with FreeNAS...
Oh, by the way, before you put that into a PDF:
You do know that FreeNAS is not a Linux distribution, don't you?

Actually it is a really good example why BSD kicks ass. cheesy
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I bet when Cheetahs race and one of them cheats, the other one goes "Man, you're such a Cheetah!" and they laugh & eat a zebra or whatever.
- @VeryGrumpyCat
40hz
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« Reply #171 on: July 25, 2012, 02:16:49 AM »

^I do actually.

Actually, to be even more precise, I forgot that FreeNAS's planned move over to Debian a few years back was abandoned. (Was that late 2008 or sometime in 2009?)

And neither is pfSense now that I think about it.  

Momentary slips. I was on a roll.  smiley
« Last Edit: July 25, 2012, 02:28:32 AM by 40hz » Logged

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Tuxman
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« Reply #172 on: July 25, 2012, 03:16:34 AM »

"pf" sounds like the classical BSD firewall indeed. smiley
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I bet when Cheetahs race and one of them cheats, the other one goes "Man, you're such a Cheetah!" and they laugh & eat a zebra or whatever.
- @VeryGrumpyCat
mahesh2k
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« Reply #173 on: July 25, 2012, 09:05:26 AM »

*sigh*
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Tuxman
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« Reply #174 on: July 25, 2012, 09:23:28 AM »

More details please!
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I bet when Cheetahs race and one of them cheats, the other one goes "Man, you're such a Cheetah!" and they laugh & eat a zebra or whatever.
- @VeryGrumpyCat
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