Welcome Guest.   Make a donation to an author on the site August 22, 2014, 12:40:17 PM  *

Please login or register.
Or did you miss your validation email?


Login with username and password (forgot your password?)
Why not become a lifetime supporting member of the site with a one-time donation of any amount? Your donation entitles you to a ton of additional benefits, including access to exclusive discounts and downloads, the ability to enter monthly free software drawings, and a single non-expiring license key for all of our programs.


You must sign up here before you can post and access some areas of the site. Registration is totally free and confidential.
 
The N.A.N.Y. Challenge 2010! Download 24 custom programs!
   
   Forum Home   Thread Marks Chat! Downloads Search Login Register  
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Down
  Reply  |  New Topic  |  Print  
Author Topic: In search of an alternative to InfoSelect ...  (Read 17877 times)
Dormouse
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 985

View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2011, 03:05:14 PM »

Even though they are selected in the View | Choose Columns (?) menu window.  That is, both Web site and URL are selected, but neither shows in the item attributes window.

I don't have either of those boxes clicked there  Sad
What I do have it those attributes ticked in the menu - Tools>Attributes  smiley
And I bring up the Attributes panel by the menu - View>Other Windows>Item Attributes (or just CTRL 4)  smiley smiley
CTRL 5 brings up the item notes (or otherwise just go through the same View menu)

And for some reason, the UR folk apparently don't believe that, even with screen shots  huh.  I don't doubt that the product is good, but it simply does not perform as advertised on my system.  My next step, when time allows, is to deinstall, reinstall, see if something went awry in the original install.  That seems more and more likely, as new [non] events occur  ohmy.

I do sort of understand where they are coming from. This sort of thing just works in UR - as long as you know or can work out how to do it. It is, to my mind, rather like Directory Opus: lots and lots of possibilities and controls - but so many places to do it and so many things you need to understand. I don't think I ever read the manual; I did find some really informative key posts in the forum written by the developers. Just a question of finding the ones you need. My guess it is not your install that is a problem, just your settings somewhere.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 03:10:44 PM by Dormouse » Logged
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #26 on: June 07, 2011, 07:14:52 PM »

I'm inclined to agree.  However, I've made so many changes/adjustments, I suspect starting from scratch might be advantageous.  And there is the possibility that, since my system is kinda  sorta  overloaded, something else is interfering that I wot not of  undecided.  For instance, after dropping an indeterminate number of clips, every drop becomes one (1) particular clip.  Only thing I've found to cure that is to kill, then restart, URP.  But it shouldn't be happening, and it's likely something else running is interfering.  However, I can't afford the time to hunt that particular needle - it's a big haystack  tongue.
Logged

Make a good day ... barn
Dormouse
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 985

View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #27 on: June 07, 2011, 10:21:24 PM »

For instance, after dropping an indeterminate number of clips, every drop becomes one (1) particular clip.  Only thing I've found to cure that is to kill, then restart, URP.  But it shouldn't be happening, and it's likely something else running is interfering.  However, I can't afford the time to hunt that particular needle - it's a big haystack  tongue.
Completely agree.
And UR is very complex. My own approach was like my normal approach to many even slightly complex programs - a few minutes here and there seeing what it does, reading the forum regularly etc over a long period of time before I decided I got it and it would do some aspect of what I wanted and started actually using it. Pretty much the complete opposite of your situation.
Logged
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2011, 08:19:08 AM »

I've just been reviewing these:
AgendaAtOnce: The latest version - AgendaAtOnce
     Looks like it's been quite improved.
     Could be well worth considering as a possible alternative to InfoSelect.

Tomboy: Uses a WikiWiki-like linking system - Tomboy
     Looks pretty useful. May require you to change your way of thinking though.

Hope these help or are of use.
Logged
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #29 on: June 12, 2011, 12:01:31 PM »

Used Tomboy as a cataloging tool under linux, but [that iteration] wasn't really suitable to current requirements.  The current Windows version seems to have gone a bit too minimalist, although it might be a useful note[only]-taking app.

I'll take a look at AgendaAtOnce.  Currently getting more comfortable with WikeNotes.  It seems to be the most workable of everything I've tried so far, although they've not answered their help form.  I'd had high hopes for UltraRecall Pro, but I don't have the time to translate its help file into non-developer-level English  tongue.
Logged

Make a good day ... barn
stewcam
Charter Member
***
Posts: 19

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #30 on: June 13, 2011, 07:45:11 AM »

I am a longtime IS user. At present I rely on IS 2007, which I run from USB (works well). However, with the advent of IS 10 I have been looking elsewhere, and recently came across another contender:

Smereka TreeProjects

Really quite impressive!
Logged
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #31 on: June 13, 2011, 02:54:37 PM »

TreeProjects looks good.  Even has the tagging capability I'd hoped IS would adopt.  Dunno from a cursory read whether it'll do graphics or not - WikeNotes has indeed spoiled me in that respect - but I'll check out the trial copy, see what it does.  At half the price, if it even comes close to IS' [former] functionality, it'll be a bargain  smiley.
Logged

Make a good day ... barn
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #32 on: June 14, 2011, 06:05:37 PM »

@barney:
Quote
Currently getting more comfortable with WikeNotes.  It seems to be the most workable of everything I've tried so far, although they've not answered their help form.
Quote
Dunno from a cursory read whether it'll do graphics or not - WikeNotes has indeed spoiled me in that respect -

Well, as a result of reading your posts, I tried out WikeNotes.

Conclusions:
  • It doesn't do graphics, as far as I can see, though it looks as though it tries to in html format.
  • It's very kludgy.
  • It offers some novel ways to lose your data for good.
  • I would therefore recommend that you avoid using it.
Logged
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #33 on: June 15, 2011, 11:02:59 PM »

Funny, I've not had a problem with WikeNotes anent dropping web stuff onto it and holding them.  However, if you tried the latest version - 0.4 - you do have to pick the right create icon - one of 'em is text only.

I have had a few sites render as though I'd hit the view source button on the browser, but I suspect - since I've seen the same with other products - it's likely do to malformed Web pages rather some fault with WikeNotes.

Yeah, can't argue with the kludgy aspect.  Suspect, if the devs keep on it, that will improve with time,though.

I've yet, except as noted in the previous view source comment, to lose any data with it.  I'm not particularly happy with the password aspect - it seems poorly, or perhaps clumsily?, implemented - but I've lost no data for the last several weeks, actually since this thread started, which is more than I can say for URP.

All in all, it seems the best candidate to replace IS functionality in this arena, albeit not a total replacement.

BTW, looked at the TreeProjects app.  It's nice, and has tagging capability - a strong plus for me - but didn't see any graphic copy/storage capability worth mention.

Logged

Make a good day ... barn
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #34 on: June 16, 2011, 01:07:47 AM »

@barney: Ah, I see! I was using WikeNotes v0.2 not v0.4.
I had been confuzzled by their website (which is also kludgy). It took me three tries to download v0.4 from their WindowsLive website - without corruption errors.
When I started up v0.4, I immediately saw what you meant. Much better.
I take back my comments above. Still kludgy, and you need to take care.
Well worth following WikeNotes' development, but, since it's apparently still under development, I'd not recommend that you entrust your valuable data to it without lots of backup.

By the way, I noticed that it takes copy/paste of text and/or images from MS OneNote just fine - which some applications seem to have great difficulty with.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2011, 01:10:20 AM by IainB » Logged
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2011, 03:15:12 AM »

Suggest you check out Compendium.
It was in my list in an earlier post, but I haven't used it for a couple of years. In the link provided above, it says this:
Quote
Personal Use
Many people use Compendium to manage their personal digital information resources, since you can drag+drop in any document, website, email, image, etc, organise them visually, and then connect ideas, arguments and decisions to these. Compendium thus becomes the 'glue' that allows you to pool and make sense of disparate material that would otherwise remain fragmented in different software applications. You can assign your own keyword 'tags' to these elements (icons), create your own palettes of icons that have special meanings, overlay maps on top of background images, and place/edit a given icon in many different places at once: things don't always fit neatly into just one box in real life.

If you're technical, you can exploit our XML scheme, the Derby or MySQL relational database, and public Java classes to connect Compendium to other databases and computational services. (If that sentence meant anything to you, then check out our developer website!)

There are informative links to follow if you go to the website.
Wikipedia have a good entry on Compendium.
Logged
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #36 on: June 21, 2011, 01:28:12 AM »

He-he ... pulled down Compendium ... from first reads, I'll need a doctorate - at least a masters  Wink - just to get started.  Actually, it looks pretty decent, but it'll take a lot of reading to get it working, methinks  tongue
Logged

Make a good day ... barn
cranioscopical
Friend of the Site
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,167



see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2011, 10:03:13 AM »

pulled down Compendium

So did I (thanks IainB) looks interesting and it was fast and easy to set up superficial collections.

I thought that I couldn't function without InfoSelect, which I'd used ever since it grew out of Tornado Notes. That was until some circumstance that I no longer recall in detail (moving offices I think) divorced me from it. I lost track of my data and also the software itself. On coming across it a couple of years later I found that getting updated to a current version seemed to be quite a hassle and rather costly. I also found that it was starting to look and feel a bit dated — this was around 7, I think. Perhaps my needs are simple, but I haven't missed it as much as I had expected. In a perverse way I'm not sorry to have left the train at an earlier station now that I see remarks about the current offering.
Logged

Chris
barney
Charter Member
***
Posts: 1,242


see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #38 on: June 22, 2011, 12:28:39 AM »

Yeah, you might have been lucky ... I had to lose significant data in order to jump that particular ship.  I stayed with it because I'd not been able to find anything that could perform searches as rapidly ... but this last version broke most of my search configs, as well as adding that damned ribbon and providing a toolbar that could not hold configurations ... ended up with less screen real estate, less functionality, and an ersatz menu [substitution] system that was non-intuitive (at least to me) at best.  So now it seems I'll be using URP for some stuff, WikeNotes for some stuff, Personal Brain for some stuff, maybe Compendium for some stuff ... wonder how many other pieces I'll need to adopt to compensate  tongue.  Hell, I'd even go back to the Tornado TSR  tongue.
Logged

Make a good day ... barn
cranioscopical
Friend of the Site
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,167



see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #39 on: June 22, 2011, 06:11:54 AM »

ended up with less screen real estate, less functionality, and an ersatz menu [substitution] system that was non-intuitive

Ouch!  ohmy

Fortunately, a lot of the info I'd had was of only passing value. Project notes, costings, that sort of stuff. Basically, once a project was completed those notes weren't worth the heck of a lot as the material wound up in printed reports. Anyway, that's where a good secretary p.a. shines.
Logged

Chris
40hz
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 10,579



see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2011, 11:41:28 AM »


Personal Brain for some stuff, maybe Compendium for some stuff


If you ever do get something non-trivial up and running under either, could you please be sure to share it with us? Pretty please even?

I've wanted to like both of those programs ever so much since the day I first learned about them. But despite giving them decent try-outs, it's been "no joy" I'm afraid.

Maybe I just don't have the right category of project to use either of them with. (And thinkertoys do tend to be domain specific, sad but true.) Still...something in the back of my head keeps alternating between thinking the king has no clothes - and that I'm seriously missing something.

So any input - especially with a real live working example application - would be greatly appreciated.  smiley


« Last Edit: June 22, 2011, 11:47:49 AM by 40hz » Logged

Don't you see? It's turtles all the way down!
Dormouse
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 985

View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2011, 01:57:48 PM »

Yeh. I've tried Compendium too. Could never think of a use for it that it was the best solution for.
Sort of opposite problem to that I have with IQ - plenty of possible uses for it and recognise that it might be efficient if I thought the way it does, but never see an easy way of doing what I want. And probably never will unless the failure of other tools forces me to try and adapt to its way of working. May need to have another look sometime.
Would take a lot more persuading/examples to make me try Compendium again.
Logged
superboyac
Charter Member
***
Posts: 5,650


Is your software in my list?

see users location on a map View Profile WWW Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2011, 03:47:34 PM »

This is going to sound waaaay out of left field...

I think the biggest problem with all of these information managers is none of them offer the user a good way to customize how they want to SEE the information.  Look, storing information is easy.  Even without any special programs, it's easy to just use a good file manager to organize a bunch of files and folders.  What a lot of these programs do is focus on the STORAGE of information, which to me is not a big deal.  That's why i always struggle with that part.  I'm fine with basic file management, I don't need a new way to manage files.

The presentation is where it gets bad.  All of these programs either want you to view your data in  THEIR way, which usually only resonates with a specific group of people.  But you don't have the ability to tweak it to what you need.  Just to prove my point further, most of these information managers have really awful printing support.  Most of them are very basic, maybe the default IE type print preview thing.

The reason why this is bad is because why am I going to spend all this time importing/creating the database, if I'm not going to see or get out the end result of what I want?

Which is why I think my ultimate idea for a program like this would be awesome, but I don't have the talent to create it:

The ultimate information management program:
First, it should be able to import content in easily.  Especially content that is "very normal".  text files, ms office files, pictures, popular database formats.  That takes care of bringing things in.

Then, it should offer a flexible way to establish relationships among all these items.  Hierarchies should be easy to make, like in infoqube, ecco pro.  Hierarchies are essential.  I don't care if you call it tagging or outlining, but relating content needs to be easy.

Now for the best part.  I should be able to take all these content elements and like a desktop publishing program, specify how they should be laid out and so forth.  So I can print it, export it to an image or html file, etc.  This is what most programs lack big time.

Once you like a certain layout, you should be able to save that layout as a template or something and reuse it easily with other data.


That's an idea worth exploring, I think.  We spend too much time designing how to bring content into the application.  There are tons of programs that do this. Any program like MS Word is going to be better at writing stuff than an information manager, yet they all go through the whole exercise of giving us a Word-lite editor, that people keep requesting more features to make it more like Word.  Then they don't have this feature or that feature, like image resizing, rotating, etc...but all this stuff is done better with programs specific for that.  This is what most developers spend their time doing.

What is consistently neglected: printing features, export/import features, interface improvements.  No.  we keep doing the same mistake everyone else in this world does: make it bigger, bigger, more stuff, more stuff...yet never go back and fine-tune or fix things that we have now had a chance to use and improve.  Just like google, it used to be awesome, now there's so much crap on it that it's 99% crap, 1% useful.  So you might argue it's still worth it for that 1%, but after a while, you give up because your tired...you're tired of wading through all the crap to find that one thing.

I'm on a big fix with elegance lately, since I see so little of it in my life.  granted, I'm an engineer in los Angeles (how ugly and boring can it get?!) but I still see very few examples of it around.  Plus, I'm super cynical now.
Logged

40hz
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 10,579



see users location on a map View Profile Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2011, 06:07:16 PM »

I actually don't care how easy it is to use. If it does what I want, I'll put in whatever effort it takes to master it. The problem for me is when it isn't easy to use - and it still doesn't do what I want.

Right now (and much to my surprise) the very inelegant (ok, more like hokey) wiki approach seems to work better than most for most info projects.

Maybe wiki is as good as it gets right now with the generally available paradigms and technology we have available for garden variety PCs?

Hmm...

Man do I hate 'fuzzy' anything. (I'm the son of an engineer, in a family of engineers, so I guess my bias is to be expected even if I'm not one.) And I know fuzzy is the reality you usually have to deal with. But I hate it just the same. I'm an "elegance" junky - where elegance is defined as the ability to bring simplicity and precision to the accomplishment of a task. )
 Wink




« Last Edit: June 22, 2011, 08:23:21 PM by 40hz » Logged

Don't you see? It's turtles all the way down!
Armando
Charter Member
***
Posts: 2,674



see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2011, 08:39:53 PM »

The subject of the perfect information management software can be discussed endlessly and yet... No magic formula will emerge for at least 3 terribly banal and cliché reasons : users' needs are often different, users come/are from/in various contexts, users possess various degree of geekiness... That's why you'll have people immensely enjoying Compendium while others will find that TiddlyWiki or oldish Ecco are the best things since slice bread... While I'll just be left scratching my head  tellme

As far as the original requirements were... I'm not sure why Barney didn't explore OneNote more (jimdoria's heartfelt suggestion) as, really, it seems to fit the bill almost perfectly. Not to mention that it's sexy and does what it does really well.

- allow drag and drop from almost any other application : CHECK
- record the URL of the drag and drop origin if a URL, or the title bar if a non-Web application : CHECK
- record the date (and time?) of any drag and drop operation : CHECK (last modified date, at least... IIRC, a while ago)
- include images along with text in any drag and drop operation : CHECK
- allow creation of individual notes interactively: CHECK (well... I have to admit I'm not sure exactly what that means... But if does mean what I think it does : CHECK...  smiley)
- allow - but not require - a tree/outline structure (in order to pre-classify note or drag and drop entities): CHECK (but OneNote isn't a pure outliner)

+ one million other things.

So, apart for the last element, maybe, OneNote seems to be a winner -- well I admit that I haven't tested Zoot 32 (not enough time).

And, of course most of you know I use InfoQube for everything data related (or almost), with its current imperfections. But I'd be very surprised if it fitted the bill here. Yet, apart for "recording the URL of the drag and drop origin" stuff (which could probably easily be done), it does everything mentioned above. Like I said : it boils down to one's needs, level of geekiness and usage context...
« Last Edit: June 22, 2011, 08:42:39 PM by Armando; Reason: lots of small corrections... » Logged

"I suppose it can be said that I'm an absent-minded driver. It's true that I've driven through a number of red lights on occasion, but on the other hand, I've stopped at a lot of green ones but never gotten credit for it."
Glenn Gould
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #45 on: July 16, 2011, 10:52:02 PM »

As an update and in case it is of use to someone, I have revisited something that I think we have not discussed in this thread so far, but which was discussed a while back in DC forum - KN (KnowledgeNotebook):
http://www.donationcoder.com/forum/index.php?topic=22336
http://www.donationcoder.com/forum/index.php?topic=22592

I had previously found KN to be restrictive and a bit kludgy.
Having reinstalled it and having played around with it a bit, I think it is a lot better, but it still seems a rather odd kind of tool to me. It's a sort of Wiki, I think. I don't think I have discovered all of it's potential in my brief look so far. There is a version for "business" use and one for "student" use. I only tried out the former. I did watch the associated tutorial videos, and saw that the student version apparently has some handy study aids - e.g.,  simple mind-mapping charts, flash cards (as an aid to rote learning), and a very rough method for comparing your own notes to those of your tutor to see how well-aligned they are.

The KN website is here, if you want to download and try it for yourself: KnowledgeNotebook

For this latest install of KN, I looked at what the KN installation puts onto the disk, and it seems it's based on Railo - an Open Source ColdFusion Markup Language (CFML). It uses a lot of Java scripts, and, I'm not sure about this, but the installation batch files seem to require .NET Framework and MS Access(?). The data files seem to be buried in the C:\Program Files directory in Win7. KN will not install properly except to that as its root directory, and it leaves loose files in that root, which I think is a bit untidy on the developer's part.

So, it looks interesting, but I don't know how well it might meet the user requirements of different potential users.
The point about requirements made above by @Armando is not insignificant:
Quote
The subject of the perfect information management software can be discussed endlessly and yet... No magic formula will emerge for at least 3 terribly banal and cliché reasons : users' needs are often different, users come/are from/in various contexts, users possess various degree of geekiness... That's why you'll have people immensely enjoying Compendium while others will find that TiddlyWiki or oldish Ecco are the best things since slice bread... While I'll just be left scratching my head
Each PIM user will have different, and usually unspecified requirements - may not even know what they are or may not be able to articulate them coherently to others. These "requirements" will form the paradigm or lens through which they look to see whether any given PIM is "perfect" for them. This is obviously a complete lottery and therefore it would be highly unlikely that any PIM will meet your needs under such a scheme.

As an aside: Perhaps little wonder therefore that the Info Select developer has been given such a hard time by his users in their Yahoo forum. However, it is probably his own fault to a large extent as he did not seem to engage in or own up to any systematic gathering, cataloguing and publishing of user requirements before going into redevelopment. He seemed to be entirely focussed on "features" which are not at all the same thing as "user requirements". A lot of the users followed his lead and became focussed on features as well, thereby missing the opportunity to better understand and define their own requirements.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2011, 10:59:49 PM by IainB » Logged
IainB
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 4,620


Slartibartfarst

see users location on a map View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #46 on: July 22, 2011, 02:44:42 AM »

I was just cleaning up my Program Files directory and I realised that after uninstalling KN, there was still a Railo directory. I read through the install log and discovered that it was a set-up of the Railo/Resin Web Server. Now I think I understand a bit better how KN works - it is indeed a web-based wiki provided on a local (127.0.0.1) host or web server (my laptop, in this case).
I ran the uninstall file in the Railo directory, and it declared itself to be the Railo 3.1 Server uninstall. It removed itself very tidily.
Logged
rgdot
Supporting Member
**
Posts: 1,577


View Profile WWW Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #47 on: September 06, 2011, 01:54:54 PM »

The aforementioned Smereka TreeProjects is one of the upcoming deals on BdJ, 50% off for $24.50
Logged
agam
Member
**
Posts: 1

View Profile Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #48 on: October 08, 2013, 01:26:16 PM »

Hello to all Info-Select fans ...

I am proud to offer a modern clone of Info-Select ver 1.0 as a portable freeware:

Info-Base http://freeware.persoft.ch/

J.Agam (since Tornado ...)
Logged
mouser
First Author
Administrator
*****
Posts: 33,256



see users location on a map View Profile WWW Read user's biography. Give some DonationCredits to this forum member
« Reply #49 on: October 08, 2013, 01:30:27 PM »

Welcome to the site Jochanan   thumbs up
Thank you for sharing your software.
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Up
  Reply  |  New Topic  |  Print  
 
Jump to:  
   Forum Home   Thread Marks Chat! Downloads Search Login Register  

DonationCoder.com | About Us
DonationCoder.com Forum | Powered by SMF
[ Page time: 0.058s | Server load: 0.04 ]