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Do universities have a claim on students' IP?

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wraith808:
If not, and the professor had no obligation to the student other than to present the coursework in the best manner that he thought, then there would be no student evaluations at the end of the semester/quarter, etc., and that evaluation would have no effect on professors (well, non-tenured, anyway).  And if so, then those opinions would have more weight than they do... even with tenured professors.
-wraith808 (January 24, 2011, 05:31 PM)
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Well carrying out an evaluation would probably be considered part of the courses content. And of course the final exam to obtain the qualification is a matter between the student and the university, though the professor would likely be obligated to provide the exam, and correct them.

But should a professor be fired if all his class fail? Not at all. The college should probably investigate to ensure the professor did indeed teach the material, But if the students didn't learn it then tough on them.
-Eóin (January 24, 2011, 05:42 PM)
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Being a teacher is more than giving rote quotations of subject matter.  Teaching is a skill, and not all have it.  Should student failure be blamed on the teacher?  If the student was 'taught' then no.  But it is very much the teacher's case if the teacher does not teach.  My wife had a class recently, and the teacher taught her very little; in fact, she was late in everything, from class to grading.  My wife succeeded only because of what she learned outside of the class, spurred by her want of knowledge and her need to do well.  Was this success a product of the teacher's teaching techniques?  I think the obvious answer is no.  If she had failed using the teacher's teaching material, whose fault would it have been?  I would say the teacher's.

Eóin:
Wraith, you are of course correct when talking about 1st and 2nd level education.

But 3rd level, university education was always held in a different light. And given the attitudes I see from students, any change to how university's operate, to bring them more in line with the earlier levels, would destroy the educational standards and make degrees worthless as a means for employers to judge merit.

Indeed that has already begun to happen. Many employers now only see postgraduate research qualifications as some which distinguishes an applicant.

mouser:
There are situations in a University where a graduate student is EMPLOYED by the university or is paid on a grant; in those cases it seems reasonable for some of the conditions of that employment to be that any intellectual property coming out of that work is (partially) owned by the university.

But I agree with those who have described the role of a normal student attending university in terms of the university being HIRED BY THE STUDENT to provide a service (education).  In such a case, when students create something as part of a class, they should have complete rights to that.

wraith808:
Wraith, you are of course correct when talking about 1st and 2nd level education.

But 3rd level, university education was always held in a different light. And given the attitudes I see from students, any change to how university's operate, to bring them more in line with the earlier levels, would destroy the educational standards and make degrees worthless as a means for employers to judge merit.

Indeed that has already begun to happen. Many employers now only see postgraduate research qualifications as some which distinguishes an applicant.
-Eóin (January 24, 2011, 06:13 PM)
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I don't know if I completely understand 1st/2nd/3rd... do you mean undergraduate, master's, doctorate level?  Or is it something else (for the international education level ignorant :))

Eóin:
Sorry, 1st and 2nd level would bring you up to the end of Americian highschool. They are the levels everyone usually has an automatic right to. 3rd level is University education.

By 1st and 2nd, I guess I should have said primary and secondary education.

On the subject if IP, I do actually agree that students should retain ownership of ideas they come up with themselves while on campus. But I firmly believe something is fishy in this case. If it were just a random idea students came up with in class I fail to see how the university even got wind of it. I mean did the professor run telling tales to the Uni administrators? This story, as reported, sounds too suspicious to me.

Nonetheless I take issue with the idea of professors being employees of the students. This is not the case, staff in a University are only answerable only to the administration.

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