Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
General brainstorming for Note-taking software
thomthowolf:
LM is just too different. I guarantee you most people will give up on the software in the first 10 minutes, if their intention is to find a notetaking application. I mean, just imagine, a user downloads several programs to try, say, Surfulater, Evernote, Mybase, Keynote, Onenote, Myinfo. And then he comes across LM...how long do you think he will stick to it?
-superboyac (June 02, 2006, 02:29 AM)
--- End quote ---
:up:Yeah, you have a point. I think I will still do a mini review, mainly because I think I see some personal usability for this program, and I might as well share what I learn.
Speaking of giving up on software in the first 10 minutes ... I tried Taonotes again. I am truly sorry to say this, but I have never seen a piece of software more desperately in need of a good technical writer, and I see a LOT of software. I am, by trade, a technical trainer, which makes me kind of the bastard son of a technical writer and a shop teacher. I develop training materials for software and hardware, generally starting from the blueprint and alpha versions. The trouble with Taonotes is not just that there is not sufficient documentation, but that what there is is counter productive. :down:
Vadim, if you read this, then please don't be offended, but if you want to get people to use your software in place of the variety of competing products, you need to do at least these 2 things:
1. Scrap your sample data completely. It only serves to make the interface look too busy.
2. Decide what the software wants to be when it grows up. What I mean is, your users cannot effectively decide on whether to use your software if they don't know what it is for. I know the application will do everything but make your morning coffee, but if I am looking for a note taking app, I want to be able to get my notes into it immediately. It needs to be obvious to use. You need to decide what one thing the software does better than anything else, and use that feature, and ONLY that feature, to ease the user into using it. Take another look at the (admittedly annoying) flash introduction to Evernote, for example. If Taonotes could introduce itself that way on first start as, for example, a note taker, then your potential users will be delighted to discover later on that it also works as a PIM, and still later that it will walk your dog or whatever.
I am certain that I could find some use for this software, `but is is just too hard to decide where to start.
Sorry for the rant, but documentation is a subject that matters, and does not get enough attention.
actitrend:
>I tried Taonotes again. I am truly sorry to say this, but I have never seen a piece of software more desperately in need of a good technical writer, and I see a LOT of software.
Thomthowolf, you’re right…. As a developer I understand that too…. But on one hand I can not find time enough to set up this side of product development (actually I wrote TaoNotes project in my spare time, I have another full time job)… and constant time limitations is me big enemy… basically, I have time for programming/general management only…. I constantly delay the writing of a good manual, for instance… I know it’s too bad…. But I can not do that too much in this direction so far…. The shareware project is unprofitable….
On other hand, may be I have no “system view” how to present my software right…. (you’re talking about in this thread)…
>Vadim, if you read this, then please don't be offended,
I’ve read this. Absolutely not! :O) Contrary, you words give me the direction to work :O)
>but if you want to get people to use your software in place of the variety of competing products,
I really want to bit the variety of competing products :O) … no doubts…. :O)
>you need to do at least these 2 things:
>1. Scrap your sample data completely. It only serves to make the interface look too busy.
Good advice. I will use it for sure.
>2. Decide what the software wants to be when it grows up. What I mean is, your users cannot effectively decide on whether to >use your software if they don't know what it is for.
>You need to decide what one thing the software does better than anything else, and use that feature, and ONLY that feature, to >ease the user into using it.
It’s hard to determine what this feature will be… :O)
> Take another look at the (admittedly annoying) flash introduction to Evernote, for example.
Never seen it…
> If Taonotes could introduce itself >that way on first start as, for example, a note taker, then your potential users will be delighted to discover later on that it also >works as a PIM, and still later that it will walk your dog or whatever.
Practical approach….. As an author I wish people understand all use of software at once :O) especially not providing good manual :O))….. but for sure the approach you’re proposing in better….. firstly take it as a note-taker, then as a to-do manager, then as a bookmark manager, then as a search manager, then as a technical writer’s tool, etc…. I like this….
>I am certain that I could find some use for this software, `but is is just too hard to decide where to start.
The proper manual should help here, I think…. Site content should help (it does not)…
>Sorry for the rant, but documentation is a subject that matters, and does not get enough attention.
I know, I know…… I will try to do something in this field in the nearest future (my favorite phrase for the last year :O)….
But, Thomthowolf, let’s consider TaoNotes from another side…… You wrote you’re technical writer…. I develop TaoNotes with the user like you in mind…. The application itself is suitable for technical writing….. I use it for relatively short writings myself…. It gives you well results enough it seems…..
As you’ve downloaded the application give it a second (third !!! :O) chance…. I will try to explain here how to use it in a few words….. try to write small instruction you’re used to do in TaoNotes for example….
Create new notebook File->New…. It will be empty…. Then choose Insert->Composite Item->Extended Project command…. It will insert a small project outline into notebook…. Then choose the first (top) outline item (called ‘Project’)…. Then choose Publish->Publish items With Children….. All your notes in this outline branch will be rendered to HTML page and shown in the external browser….. (or you can import it to MS Word)….
You can see the notes on different levels have different styles applied…. So, you have an idea….. you can set up the formatting….. just building outline…. To say more: applying labels to items you can get different formatting and images inserted for typical cases (tip, note, attention, information, pro, con, etc….)….
It’s much faster to rearrange chapters, paragraphs in the outline than in MS Word, for instance…. But my point of view could be subjective here :O)
Vadim
actitrend:
About discovering to-do manager in note-taker…..
I think it’s natural that you can place note and you can place to-do here…. You can set it by type of item (note or to-do)…. Moreover I believe you can convert note into to-do if you will set priority or status (in progress, etc) for this note…..
When you wrote some brief notes for yourself (planning your day for example)….. you can view all your items you’re entering as notes…. Just notes…. But then you realize that some of them are tasks you HAVE to do….. and you wish to mark them as a TASKS/TODOS! Why not! Some of notes remain just notes….. it could be reference info, you attitude to something, you ideas (idea is not equal to todo)…. Your comments to notes or to-dos….
That’s why TaoNotes provides mechanisms to convert notes into tasks by setting Status and Priority….
If we will take “pure” to-do manager it consider all things as tasks….. if we will take note-taker it has lack of support for to-do management….. but I believe people need both things at the same time…..
After splitting todos, notes and reference info you can easily operate on it… the info you working with become more structural….. you can track your tasks on one hand, see and easily reach your notes and reuse reference info (like URL bookmarks, the same google seaches) on the regular basis….
So, TaoNotes offer the scheme NOTES->TASKS + NOTES->REFERENCES
or NOTES/TASKS/REFERENCES……
Let’s take Surfulator or Evernote or OneNote…. Do they offer this? No…. no way for task management….
Why? I have statistics…. I think it’s suitable for most people…… 90% of their notes is SHORT (tasks, reference info). 10% is long enough (web-capturing, etc)….. 90:10….. this may vary…… But does the mentioned programs designed to work with small notes? Like “todo thing #1”, “www.microsift.com” etc…. I think that working with small information chunk is not effective there…..
Your thoughts?
Vadim
actitrend:
About web-capturing…
I think that in MOST cases the HTML formatting and images should be removed…. They give no additional information… just waste of space on your hard disk….. The preferable method for web-clipping is taking plain text…. It works like filtering…. Gives standard text presentation (no Zoo of different styles)…. Gives better information comprehension….. it’s stated by tests….
That’s why TaoNotes uses plain text for Web-Clipping…. Though it’s able to store HTML also…… (w/o embedded images)…..
Clipping in one-fashioned way lets easily reuse info-clips in your own “notes-stream”….. as I mentioned above TaoNotes generates HTML output on the base of provided outline structure….
Vadim
Rover:
Vadim - I absolutely disagree about the web capture stuff. I am very visual and mentally "key" off of the look and information. If I write a note on a piece of paper, I remember the size and color of the paper. I usually remember the orientation and position of the text.
In the same way, when I capture a web page, I want to capture the way it looks, not just the text. Heck sometimes the graphics are part of the information.
Just my $0.02.
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