Main Area and Open Discussion > General Software Discussion
General brainstorming for Note-taking software
superboyac:
By the way, can someone please explain what the big deal about Ecco Pro is? I understand that it was an awesome program back in the day, but is it still all that awesome even with our modern expectations?
I've tried it many times, and I'm always left wondering what's so great about it. Yeah, it's outlining is nice, but the whole thing is so old fashioned, I can't get over it.
Rover:
By the way, can someone please explain what the big deal about Ecco Pro is? I understand that it was an awesome program back in the day, but is it still all that awesome even with our modern expectations?
I've tried it many times, and I'm always left wondering what's so great about it. Yeah, it's outlining is nice, but the whole thing is so old fashioned, I can't get over it.
-superboyac (March 15, 2006, 10:40 AM)
--- End quote ---
Here lies one of the big problems in UI programming. Ecco Pro is an example of Functionality over Form. The foks who still use and swear by Ecco don't want or need eye candy; they want to get a job done. More than that, Ecco works in a way that they relate to very well. It makes sense to them. (You can substitue any old Loved app here. Word Perfect is a good example).
A lot of bad software starts with the phrase, "Wouldn't it be cool if..."
A lot of really great software starts the same way. The tricky bit is that the great software also has a good answer to "Why would that be cool?"
So, what are your "modern expectations?" That it do something really well and solve your problem or that it look like puffed candy and have more features than you'll ever use? Or something in between? :D
superboyac:
RE: AskSam
Nope, this is not what I'm looking for. AskSam is more of a document management tool, kind of like the many desktop searches out there, but more powerful, apparently. So that leaves me with Zoot, as far the "expensive" programs go. Here's my quick recap so far:
Zoot:
If you're dealing with a lot of just plain text, this is probably the best program, although I still haven't really used it. Big learning curve.
Surfulater:
The best tool to capture clips, mostly web clips. But there are plans to turn it into a full-blown notetaking tool also. Lot's of potential, lots of flexibility.
Evernote:
Very innovative approach, unique interface. Functions similar to Zoot as far as automatic assigning of categories. Not as powerful as Zoot as far as organization. Can capture webclips very well, and has a lot of modern feature not in Zoot, such as outlining and richtext. Like Surfulater, it's a young program, and it looks like it will be adding a lot of useful features.
superboyac:
By the way, can someone please explain what the big deal about Ecco Pro is? I understand that it was an awesome program back in the day, but is it still all that awesome even with our modern expectations?
I've tried it many times, and I'm always left wondering what's so great about it. Yeah, it's outlining is nice, but the whole thing is so old fashioned, I can't get over it.
-superboyac (March 15, 2006, 10:40 AM)
--- End quote ---
Here lies one of the big problems in UI programming. Ecco Pro is an example of Functionality over Form. The foks who still use and swear by Ecco don't want or need eye candy; they want to get a job done. More than that, Ecco works in a way that they relate to very well. It makes sense to them. (You can substitue any old Loved app here. Word Perfect is a good example).
A lot of bad software starts with the phrase, "Wouldn't it be cool if..."
A lot of really great software starts the same way. The tricky bit is that the great software also has a good answer to "Why would that be cool?"
So, what are your "modern expectations?" That it do something really well and solve your problem or that it look like puffed candy and have more features than you'll ever use? Or something in between? :D
-Rover (March 15, 2006, 10:56 AM)
--- End quote ---
I hear you. No, I am totally against the "cool" UI stuff. I hate the bubbly, shiny look lots of softwares go for now trying to emulate the Mac style. I'm more of a simple, functional, minimalist UI guy.
Actually, I'm looking at Ecco right now, and I see what makes it so nice, despite it's old-fashioned look. It's kind of the same reason why I liked Pegasus so much before I switched to the bat. Even though the look is old and unconventional, it is highly functional, highly customizable, and powerful. However, I think I will rule Ecco out of this discussion because this thread is simply for notetaking and Ecco does so much more than just that, and it's notetaking features are not up to par with the other strictly notetaking programs we are considering right now. This is the same reason why i would also rule out a program like InfoSelect, it just does too much.
You know, it might be interesting for notetaking programs to incorporate Ecco's style of outlining. Most of the programs now just offer the typical bullet or numbering system that seems to come default with Windows. If, instead, they used a collapsable, more interactive outliner like in Ecco, I think a lot of users would appreciate that.
patteo:
I have used PIMs for as long as I can remember, eg like Polaris Packrat, Ecco Pro.
They were very good during their time.
Ecco Pro is still an excellent Outliner and I still use it as such. Nothing I know can compare with it's flexibility and ease of use.
I no longer use it other than as an Outliner, although in my past life, I could safely say I lived in it, Contacts, Calendar, Tasks, Notes and all - All my information was in it.
Because of "modern expectations" I hate to say I have migrated PIM functions, I have to admit to Outlook (gulp !) and Pocket Informant www.pocketinformant.com
They make a great laptop/PDA combination because of the Synchronization ability.
I hardly open my Outlook other than to pick up my Gmail so that it would synch with my PDA ( :-[) as basically I can access my contacts, appointments and task and email etc on my PDA.
Basically it was the launch of free Outlook that killed the development of Ecco Pro.
So I would recommend that you invest some time to get used to the Outlining aspect of it.
It's really a great outliner for organising your thoughts because of its sheer flexibility and I find myself keep coming to it even after trying many so called alternatives mentioned in http://www.john.redmood.com/organizers.html
See also http://www.prociainc.com/eccorefugee/alter.htm on why the search was so hard for many.
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