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Last post Author Topic: General brainstorming for Note-taking software  (Read 506557 times)

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #925 on: May 08, 2013, 09:00:19 PM »
Scrivener does something to rdf that is pseudoproprietary.
Plus the filenames do not reflect the titles, just numbers. It's effectively useless from a file browser, or to prevent vendor lockin.

wraith808

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #926 on: May 08, 2013, 10:13:50 PM »
I haven't found that.  I look in my files directory, and the RTF files open fine in Word.  They are named numerically, but it's pretty easy to see what it is.  And as far as vendor lock-in in regards to that, it has a pretty extensive export function.  I edit the files outside of scrivener all the time, even syncing them with Skydrive.  So, at least on windows, I haven't had the same experience as you, other than the numerical file names.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #927 on: May 11, 2013, 04:36:35 AM »
The number file names is a show stopper though. How do you find something from a file browser? You may have to search, but this doesn't help as the title (the most informative part of the file) is not in the numbered rtfs.

This is why I see it as effectively useless to avoid lock-in.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #928 on: May 11, 2013, 04:37:55 AM »
And exporting, at least on windows, is unsatisfactory. The titles of the snippets are not exported (that I could find). There are tricks to get a title to be a heading (making it a folder first) but this is extremely tiresome.

I've given up on scrivener, but maybe someone here can find a workaround :)

wraith808

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #929 on: May 11, 2013, 09:39:39 AM »
Perhaps as a note taker it is a show-stopper.  Forgot that this is a note-taking thread.  I use it for writing, so haven't really thought nor investigated any of those.

My titles are actually in the files, so all of my information is there.  As I don't really worry about it since the export works enough for me, and I can, and already do edit my novels/books in other programs (and even on my ipad), I haven't really thought about it.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #930 on: May 12, 2013, 05:59:59 AM »
This is what I do now.
  • I created an 'app' from the 'create new gdocs' link. It placed an icon on the desktop. I assigned a global shortcut to it. It takes 1-2 seconds to create a new note (a gdoc). Not as fast as simplenote or resophnotes, but it'll do
  • Create a new gdocs when the inspiration comes, with the global shortcut
  • Install syncdocs, so you have a local copy to every gdocs you create. Make sure that explorer index the syndocs folder. Then, when it's time to search, open an explorer window; the explorer search is damn fast, indexes the text, and the results are displayed with context; they are better than how onenote does it

Convoluted, but reliable, crossplatform, and full featured.
requires only easy to find software (your file manager, gdocs).
Everything works on and offline. (create new .doc instead of gdocs when offline)

The gdocs editor is way better than any of the native .doc editors (or rtf, or odt)

IainB

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #931 on: May 12, 2013, 06:58:27 AM »
This is what I do now.
  • I created an 'app' from the 'create new gdocs' link. It placed an icon on the desktop. I assigned a global shortcut to it. It takes 1-2 seconds to create a new note (a gdoc). Not as fast as simplenote or resophnotes, but it'll do
  • Create a new gdocs when the inspiration comes, with the global shortcut
  • Install syncdocs, so you have a local copy to every gdocs you create. Make sure that explorer index the syndocs folder. Then, when it's time to search, open an explorer window; the explorer search is damn fast, indexes the text, and the results are displayed with context; they are better than how onenote does it
Convoluted, but reliable, crossplatform, and full featured.
requires only easy to find software (your file manager, gdocs).
Everything works on and offline. (create new .doc instead of gdocs when offline)
The gdocs editor is way better than any of the native .doc editors (or rtf, or odt)

Interesting, I had been using a similar approach, but I stopped using SyncDocs as it seemed redundant (for my purposes) in the face of the latest incarnation of Gdrive (Google Drive). So I just settle for enabling Gdrive on my computer, and having my documents in a Gdrive folder on disk, where they are automatically synced up to the Cloud (Gdrive). Win7 indexes the documents for search.

Where you say "...the results are displayed with context; they are better than how onenote does it", do you mean how Win7 indexes the OneNotes Notebooks' content documents for search? I thought that worked the same  - i.e., not differently, so neither better nor worse.
At any rate, that seemed to be the case when I was using OneNotes 2007, but since I have been using OneNotes 2013, I find the syncing of a NoteBook in almost real-time to the Cloud on SkyDrive works perfectly well, and it's still indexed by Win7.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #932 on: May 16, 2013, 02:45:52 AM »
Quote
Where you say "...the results are displayed with context; they are better than how onenote does it", do you mean how Win7 indexes the OneNotes Notebooks' content documents for search? I thought that worked the same  - i.e., not differently, so neither better nor worse.

By 'in context' I mean that you can see a few words before and after the match. Explorer does this. Onenote does not.

I've found a killer notetaker: wiznote. Chinesse-only website, but chrome does a decent work translating it.

It does many things right:

  • Security. Notes encrypted locally before sending it to server-
  • Multiplatform
  • Very flexible interface (2/3 columns)
  • Plugins
  • Android app that beats even onenote
  • Tables
  • good paste from web, with url included next to the paste (like onenote)
  • Can publish to blog straight (!)
  • Very clean Html. Beats word, gdocs. No inline css.
  • Word count. Press 'i' icon, then details
  • Tagging
  • Very flexible tree, you can disable showing notes in subfolders (Apple-styple only one level deep)
  • Export is not an afterthought.
  • Live search, highlights matches, shows small window of context (like rightnote, evernote). Beats onenote
  • Web access (www.wiz.cn), in chinesse :)
  • Autolink urls
  • Beats any local wiki, no silly formatting, all wysiwyg
  • Can add a note without opening main app (like cintanotes)
  • Saves version history, for free (only in paid evernote)
  • Can set paragraph line height (1.5x improves readability)
  • Multi-search match highlights

And many things wrong:
  • No autocapitalization of sentences
  • Fonts kind of suck; no cleartype, no smoothing whatsoever. As horrible as office 2013.
  • Have to get out of edit mode to search
  • Changing from one note to another is slow (subsecond, but slow)
  • Not easy to move with kb on the right side tree
  • No spellcheck

The font problem is really worrying. If history is of any use, things that happen in office eventually spread to other apps (eg ribbon). Office 2013 ditches cleartype, and uses fonts that are unreadable on a desktop screen. I have an IFP 27' monitor, so I cannot blame it for bad quality (same as the ones apple use on the imac). The excuse is that the new font rendering is better for tablets.

It's scary how MS seems to be giving the finger to desktop users. Apple seems to be pissing off their more serious users too, moving tablet features into OSX. At the end anybody actually doing work and producing content will have to move to linux :)

Wiznote simply uses a component provided by MS for font rendering, and botches the entire font rendering thing.

But I still think I'll use it.

IainB

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #933 on: May 16, 2013, 12:56:18 PM »
^^ Hey! Thankyou. Very interesting - WizNote.
Not sure whether this is the same thing I had seen a long time back, via here: http://www.wiznotes.com/ (Wiznotes 4)

But it looks different anyway (different versions too) to the Chinese website: http://www.wiz.cn/

I downloaded and installed the FREE Chinese one (WizNote v3.3.25), installed the Firefox add-on for it, and used Google Translate to get the Help files into English. The add-on doesn't seem to work too well, but the moveable auto-hide toolbar works fine (redolent of the old MS Office toolbar).
It really is superb.    :Thmbsup:
Seems to have something in common with OneNote as well.
Still exploring it...

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #934 on: May 16, 2013, 08:02:38 PM »
A pity that the fonts are such a clusterfuck. I do hope windows 8.1 does something about this grayscale hinting business, because it's pitiful. MS was 3rd in font clarity behind Apple and linux with cleartype, and now they managed to widen the gap with their cleartype replacement. Astounding.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #935 on: May 16, 2013, 09:49:54 PM »
Here's the font problem (on wiznote, office, IE 10, and anything that uses the new rendering):
http://answers.micro...-4862806ea94a?page=1

IainB

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WizNote (from China http://www.wiz.cn/index.html) - quick look
« Reply #936 on: May 17, 2013, 12:36:00 PM »
...I've found a killer notetaker: wiznote. Chinesse-only website, but chrome does a decent work translating it.
It does many things right:
  • Security. Notes encrypted locally before sending it to server-
  • Multiplatform
  • Very flexible interface (2/3 columns)
  • Plugins
  • Android app that beats even onenote
  • Tables
  • good paste from web, with url included next to the paste (like onenote)
  • Can publish to blog straight (!)
  • Very clean Html. Beats word, gdocs. No inline css.
  • Word count. Press 'i' icon, then details
  • Tagging
  • Very flexible tree, you can disable showing notes in subfolders (Apple-styple only one level deep)
  • Export is not an afterthought.
  • Live search, highlights matches, shows small window of context (like rightnote, evernote). Beats onenote
  • Web access (www.wiz.cn), in chinesse :)
  • Autolink urls
  • Beats any local wiki, no silly formatting, all wysiwyg
  • Can add a note without opening main app (like cintanotes)
  • Saves version history, for free (only in paid evernote)
  • Can set paragraph line height (1.5x improves readability)
  • Multi-search match highlights

And many things wrong:
  • No autocapitalization of sentences
  • Fonts kind of suck; no cleartype, no smoothing whatsoever. As horrible as office 2013.
  • Have to get out of edit mode to search
  • Changing from one note to another is slow (subsecond, but slow)
  • Not easy to move with kb on the right side tree
  • No spellcheck
...
_____________________________

After reading @urlwolf's post, I took a look at WizNote.
This is just a heads-up re WizNote:
I could not find this referenced otherwise in the DC forum,  or the OutlinerSoftware forum, or their EditGrid list of Outliners.
So I posted details to them both, and here's the post to the DC forum.
It might be going under a different name elsewhere, but I do not know.
WizNote is new to me anyway, and because @urlwolf said it was a killer notetaking app, I tried it out. He was not far wrong. It seems to be very good.

Features include: (not an exhaustive list by any means)
  • a FREE version (there’s a limit on Cloud storage and Cloud function, I think, though am not sure what).
  • a VIP version which has a monthly bill of 600 10 yuan or something.
  • a simple-and-easy-to-use desktop application (this is mandatory to use the system and to set up your database and Cloud account).
  • a web-based application (so you and selected collaborators can access it from a web browser).
  • AES encryption for specified folders/notes.
  • a mobile application (*app*) - (I think, but I have not looked at this aspect, yet).
  • 3-pane Outliner format.
  • internal/external hyperlinking.
  • hierarchical Tags.
  • Standard word searches and SQL searches.
  • saved searches (so you can use the searches as a view across segments of your database).
  • an email address (to receive email, but not sure whether it can send any directly).
  • plugins including web-clipping tools - “send-toWizNote” - add-ons for Firefox, Chrome and IE (and other browsers).
  • capture of selected parts or entire web pages (as HTML, with all rich text and images separately editable in the Outlines.
  • in the desktop version, images can be edited instantly via seamless integration with MS Paint, and saved back seamlessly into the Outliner, replacing the image you started with.
  • smooth and fast auto-syncing to the Cloud (you have to open up a FREE account to use this), and easy access by collaborators.
  • collaborators can be set up as “groups” and can be sent emailed notices of certain events (I don’t understand what exactly, as the emails are in Chinese).
  • built-in Import/Export (e.g., even to output CHM help file formats). Some of this seems ro be via plugins, of which there look to me many. I tried a plugin for importing a OneNote notebook, but it was for OneNote 2007 or 2010, not my version 2013, I think. It partially worked, and rather well, at that.
  • quite a few more very nifty features, too many to list here and several I have not fully explored yet.

It feels like a cross between InfoSelect v8 and MS OneNote 2013, and has some surprisingly intuitive responses. Quite nice to use.
There are some pros and cons, but this is NOT an evaluation report - I am still exploring/discovering the app.
The biggest difficulty I have found so far was ploughing my way through Google Translate versions of the Chinese websites I had to visit for the main application and its plugins.

Collected links to download as at 2013-05-18: (so you don’t have to spend the time I did in finding the latest/current versions).

If anyone was interested, I could set up my trial WizNote Cloud database for others to access - it is mostly full of English translations of the Chinese documentation about WizNote, so we could collaborate on that and experiment with it as we learn together.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2013, 01:09:56 AM by IainB, Reason: Corrected to read 10 yuan/month »

mwb1100

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #937 on: May 17, 2013, 02:03:17 PM »
a VIP version which has a monthly bill of 600 yuen or something.

600 Yuan is about $100 USD - so I hope that's either a mistake or that the VIP version has some pretty nice features.

rgdot

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #938 on: May 17, 2013, 02:42:28 PM »
Second attempt at downloading/reaching their site...fails. Looking forward to give it a try.

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #939 on: May 17, 2013, 03:13:31 PM »
FWIW, I think it's a killer app.
A pity the forums, and the rest of the site, is not in EN.
There seem to be many plugins.
I could run the android app on my 2.3 phone, but on my 4.2 tablet it doesn't seem to even be listed on the app store.

How this flew under the radar, I have no idea. It does many things right.

IainB

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #940 on: May 17, 2013, 09:00:56 PM »
FWIW, I think it's a killer app.
A pity the forums, and the rest of the site, is not in EN.
There seem to be many plugins.
I could run the android app on my 2.3 phone, but on my 4.2 tablet it doesn't seem to even be listed on the app store.
How this flew under the radar, I have no idea. It does many things right.

Yes, It's quite an amazingly good package.
By the way:
  • There is an informative "Wiz Knowledge" (Windows mobile app) documentation link - see here.
  • The details of the VIP account pricing/costs are in a blog - see here.
    It says about costs:
    (Copied below sans embedded hyperlinks/images.)
    Quote
    VIP restore the original price notification
    Posted on May 6, 2013 by admin
    Dear know:
    Hello! To know the notes VIP service will be held on May 9, 2013, formally restored to the original (100 yuan / year, 10 yuan / month), 40% discount promotion is no longer carried out. May 9, you can still enjoy a 40% discount on purchase of VIP services, known to the new and old customers! Thank you for your continued support!
    VIP service purchase Address: http://item.taobao.c...m.htm?id=24859296691
    Meanwhile, in May, we will carry out more promotions to give back to the new and old customers, so stay tuned official microblogging @ know notes Events!
    From known notes (Wiz)

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #941 on: May 17, 2013, 11:32:15 PM »
Any DC members speak Chinese?
Any good plugins on the forum?

I tested the linux version. It's not the same, functionality is a small subset; still, quite impressive, might be the better notetaker on linux.

Anyone having success installing the app on adroid 4.2?

urlwolf

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #942 on: May 20, 2013, 09:43:22 AM »
Would it be a good idea to create an EN forum for wiznote?
It's a deep program... just found that alt + drag shows a tiny formatting floating window.

rgdot

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #943 on: May 20, 2013, 12:36:39 PM »
So can anybody send me the exe? Spanning days, several computers and a couple of ISPs, no dice. The site is slow to dead for me, download barely starts.

tomos

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #944 on: May 20, 2013, 01:16:10 PM »
So can anybody send me the exe? Spanning days, several computers and a couple of ISPs, no dice. The site is slow to dead for me, download barely starts.

just sent you a PM with link
Tom

rgdot

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #945 on: May 20, 2013, 01:16:54 PM »
Thanks :)

IainB

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #946 on: May 24, 2013, 07:08:22 AM »
2013-05-25: I sent a message to weekly@wiz.cn to let them know Wiz had some fans at DC, and gave a link to this thread. I hope something useful will come of it.

IainB

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #947 on: July 23, 2013, 11:49:31 PM »
2013-07-24: Just got a reply email from the WizNote website.
Quote
dear,
       i'm so exciting for receiving your mail, sorry i took so long to reply.
       I also think wiz is very interesting,more and more users taking wiz. we have over 2 million users by now. They love wiz, using wiz and discussing wiz eveyday. if you are also interested in wiz , we can take a discunssion for it, and also you can mail us some using experiences . we'll show them on our "weibo" and website, also if you need ,we can give you the others helps.
       thx!
weekly@wiz.cn

Would it be a good idea to create an EN forum for wiznote?
It's a deep program... just found that alt + drag shows a tiny formatting floating window.
@urlwolf: Good idea about the forum. Would you like to set one up? In light of the interest expressed in the above email, I reckon that (a forum) could be a useful/collaborative thing to do.

cschw

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #948 on: July 24, 2013, 10:09:20 PM »
Quote
I also think wiz is very interesting,and more users taking wiz.
 
:P  :D 
There's no doubt that their English is better than my Chinese...but I still got a laugh out of that.

On a more serious note, as one of those wiz-taking users, I recently installed 'wiznote-windows-x64-2013-07-15'.  But I also immediately uninstalled it after seeing the login screen on startup--at least until I'm happy with the answers to the following questions:

1.  What am I signing up for?
2.  What are the terms/conditions of the cloud provider?
3.  Who (besides the NSA) will have access to the data that I store "in the clouds"?

rgdot

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Re: General brainstorming for Note-taking software
« Reply #949 on: July 24, 2013, 10:16:08 PM »
Quote
I also think wiz is very interesting,and more users taking wiz.
 
:P  :D 
There's no doubt that their English is better than my Chinese...but I still got a laugh out of that.

On a more serious note, as one of those wiz-taking users, I recently installed 'wiznote-windows-x64-2013-07-15'.  But I also immediately uninstalled it after seeing the login screen on startup--at least until I'm happy with the answers to the following questions:

1.  What am I signing up for?
2.  What are the terms/conditions of the cloud provider?
3.  Who (besides the NSA) will have access to the data that I store "in the clouds"?

A Chinese product is probably safest from NSA, safe being relative I guess