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How will the Earth end?
Deozaan:
Oil production has pretty much reached it's peak, and will start to go downhill from now - and demands are going up (and remember that oil isn't just used for gasoline, but also for plastic materials etc).-f0dder (December 17, 2008, 03:49 AM)
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There's lots of untapped oil in Alaska. And OPEC just made drastic cuts to their oil production.
So I seriously do believe that we're going to see some serious resource problems within long. [...] Perhaps disaster won't strike during my lifetime, at least in this part of the world, but we live in a globalized world... if things in Africa or China or India become too bad, there's a chance it's going to affect my sorry ass as well.-f0dder (December 17, 2008, 03:49 AM)
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I do agree that we'll likely see some of these big problems before long. Not due to lack of resources but due to mismanagement of resources and politics mostly. I think we'll likely see food shortages (like the rice shortage from a few months back, but worse) again in the next couple of years. Not because there's no room to farm food, but because so much of that farm land is being used to grow fuel for vehicles. In my opinion, it's stupid things like that which will lead to resource shortages.
Deozaan please get your facts right, They do not kill the child they fine the parents 10,000 RMB, Killing a child in China is call murder and anyone doing it goes to jail.
-Davidtheo (December 17, 2008, 03:57 AM)
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Well, I have to admit that I haven't witnessed it firsthand, but I have heard secondhand that it has indeed happened. I also am left wondering whether or not you truly know for sure, since the Chinese government won't even let its citizens know what happened at Tiananmen Square 20 years ago.
I wonder how short the walk will be from controlling reproduction to actively euthanizing those who drain the resources of the planet this time?-Cpilot (December 17, 2008, 08:20 AM)
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It may be soon, when the government implements universal healthcare. Once it becomes the government's responsibility to pay for your health, it will be the government's responsibility to "let you go" once they decide you're too expensive to keep alive. Denying a boy with Downs Syndrome residency in Australia is just a sneak peak of it:
This is not discrimination. A disability in itself is not grounds for failing the health requirement — it is a question of the cost implications to the community.-http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/10/31/international/i011200D20.DTL
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Davidtheo:
Deozaan please get your facts right, They do not kill the child they fine the parents 10,000 RMB, Killing a child in China is call murder and anyone doing it goes to jail.
-Davidtheo (December 17, 2008, 03:57 AM)
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Well, I have to admit that I haven't witnessed it firsthand, but I have heard secondhand that it has indeed happened. I also am left wondering whether or not you truly know for sure, since the Chinese government won't even let its citizens know what happened at Tiananmen Square 20 years ago.
-Deozaan (December 17, 2008, 09:55 PM)
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Deozaan I really think you need to stop getting second hand information, This may have happen in the past but does not happen now, and if you want to judge a country on what has happen in the past does that mean the USA can still be judge about slavery. Lets look it something closer today say Iraq and the number of people killed over there, After all we all know the USA only when to Iraq for the Oil.
For your information do not believe everything you see on CNN
Carol Haynes:
Oil production has pretty much reached it's peak, and will start to go downhill from now - and demands are going up (and remember that oil isn't just used for gasoline, but also for plastic materials etc).-f0dder (December 17, 2008, 03:49 AM)
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There's lots of untapped oil in Alaska. And OPEC just made drastic cuts to their oil production.
-Deozaan (December 17, 2008, 09:55 PM)
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Those points may be true BUT it doesn't mean that the resource isn't limited and dwindling. There may even be undiscovered reserves of fossil fuel but there are a number of things that follow:
* Whether or not new reserves are found they are finite. Coal, oil and natural gas are the bedrock of modern society and few people in the world would disagree that at best recovering these resources is getting harder and harder as time goes on to the poijnt where some resources are deemed economically unviable. Ultimately people may find cheaper ways of tapping these resources but ultimately limited.
* The fact that new resources are found doesn't necessarily mean that it is morally acceptable to exploit them to the detriment of rare landscape and other species.
* Political games to maintain high profits (as currently exists in OPEC) is not an argument that resources are unlimited. OPEC ONLY exists to maximize profit for a cartel of producers. In any other sphere of international trade this behaviour would be considered illegal in most countries but because the countries have oil reserves they get away with it.
The final point also works in terms of international agricultural agreements. Back in the 80s the EU had policies to maintain high food prices. Basically they built food surpluses that were ultimately destroyed rather than sell them at a lower price to the starving millions in Africa. It wasn't that we really had excess food it was just profit orientated manipulation.
OPEC knows that their oil reserves are limited and use that fact to blackmail the world into giving them the maximum amount of money. Heaven help us all when the oil runs out ... that is when WWI and WWII will look like local skirmishes!
4wd:
Heaven help us all when the oil runs out ... that is when WWI and WWII will look like local skirmishes!-Carol Haynes (December 18, 2008, 03:36 AM)
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I just wish they'd hurry up and get on with it.........then I can go back to sleep 8)
Wake me when the world is over...........................and not a second before!
Deozaan:
Deozaan I really think you need to stop getting second hand information-Davidtheo (December 17, 2008, 11:38 PM)
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By that logic I can't trust anything unless I personally witness it. That includes everything you say, since you are also secondhand information to me.
Those points may be true BUT it doesn't mean that the resource isn't limited and dwindling. There may even be undiscovered reserves of fossil fuel but there are a number of things that follow:
* Whether or not new reserves are found they are finite. Coal, oil and natural gas are the bedrock of modern society and few people in the world would disagree that at best recovering these resources is getting harder and harder as time goes on to the poijnt where some resources are deemed economically unviable. Ultimately people may find cheaper ways of tapping these resources but ultimately limited.
* The fact that new resources are found doesn't necessarily mean that it is morally acceptable to exploit them to the detriment of rare landscape and other species.
* Political games to maintain high profits (as currently exists in OPEC) is not an argument that resources are unlimited. OPEC ONLY exists to maximize profit for a cartel of producers. In any other sphere of international trade this behaviour would be considered illegal in most countries but because the countries have oil reserves they get away with it.
The final point also works in terms of international agricultural agreements. Back in the 80s the EU had policies to maintain high food prices. Basically they built food surpluses that were ultimately destroyed rather than sell them at a lower price to the starving millions in Africa. It wasn't that we really had excess food it was just profit orientated manipulation.
OPEC knows that their oil reserves are limited and use that fact to blackmail the world into giving them the maximum amount of money. Heaven help us all when the oil runs out ... that is when WWI and WWII will look like local skirmishes!-Carol Haynes (December 18, 2008, 03:36 AM)
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Sure, oil and fossil fuels have a technical limitation, but are there practical limits? Are we going to depend so much on oil in 100 years as we do today? 100 years ago one of the biggest environmental concerns was all the horse manure in the streets. People were worried about the "limitations" of how much manure the streets could hold before thing got too bad to handle. Then the car was invented and the manure problem went away naturally. So again, how do any of us know that in 100 years from now we'll still be using up oil like we do today? History has shown that natural and technological progress (the ingenuity of humanity!) will solve the problem.
I'm guessing that this part is about the oil in Alaska:
The fact that new resources are found doesn't necessarily mean that it is morally acceptable to exploit them to the detriment of rare landscape and other species.
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My family lived in Alaska (though I was an infant at the time) and from what I hear (uh oh, more second-hand information!) from my family is that it is debatable as to whether or not drilling for oil in that tiny part (less than 0.4%) of Alaska is actually a detriment to "rare landscape" or wildlife. Ask people who actually possess the land in Alaska and see what they think about it. The majority of people who live in Alaska and have first-hand experience/information on the topic want to drill for oil, but they're held back by environmentalists who have never been there and have no idea what they're talking about.
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