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the actual browser divide: plugins
azgarth:
the one thing stopping me from using chrome is the ability to use plugins,
opera has userjs though, which can replace some of the more basic firefox plugins, and supports most greasmonkey scripts.
so does chrome if you use greasemetal.
not enough though, i need coolpreviews, for example.
plugins allow for a lightweight browser, adding what you need beyond simple browsing to it, and nothing else, it also ensures that if someone needs a certain something, he or she can build it if need be.
zridling:
[urlwolf]: the killer feature is right now plugins.
--- End quote ---
I think you're right on this. When you can take an essential app on every computer and directly improve it via customization, it's the difference between night and day for users. As long as users support Firefox, it will continue to thrive and compete with anything out there (because users know what they want).
__________________
urlwolf, you also mentioned the semantic web. If/when that ever comes about, we will evolve to the next level as a species.
Paul Keith:
I disagree.
Key things to support my case:
(1) Internet Explorer users outnumber Firefox even with it's plugin
(2) A better out of the box program with the same level of extensions would have equalled or surpassed Firefox (Flock userbase doesn't even scratch Firefox userbase)
(3) Google Chrome would not have gained marketshare this fast even with all the marketing if people thought plugins were a killer app.
This doesn't mean plugins aren't great but in the words of someone I can't remember and someone who I'm not sure I'm quoting correctly "Firefox is more of a Web App but when I need a browser, I look elsewhere."
The killer application requirements are still:
(a) Support for most if not all sites
(b) Speed
(c) Stability
(d) Don't redesign the wheel too much at first glance or the users will run away from it.
(e) If things don't work well, make sure your users can easily find a way to link a functioning app to your application. (IETab, Open in Opera/FF/etc, Customize which RSS Feeder will be used, Customize which Mail Client will be used, etc.)
(f) Listen to your users before the opposition steals your ideas.
(g) Redefine the core basics and steal the beachhead from under your opposition's niche.
urlwolf:
I disagree.
Key things to support my case:
(1) Internet Explorer users outnumber Firefox even with it's plugin
(2) A better out of the box program with the same level of extensions would have equalled or surpassed Firefox (Flock userbase doesn't even scratch Firefox userbase)
(3) Google Chrome would not have gained marketshare this fast even with all the marketing if people thought plugins were a killer app.
This doesn't mean plugins aren't great but in the words of someone I can't remember and someone who I'm not sure I'm quoting correctly "Firefox is more of a Web App but when I need a browser, I look elsewhere."
The killer application requirements are still:
(a) Support for most if not all sites
(b) Speed
(c) Stability
(d) Don't redesign the wheel too much at first glance or the users will run away from it.
(e) If things don't work well, make sure your users can easily find a way to link a functioning app to your application. (IETab, Open in Opera/FF/etc, Customize which RSS Feeder will be used, Customize which Mail Client will be used, etc.)
(f) Listen to your users before the opposition steals your ideas.
(g) Redefine the core basics and steal the beachhead from under your opposition's niche.
-Paul Keith (September 15, 2008, 08:16 AM)
--- End quote ---
[/QUOTE]
Agreed. (a) and (f) are particularly bad in Opera right now. (b) and (c) are particularly good.
The problem is that, considering the huge amount of plugins, one is bound to find one that one cannot live without, and that's bye bye for non-plugin browsers!
Here's something very telling about (a). Chrome has better support for the current (broken) web as it stands right now, and Opera has been around for years...
http://my.opera.com/community/forums/topic.dml?id=249930
urlwolf:
[urlwolf]: the killer feature is right now plugins.
--- End quote ---
__________________
urlwolf, you also mentioned the semantic web. If/when that ever comes about, we will evolve to the next level as a species.
-zridling (September 15, 2008, 06:49 AM)
--- End quote ---
Hehe, I hope you are right. I'm working full-time on making the semantic web work :) so if it nevers comes around, you have someone to (partly) blame :)
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