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Author Topic: Can you live with *just* opera?  (Read 17366 times)
urlwolf
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« on: July 26, 2008, 11:22:27 AM »

Can you live with *just* opera?

I can't. Even though it's my default browser, I need to have FF open at all times. Too many sites don't work well with Opera (google calendar being one of them).

This is getting tiresome; it's a bit of a waste of memory.
I like Opera over FF because I don't have to pay a person full-time to keep all addons updated, it has an integrated mail client that I love, and it can do the 'fit to width' thing.

On rendering speed they are about the same right now. Used to be the case that Opera was faster. FF is also less memory intensive now.

All in all, Opera is losing ground against FF in my book. What's your take?

Also, I keep Opera because FF 3 broke intellicomplete (no prompts!).
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dantheman
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« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2008, 11:50:28 AM »

I like Opera too but can't make it default for the same reasons as you.

Also, the new "awesome bar" (ugh!) in FF3 makes the url box much more complete than Opera's.
That is a pretty good reason in itself!
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wreckedcarzz
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« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2008, 02:45:50 PM »

I have had friends that swear by Opera. They love it, for one reason or another. They now all run Firefox 3. Everything in Opera they liked is now a FF extension, and FF is less resource intensive than Opera now.

The one (and only) reason I used Opera for a while was the Speed Dial feature, but that has been recreated in the Fast Dial extension for Firefox. IMO the Opera skin browser page thing whatever is WAYYYY too confusing, and the skins are not diversified enough. They are all the same, boring, weird skin with different colors or a new icon here or there. Granted this was back on version 9.0 (I think, not sure) but nonetheless it just didn't seem to have the cozy "feel" that Firefox gives you. (Maybe its the FIRE part of the fox tongue)

I no longer use Opera, Maxthon, IE7, or any other browser. Nor does my parents or little sister. It just works for all of us.

</rambling>
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Renegade
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« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2008, 08:59:11 PM »

I use IE7, FF, Opera and Safari.

IE7 is my default because I like the mouse gestures from ALToolbar far better than any others. They're smoother and the tracers are nice to use as well.

For FF vs. Opera, well, they work differently and usually I like Opera's behaviours better.

Safari I only use for some specific things, and not a lot.

But on this machine, Opera is my default browser. On my other machine, it's IE.

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PhilB66
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« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2008, 09:15:19 PM »

I have had friends

May I suggest (no affiliation)
« Last Edit: July 26, 2008, 09:28:51 PM by PhilB66 » Logged
anne_r
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« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2008, 05:28:33 AM »

Can you live with *just* opera?

I can't either. Opera is my default browser, but at times I have to use Firefox. For example Gmail works with Opera if I mask it as Firefox, which is silly.
Firefox 3 is OK, but is loads very slowly. I have some extensions installed, but hardly ever use them smiley. Opera has all I need, and I've so grown into it I couldn't live without.
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allen
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« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2008, 05:45:48 AM »

As much as I love Opera, no... I can't live with just Opera. I really don't like Firefox, have always found Mozilla's interfaces to be clunky and unappealing and I loathe tabs.  Unfortunately, almost every new web app is JavaScript intensive... JavaScript that isn't Opera compatible.  Virtually all of Google's apps have issues on Opera, backpackit, plurk... Almost any major AJAX intensive website.  Don't know/care who to blame on the matter, whether it's opera, the developers it matters not. The point is, if you want to use opera *and* these things you have to settle for an inferior experience, as at least a few things won't be working right (if at all). Then there's Opera's lack of rich text clipping support... so external applications used to clip/save data just get plain text.

For these two reasons, I find myself using FF or IE more than Opera -- not by choice, mind you, but what else can one do?
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icekin
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« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2008, 08:19:32 AM »

I use Opera 99.9% of the time. The only time I use FF3 is if Opera fails on a certain site for some reason. And IE only if the site fails on both Opera and FF. Usually, I prefer not to visit such sites though. I used to have K-Meleon installed as my Opera alternative instead of FF, but it unfortunately didn't support the same number of extensions that FF did.
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allen
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« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2008, 08:46:06 AM »

That is *exactly* the problem, though--one has to choose either allegiance to the browser and thereby lesson your options in terms of what you can do online... or you can have access to the entirety of the Internet in a browser you like less.

I used to just stick with what the browser could do, but more and more I'm leaning toward the belief that what's on the Internet is more important than the tool you use to access it. It's your destination, not your ride.
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urlwolf
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2008, 08:48:14 AM »

Same here, Allen. So much so that I'm considering moving back to FF. I've been using Opera full-time since v. 5.

I think the problem is that AJAX sites debug their stuff with firebug. They of course test it with FF and maybe with IE for those grandmas out there on the internets who have 7 toolbars installed because they don't know how to remove them smiley

Opera created dragonfly, but by the time devs realize it exists, and -maybe- start using it, we could all being too bored and using FF.

Opera's dev team is the most resilent to criticism, so my guess is that posting in their forums will do nothing.

It's sad, because they are very innovative, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to let Opera go. Problem is, I have a few thousands login passwords on the infamous wand. Now I have no idea how to export that to FF.

Bummer.
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allen
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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2008, 08:56:25 AM »

Yes, posting to the official forums seems an exercise in futility.  I sometimes think Opera should discontinue its desktop browser and focus wholly on mobile browsing, where they are indeed king.  While I'd be sadened to have them go, having the Opera option forcibly removed from me would be a great relief, I think.

Developers, of virtually every AJAX toy out there, insist they won't support Opera because Opera makes up so little of their web traffic, but how much of that traffic *would* be Opera if Opera was supported? They block people out, then "observe" that those people aren't using it.  Frustrating.

I don't know of any way to transfer all of your passwords over, but if you need to back them up for reference, Pass Scape's Opera Password Recovery ($27/Lifetime) works great.
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Lashiec
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« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2008, 06:37:13 PM »

For example Gmail works with Opera if I mask it as Firefox, which is silly.

Weird, GMail 2 works just fine here without any masking (maybe Opera is doing some black magic behind the scenes?)

The thing is that, considering the issues Opera had as lately with many sites, and the improvements coming with Firefox 3, I was telling myself I would end up coming back to Firefox after some years, yet Opera 9.5 and Firefox 3 came out and I find myself using Opera more than before (I even forgot about the "Open with" submenu). Maybe it's because of my Internet habits that lead me to Opera-compatible sites, which rarely are using AJAX, or if they are, run without issues. It should be said Opera's compatibility has increased as lately (GMail being the prime example), and I'm confident it will get even better with time (yeah, I'm repeating myself over and over :)). Or they sue Google, and set things straight out off the courts ;D

In any case, I was accustomed to use Firefox or Internet Explorer as needed, and well, it seemed natural to me (although I loathe to use IE for anything), and so I cross-browsed (heh, new term) without problems. These days, I fire, errr, Firefox, when I have closed Opera with tons of tabs open, and it's such a annoyance to launch it again, and wait for the sites to load, or just if I need to do something in a incompatible site. IE, only for Windows Update, in the rest of the Internet, I feel dirty using it :D

While it's true that I could replicate Opera in Firefox using extensions, I never saw the point in doing that when I could be using the real thing (and I tell you I thought about doing it a few times already). And yet, some things are impossible to duplicate.
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tomos
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« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2008, 04:08:51 AM »

I fire, errr, Firefox, when I have closed Opera with tons of tabs open, and it's such a annoyance to launch it again, and wait for the sites to load,

I'm exactly the opposite - FF has all the tabs open, I use opera though as my default (usually, more in case I dont have FF open & as you say would have to wait a long time ..)
Also in OPera I have "open [current page] in FF" in the context menu (via Surfulater forum here)

I'm not a big surfer & definitely no power user, & maybe I'm very superficial tongue but it's interface issues now that keep me using FF,
small things - much less control over how tabs work get's me every time I use Opera - also, not an important thing but it was opera brought in that thing where if you click on the open tab, it will go back to the previous tab - that worked for a very short while & hasnt since -
No problem for tabmixplus - I can basically make tabs function any way I want with this
Another thing I cant seem to do is open new typed address in a new page as opposed to in current
All little things but they add up to me using mainly FF ...

Oh yeah, Gmail didnt work, then did work, now doesnt work ... thumb down
« Last Edit: July 29, 2008, 04:10:34 AM by tomos » Logged

Tom
anne_r
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« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2008, 06:44:40 AM »

For example Gmail works with Opera if I mask it as Firefox, which is silly.

Weird, GMail 2 works just fine here without any masking (maybe Opera is doing some black magic behind the scenes?)

I really had to look into this, and found out that my cookie settings were too tight. Now I allow all cookies, and Gmail loads perfectly in Opera! Great!   thumbs up  Question: why did Gmail load OK, when I masked Opera as Firefox with the old & tight cookie settings? Answer: I don't know. smiley

And ditto to all you wrote about Opera, Firefox and IE, Lashiec.
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dantheman
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« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2008, 07:00:45 AM »

With all due respect for Opera fans, the new FF3 ahsomethingamigger brings bookmarking to a whole new age.
I have around 1,000 bookmarks and i find this new url box enhancement along with Foxmarks backup service to be an excellent solution to an essential part of surfing.

Another complimentary service is the ever improving Evernote for note taking. Fans must like the fact that they can save a whole webpage in FF with just one click.
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Josh
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« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2008, 07:05:52 AM »

And that is my problem as well. I've grown so accustomed to being able to setup firefox in any manner I choose that switching to another browser just doesnt make sense. I can do this to just about the same extent in IE7, heck just about any other browser, minus safari on windows, allows me to extend the capabilities to fit how I work. I don't have to change what I do or how I surf in order to use a piece of software. I don't have to ignore certain sites because they ignore my at best "niche" browser when developing. So no, I would not be able to live with opera in its current state. Its not until I am fully able to customize it that I will be able to live with it.
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anne_r
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« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2008, 07:58:00 AM »

With all due respect for Opera fans, the new FF3 ahsomethingamigger brings bookmarking to a whole new age.
I have around 1,000 bookmarks and i find this new url box enhancement along with Foxmarks backup service to be an excellent solution to an essential part of surfing.

Opera 9.5x has all that!  tongue
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dantheman
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« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2008, 09:40:46 AM »

Yabut!

FF3 has a little star at the right end to indicate if it's in your folder and you can modify the bookmark directly via that star.

Also, FF3 has an icon at the left side that offers you website info (if made available).

Opera doesn't do this (yet!).

 
« Last Edit: July 29, 2008, 09:42:38 AM by dantheman » Logged
allen
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« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2008, 09:49:05 AM »

With all due respect for Opera fans, the new FF3 ahsomethingamigger brings bookmarking to a whole new age.
I have around 1,000 bookmarks and i find this new url box enhancement along with Foxmarks backup service to be an excellent solution to an essential part of surfing.

Opera 9.5x has all that!  tongue

After using it a bit, I've found the "Awesome Bar" to be surprisingly effective... Opera has autocomplete, but FF3 effectively searches all my browsing history when using the address bar.

Still not enough to make me give up hope, Opera is full MDI with unmatched keyboard support . . . it's wonderful in terms of usability. But if I want to clip stuff in Evernote, I have to open Firefox or IE (Not Evernote's fault, Opera doesn't support rich text to the clipboard, no two ways about it). . . probably the biggest Opera issue for me right now.  That and Gmail constantly hangs. (Supposedly fixed in the latest beta build, but I'm not seeing it "fixed" in my personal experience.)
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Josh
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« Reply #19 on: July 29, 2008, 09:51:46 AM »

Opera also does not offer field auto-complete WITHOUT the use of notes. That is a highly ineffective way to do business. Autocomplete has existed for years in every major browser, and as such, has become a standard feature I expect of any browser I use.
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Strength in Knowledge
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« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2008, 10:02:14 AM »

I don't know about opera, but you can definitely live with just Mozilla
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Lashiec
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« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2008, 02:09:31 PM »

small things - much less control over how tabs work get's me every time I use Opera - also, not an important thing but it was opera brought in that thing where if you click on the open tab, it will go back to the previous tab - that worked for a very short while & hasnt since -

Actually, it works all the time, but it's... weird, to say the least. I can't explain how exactly works, but it seems to be a mix between the old behaviour and the default one in Firefox. In any case, it works fine for me, and I prefer it to the old one.

Quote
Another thing I cant seem to do is open new typed address in a new page as opposed to in current

You can hold Ctrl + Enter to open an address in another tab (+ Shift to open it in the background), but I don't know if this is what you're talking about smiley

After using it a bit, I've found the "Awesome Bar" to be surprisingly effective... Opera has autocomplete, but FF3 effectively searches all my browsing history when using the address bar.

Opera Software should look at Firefox features, evaluate them, see where they can improve their own ones, clone the non-existent ones... and run with it cheesy

Quote
But if I want to clip stuff in Evernote, I have to open Firefox or IE (Not Evernote's fault, Opera doesn't support rich text to the clipboard, no two ways about it). . . probably the biggest Opera issue for me right now.

Did you try with the fix reported by tomos?
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tomos
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« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2008, 06:51:07 AM »

small things - much less control over how tabs work get's me every time I use Opera - also, not an important thing but it was opera brought in that thing where if you click on the open tab, it will go back to the previous tab - that worked for a very short while & hasnt since -

Actually, it works all the time, but it's... weird, to say the least. I can't explain how exactly works, but it seems to be a mix between the old behaviour and the default one in Firefox. In any case, it works fine for me, and I prefer it to the old one.

eh, you've lost me there Lashiec tongue cheesy
dont know if I described it properly
-
say you look at tab#5, then look at tab#12,
then click on tab#12 again & it would go back to tab#5
(are you talking about the same thing? sounds like something that works or doesnt smiley)

Quote
Another thing I cant seem to do is open new typed address in a new page as opposed to in current

You can hold Ctrl + Enter to open an address in another tab (+ Shift to open it in the background), but I don't know if this is what you're talking about smiley

thanks for that  thumbs up
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Tom
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« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2008, 12:13:02 AM »

Like Allen, I use FF only as a backup for that one site that doesn't load. Otherwise, I've enjoyed Opera for its broad customizability and cross-platform consistency. My only real gripe is the confusion I experience with keyboard shortcuts. I can never key two different installations the same for some reason. Go figure. Among all of these, I have to hit-and-miss to get all the shortcuts to work (under >Preferences >Advanced >Shortcuts):

- Opera standard
- Opera 9.2 compatible
- Opera Standard for Unix
- Opera 9.2 compatible (modified)
- Opera standard (modified)

Even if I delete them and start over, these variations still proliferate.
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mahesh2k
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« Reply #24 on: July 31, 2008, 08:38:33 AM »

I have Opera Mini 4.1 installed on my Sony Erricson phone, i'm in search of alternative browser is there any alternative for it?

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