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Last post Author Topic: Can you live with *just* opera?  (Read 21924 times)

allen

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #25 on: July 31, 2008, 04:44:13 PM »
I have Opera Mini 4.1 installed on my Sony Erricson phone, i'm in search of alternative browser is there any alternative for it?

This thread is about Opera for the desktop, you'd be better off starting a new thread if you're shopping around for a new mobile browser.  That said, you'll be hard pressed to find better than opera for mobile devices, there's nothing that even comes close.

Lashiec

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #26 on: August 03, 2008, 06:05:54 PM »
eh, you've lost me there Lashiec :P :D
dont know if I described it properly
-
say you look at tab#5, then look at tab#12,
then click on tab#12 again & it would go back to tab#5
(are you talking about the same thing? sounds like something that works or doesnt :))

Ah, oki doki. I thought you were talking about the new option in Opera 9.5, which is similar to the default one in Firefox, but from the way it works, it looks like they mixed both options (as sometimes it jumps to the next tab, and others to the last activated tab).

In any case, the method you mention should work with problems. A bug maybe?

tomos

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2008, 03:38:32 AM »
In any case, the method you mention should work with problems. A bug maybe?

nope, hasnt worked (for me) since a version last year sometime (sorry couldnt tell you which one exactly)
Tom

urlwolf

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2008, 11:51:32 AM »
Has anyone tried IE 8? Maybe we are past due for a surprise from microsoft.

urlwolf

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2008, 12:08:30 PM »
Just tried it for a few mins... supremely bad. No way to undo closed page. Horrible interface, need to dig into internet options for seconds just to not find what you are looking for.

Pathetically slow going back to previous page (no catching? OH MY GOD! ).

FF and Opera (maybe Safari) have left IE in the dust completely. And still IE has the largest market share, and every web development firm has to do contorsions to adapt to this monstrosity.

We should do something about it. A public demonstration or something.

urlwolf

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2008, 12:10:47 PM »
One thing I don't understand. Opera says that web development people ignore them due to market share. This is why the suck so much in anything AJAX-y.

But then, safari (on windows, which probably gets 1/100th the attention of 1/1000 of the devs at cupertino) gets all those pages that fail with Opera right. And faster.

What am I missing?

Lashiec

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2008, 12:31:44 PM »
nope, hasnt worked (for me) since a version last year sometime (sorry couldnt tell you which one exactly)

Strange, maybe something in the profile got corrupted?

Has anyone tried IE 8? Maybe we are past due for a surprise from microsoft.

The first beta was very rough judging from the reports (oh well, you already bite the bullet), so if there's any surprise it should come with Beta 2. Don't expect anything revolutionary though, they improved the foundations of IE7 and moved to better standards-compliancy, which is the bare minimum people should expect from Microsoft these days. But they have a few ideas of their own (web slices, and a few ways to make the browser more robust against unexpected problems), which if properly implemented, could be worth a look by the competition.

What am I missing?

Safari has a market share of around 6%, and it's the most used browser in the Mac. I can't imagine the backlash against the companies refusing to support Safari, and thus the Mac. Not to mention that probably the market share of Mac in most Web 2.0 companies is significantly different from the worldwide numbers, so they'll be shooting themselves in the foot. And WebKit is currently the rendering engine of choice in high-profile projects by a good number of tech companies (Google, Nokia, Adobe, Apple...)

urlwolf

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2008, 12:55:40 PM »
So anyone here using safari full-time for windows?
Because last time I checked, it had less features that a barebones FF and it wasn't rock-solid stable. But maybe now it is.

I'm really looking forward something that displaces opera. FF 3 is out of question for me since it doesn't work with intellicomplete.

urlwolf

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #33 on: August 05, 2008, 01:09:08 PM »
and.., I installed safari. No support for intellicomplete.
Better than Opera: mispellings underlined.
Fonts are different, and look weird when using cleartype.
Scroll is jumpy instead of smooth.
Not very good catching (hitting back takes seconds to rerender the page). Bah.
It has less options than IE, if that was at all possible.
Lacks keyboard shortcuts. Not to mention assignable.

Not a competitor. A pathetic attempt.



allen

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #34 on: September 02, 2008, 10:27:46 AM »
This seems like a good thread to vent.

Opera + gmail is pure shit. I love Opera and keep trying to use it, but every time I check my e-mail I want to scream and find myself scrambling for file -> exit.

Earlier in this thread, it was mentioned that Opera and gmail play well together... what am I missing? Because for me, it hangs for everything. Changing folders is 50/50, reading a message is 50/50. Sending messages? I have about a 5% chance of actually getting it sent. Useless.

Renegade

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #35 on: September 02, 2008, 12:29:32 PM »
Opera + gmail is pure shit. I love Opera and keep trying to use it, but every time I check my e-mail I want to scream and find myself scrambling for file -> exit.

Opera still has a ways to go with their javascript engine, but honestly --- it's SOOOO much better than IE or FF for speed. FF beats IE for speed with a lot of things though. I've got a site that I administer with IE because IE is simply far superior to FF in so many aspects, but the speed really pisses me off. FF on the site is MUCH faster. But IE works 100%. FF isn't there yet.

However, for a major Internet application like Gmail to not work with the top 4 browsers is just silly. Google has dropped the ball there. There's no excuse for it. When something is THAT popular and bug... errr... I mean big... When it's that big it needs to rise to a bit higher standard.

Real simple:

Switch :: Case...

NTFH. Not That F***ing Hard...

The product manager at GMail is just dropping the ball.

BUG... Errr... I mean BIG surprise! :)

(The U and I keys are just too close. ;) )

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Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

tomos

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #36 on: September 02, 2008, 01:07:45 PM »
Google has dropped the ball there. There's no excuse for it. When something is THAT popular and bug... errr... I mean big... When it's that big it needs to rise to a bit higher standard.

could that be a conscious decision I wonder - especially with their own browser coming onto the market ...
Tom

Lashiec

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #37 on: September 02, 2008, 07:16:12 PM »
Opera + gmail is pure shit. I love Opera and keep trying to use it, but every time I check my e-mail I want to scream and find myself scrambling for file -> exit.

Earlier in this thread, it was mentioned that Opera and gmail play well together... what am I missing? Because for me, it hangs for everything. Changing folders is 50/50, reading a message is 50/50. Sending messages? I have about a 5% chance of actually getting it sent. Useless.

I don't know, really. The old version worked fine from day one on Opera 9.2x, and the new 2.0 design started to work without any trick on Opera 9.5x since a while ago. And it never fails. Perhaps something is misconfigured, like it happened to Anne, or another program in the middle is breaking everything?

Renegade

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #38 on: September 02, 2008, 07:33:15 PM »
Google has dropped the ball there. There's no excuse for it. When something is THAT popular and bug... errr... I mean big... When it's that big it needs to rise to a bit higher standard.

could that be a conscious decision I wonder - especially with their own browser coming onto the market ...

They won't get into the browser business. It's already crowded and there's no incentive for them to do it other than to set the default page and search engine to them.

Considering that none of the current browsers are truly standards compliant, or truly work, it's likely too much of a pain for them to get into.

If they did, it would likely be for a mobile platform. (Google phone, etc.)
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Lashiec

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #39 on: September 02, 2008, 07:34:20 PM »
Ah, that sounds like someone who did not have an Internet connection for a few days :P

Paul Keith

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #40 on: September 02, 2008, 11:00:40 PM »
Hello everyone.

Yes, you can live with just Opera just as some can't live with just Opera or Firefox in that case.

Opera's main nemesis is Google Applications. For casual usage, (barring the services who use extensions or the rare poorly configured site) that's the only thing holding it back but this is like saying people can't live with just a text browser. It's just not true.

Think about it. Some can live with just IE and I couldn't live with just IE or FF. I would at this point just as much quit surfing if Desktop Opera goes away. That's why I'm glad Google came out with chrome. Two lightweight browsers = more space for multi-browser use.

allen

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #41 on: September 03, 2008, 01:31:09 PM »
Opera + gmail is pure shit. I love Opera and keep trying to use it, but every time I check my e-mail I want to scream and find myself scrambling for file -> exit.

Earlier in this thread, it was mentioned that Opera and gmail play well together... what am I missing? Because for me, it hangs for everything. Changing folders is 50/50, reading a message is 50/50. Sending messages? I have about a 5% chance of actually getting it sent. Useless.

I don't know, really. The old version worked fine from day one on Opera 9.2x, and the new 2.0 design started to work without any trick on Opera 9.5x since a while ago. And it never fails. Perhaps something is misconfigured, like it happened to Anne, or another program in the middle is breaking everything?

What happened with Anne? Shouldn't be any program in the middle. I don't use any proxies, ad blockers or anything of the sort.

Dormouse

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #42 on: September 03, 2008, 01:44:57 PM »
Opera + gmail is pure shit. I love Opera and keep trying to use it, but every time I check my e-mail I want to scream and find myself scrambling for file -> exit.

Earlier in this thread, it was mentioned that Opera and gmail play well together... what am I missing? Because for me, it hangs for everything. Changing folders is 50/50, reading a message is 50/50. Sending messages? I have about a 5% chance of actually getting it sent. Useless.

I don't have these problems. Mostly it works just fine. Sometimes it feels as if the gmail server is down - but it's no better if I try touse FF to access it. Never descended as far as ie for this.

Just as I have no problems using my bank account with Opera.

Paul Keith

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #43 on: September 03, 2008, 06:57:48 PM »
One thing I don't understand. Opera says that web development people ignore them due to market share. This is why the suck so much in anything AJAX-y.

But then, safari (on windows, which probably gets 1/100th the attention of 1/1000 of the devs at cupertino) gets all those pages that fail with Opera right. And faster.

What am I missing?

I'm not a web developer but this is just probably a guess. Apple or Mac traction. Most developers are on average probably more willing to work on Safari after they have worked on Firefox and IE and only bother with Opera when there are complaints.

Lashiec

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #44 on: September 03, 2008, 07:32:46 PM »
What happened with Anne? Shouldn't be any program in the middle. I don't use any proxies, ad blockers or anything of the sort.

A cookie thing. Unless we're talking about M2 + GMail, and not about checking GMail by going to the site... in both cases I'm afraid there's not an easy solution. With M2 it seems to be because of sloppy coding on the part of Google, and with the browser it depends on the phase of the moon. I remember seeing some other people complaining about GMail problems in the Opera forums, but not immediate solution, apart from cross-browsing, of course :)

Renegade

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #45 on: September 03, 2008, 09:05:30 PM »
Well, it seems that I've spoken too soon about Google and browsers...

CHROME -- The Google Browser!

However, the agreement is just plain scary:

The Fine Print

Paraphrase: We get to install anything we damn well feel like and steal anything that you create and use in our browser.

So much for "do no evil". Google is WAY off the path at this point. They're worse than Real or some of the more aggressive adware/spyware guys at this point.

I really hope that Chrome fails. We don't need another browser, and especially one with such a crappy EULA.

Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

Renegade

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #46 on: September 03, 2008, 10:07:34 PM »
Hmmm... Seems that post wasn't right (The Fine Print):

Quote
2. Although you retain any copyrights to content you own and use in the browser, Google says it has a right to display some of your content, in conjunction with promoting its services. Here's their exact wording.

"By submitting, posting or displaying the content you give Google a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to reproduce, adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute any content which you submit, post or display on or through, the services. This license is for the sole purpose of enabling Google to display, distribute and promote the services and may be revoked for certain services as defined in the additional terms of those services."

I can't find that in the license agreement at all.

That makes things much better. Though the "we get to update whatever we want" thing still kind of stinks...
Slow Down Music - Where I commit thought crimes...

Freedom is the right to be wrong, not the right to do wrong. - John Diefenbaker

mwang

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #47 on: September 04, 2008, 10:38:39 AM »
... and it can do the 'fit to width' thing.

In Firefox, you could use the "Default FullZoom Level" or the "Glazoom" extension to achieve this.

Personally I use Default FullZoom Level.

CodeTRUCKER

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #48 on: April 10, 2009, 01:35:39 AM »
Consider this...
With the exception of our sightless comrades, the most important feature all of us need in any every browser must have is the ability to be "seen."  To date I know of no other browser that will provide the instantaneous zoom-in/zoom-out via CTRL+Thumbwheel1 function that Opera does so well.  No right-clicking!

At least on an annual basis (not necessarily when that newest FF, IE, etc. version comes out) I have made a pilgrimage to see if this singular intuitive zooming function has been replicated (dare I hope, improved!?) by any contender.  Each time I have come back empty-handed and have once again settled down to another annum with Opera. I have used Opera since I paid a license fee of $35.00 and I have never regretted the purchase, but I digress.

Regardless of any whizzbang feature, if you can't see it, it's useless and for the vast majority (as in, "most of us") diminishing sight will be an eventuality.

I have tried numerous "magnifiers," but again, nothing is as intuitive, fast and simple as Opera in this wise.  Opera also zooms every aspect of everything on the page too! Not just text as some do. 

I do recognize that there are other browsers that perform better in some things than Opera for whatever reason, but if a browser lacks this intuitive zoom, it's a show-stopper for me. 

1EDIT - simplified "CTRL+Roll-the-Mousewheel-Forward/Backward"
« Last Edit: April 10, 2009, 03:11:01 AM by CodeTRUCKER »

mwang

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Re: Can you live with *just* opera?
« Reply #49 on: April 10, 2009, 02:30:40 AM »
I'm not sure I understand. CTRL+Roll-the-Mousewheel-Forward/Backward does indeed zoom-in/out in FF3 here, though I admit I have no idea which provides it: FF3 itself or an extension.

Better yet, I use the thumb wheel to zoom in and out, without having to reach for the keyboard (for CTRL).

I also paid for Opera years ago, but it's no longer on my system. I check it out from time to time (with just about every major release), but FF3 is the one for me right now.