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1  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Wikimedia refuses to remove animal selfie because monkey ‘owns’ the photo on: August 10, 2014, 09:54:03 AM
The problem is that we are a bunch of engineers trying to define art.
Lots of art students spend many years studying this (paid by the government in a lot of places in the world) and none of them know either. (I have spent many hours listening to pretty girls who study art tell me all about it while I study 'natural art')

In the building trade, the problem is 'gentleman's agreements' all the time. If I draw the plans, I keep the copyright, if I design a unique (for example) timber floor artistic pattern which I simply ask "how about this?" and do then do the job, it's not clear. If I had said: "I'll design a custom flooring system" and drawn it up and the client signed that he had selected my design, then I keep it. Even if I was paid for the time I drew it, that's simply the cost of using my design.

However, the question is: did he make the overall finish by choosing the design, or did I design floor to make the overall finish?
Maybe consider the case of someone hanging a Picasso on the wall and that made the room look good. Who is the artist if the room is considered the artwork?

In the case of the holiday photo, if the person asking did not expect the person taking to do any more than just point and shoot (i.e. an amateur under instruction) then the tourist owns the picture. If the tourist asks a professional thinking that he/she is an amateur, then the professional can
a: take the photo and say nothing
b: first warn the people that this is his job and his work is copyright (kind of like if you ask a signed recording artist to play happy birthday and want to record it).
If the professional says nothing and then claims the photo, the tourist could claim that the photographer had the camera under false pretences and that would open up another can of worms.

If there is an accidental historic photobomb, the professional could claim the photo, but the tourist could countersue for lost revenue that the camera was borrowed under false pretences and the tourist could have made the shot and got the royalties.

That's my opinion.

Oh, and as for hobbyists: a lot of that comes back to licencing and liability. You can ask old Jim how to build a shed and he is not licenced to charge for his information, and if it falls down that was your fault. If you ask me, I can charge for it and I have to pay insurance because you can sue me if I told you wrong information.
A professional photographer would be one who could be reasonably expected to charge for such a service. e.g. has a history of working as such, has a lot of images sold under copyright etc.
2  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Wikimedia refuses to remove animal selfie because monkey ‘owns’ the photo on: August 10, 2014, 07:25:35 AM
The way I see it there is the creation of art and then the recognition of it being art.
If the creator didn't know it was creating art, then it doesn't own the copyright.
Example: People leave footprints in the sand and the photographer makes a mint with a picture of them
Example: Someone screws up a bit of paper and throws it in the trash, and an artist makes a mint by putting it on a pedestal
Example: Sheet metal worker hammers a piece of iron and a dj makes a dance music track with the same sound
Example: Someone records birdsongs/waves/whales.

If I build someone a shed (that's my job) then I might retain 'copyright' of the design unless it can be proved that I copied someone else.

If you get someone to help take a photo, and they do no more than a 'reasonable' job, then you own it. BUT if you hand the camera to a professional to take and he uses his skill to achieve a better photo, then he could lay claim to it.
Likewise if you ask an amateur to help build a shed, he only puts in work. But if you ask me, I can add to the normal shed design and claim that as my copyright.
Let's pretend this shed won best shed in a building competition and we wanted to know who gets the prize.

So, since the ape was unaware of what he was doing, he can't claim copyright. The artist (unintentionally) set up a circumstance where this photo was created, he recognised that it could be made into art, he processed the results and can claim them as his art.

Moral: don't ask me to help you build a shed. Please.
3  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: silly humor - post 'em here! [warning some NSFW and adult content] on: August 10, 2014, 06:53:49 AM
Little Johnny asks his Dad: "I have this homework on politics and economy and I'm not if I understand it"
Dad says: "Use the family as an example. I make the money so I'm the Capitalists, your mother deals it out, so she's the Government, we look after you, so you're the People, the baby is the Future, and we pay the maid so she is the Working Class"

That night Johnny is woken up by the baby crying, so he checks it and it needs changing. So he goes to tell his parents, but only his mother is there and she doesn't wake up. He goes to tell the maid, but finds that she's 'busy' with his dad.
He goes back to bed.

Next morning his dad asks how he is going with the homework. Johnny says: "I think I understand it. The Capitalists screw the Working Class while the Government is asleep. The People are ignored and the Future is full of sh*t"
4  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: silly humor - post 'em here! [warning some NSFW and adult content] on: August 10, 2014, 06:45:45 AM
These machines are too slick, it has to look all weird with duct tape and spoons on servo motors.

I'd like a Johnny 5 waiter to come rolling into my bedroom in the morning, holding a tray with a full breakfast, complete with a rosebud in a vase. Now that would be "too slick".  Wink
 (see attachment in previous post)

YES..... why don't they work on that rather than smartphones that aren't??
5  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: silly humor - post 'em here! [warning some NSFW and adult content] on: August 09, 2014, 02:13:21 AM

I just ordered an arduino board with the idea to make an instant coffee alarm clock. I happen to like good instant coffee. These machines are too slick, it has to look all weird with duct tape and spoons on servo motors. Will post when I get it attempted.
6  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: The Onion launches new site: Clickhole on: June 18, 2014, 08:45:00 AM
I hate being told that I won't believe the target article.
As a religious person, I figure I can believe in just about anything. With much faith.

7  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: The Onion launches new site: Clickhole on: June 14, 2014, 05:54:25 AM
That's a great site.
I love spreading obvious misinformation on the internet. If someone is so dumb as to believe articles on the net, they may as well believe totally ridiculous ones.
8  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Apple Collectors: 100 000 for iPod Gen 1 on: April 28, 2014, 04:14:55 AM
Yeah, there's a lot of fake bidding going on. So when ebay list "average price" all their real items appear to be cheap.

When I was looking for a Nexus 5, there were a lot of them for sale around $850. No-one bought them, but they made $500 seam cheap.

That's probably what this guy is trying to do.
9  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Apple Collectors: 100 000 for iPod Gen 1 on: April 27, 2014, 06:11:45 AM

That was a pretty slick investment...
10  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Once again, magically expensive items are only different in your mind on: April 21, 2014, 07:24:34 AM

I'm a wannabe audiophile. And I think a lot of it is a kind of OCD; we want it to be perfect, and if we believe it IS perfect, then we can relax and enjoy it more.
I'm suspicious of 'premium' sound systems enhancing the bass to give an extra depth which makes the speakers sound better on first listen but is actually not an accurate reproduction. One reason why I hate trying to judge speakers straight up. It might sound better now, but is it genuine?

I've heard that CDs are purposely flattened so they don't clip on low to medium speakers so it sounds better on average speakers.
People who work in professional studios tell me that the final mix sounds a lot better before it's turned into CD format but I haven't gotten to confirm this.

Also I listen to the start of Alison Krauss's New Favourite to quickly judge a new sound system on how it holds bass. That song is much harder on speakers than dance music.
11  Other Software / Developer's Corner / Re: Need help coding website with music and database on: March 26, 2014, 05:03:21 PM
@40hz, your friend has a great voice.
Those sites are both for finished product. This will be for demos only. It will be public, but only targeted to industry people. As such, I'm not too worried about the front end.
It's the actual code to run the database that I need to work out.

I need to know what language is best to do it in so I can go out and learn it quick, quick.

12  Other Software / Developer's Corner / Need help coding website with music and database on: March 26, 2014, 08:06:51 AM

So I have a really cool idea for a website (I think it is anyway) and basic web skills.

This is what it might look like http://www.jsongs.comuv.com/

So, songwriters load demo songs, they get their own page with the songs on them and each song gets it's own page.
That can be done in HTML. I don't predict will get too big so it won't be too hard to manually manage.
BUT on the homepage, it wants a shuffle music player so people listening to a song can skip until they find something they like.
Which means that the song need to be in a database so that they can be shuffled then the corresponging song, songname, artist and artist pic can be dynamically loaded.
I can handle the Javascript (just) but then I need PHP or somthing to work the database.
I was hoping to work out something that will run on an Access database since I have enough troubles without SQL.

Can someone point me in the right direction on which set of languages to use?
Keep in mind that, if it is successful, I want it so that artists still have to be manually set up and screened, but after that they can add songs easily and the song pages will be dynamically created.


13  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Fight back against the NSA on: February 06, 2014, 07:11:50 AM
We all want our privacy back,
This idea looks good, it just needs more support.

I like it. I vote we ask Mouser to put the banner on DC.   

Incidentally, to go with it, my idea of fighting back starts with always using a fake name online. ALWAYS. Especially FB. It makes it just that bit harder to search and profile people.

Does anyone else have any opinons on this movement, or any tips for fighting back?

Just remember, if you have ever been glad that you can break minor regulations like picking flowers in a park and get away with it, you have a moral obligation to do something to stop us being totally monitored.
14  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Security Questions (humor) on: November 14, 2013, 05:15:02 AM
That is classic.
First employer can be yourself. Although then I have to remember if it was self, myself, self-employed, Fred, Fred Nerd, Fred Nerd Carpentry. Maybe I should just walk out into a better world like that guy.
15  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Windows Phone 8 (lumia 920) vs. Android 4.4 Kitkat (Nexus 5) on: November 12, 2013, 05:31:58 AM
And sadly Google has announced it won't be getting OS updates anymore, so it may be time to get a Nexus 5 soon. (c:

KitKat is meant to be designed for lower spec phones and should speed everything up again. Google isn't releasing it for the earlier phones, by there's custom ROMs out there already.
I might have to try one. I'll have to kill the phone manually to get a new one.

Actually I lost it a while back, and my best bet to replace it was an identical one 2nd hand for $90. Why pay more?
16  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Windows Phone 8 (lumia 920) vs. Android 4.4 Kitkat (Nexus 5) on: November 11, 2013, 06:01:26 AM
Good to know. I like the idea of getting a Nexus 5. Problem is my Nexus S is still holding it's own. Only just but not bad enough to justify upgrading.
17  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: YouTube finally forces creation of google+ A/C to comment on: November 10, 2013, 04:49:48 AM
So basically it's all moving towards everything being linked in. I'm just glad I guessed it would happen and have several fake identities that were created a long time ago.
Even now I have too much with my real name. I have changed it on Facebook but I know it remembers it. It told me I could only change it once more so make sure I put my real name in. Suffice to say I didn't.
It's not that I don't like everything tied together, it's just that if everyone does, it will get more and more enforced. If everyone kept creating false accounts, and untying everything, they wouldn't try to force it so much.

Not to mention the issue of identity theft.

And the whole attraction of the internet was so you could post anonymously. You can say honest things. Such as on this forum no-one knows me, so I could tell you things that happen locally, and report it exactly without worrying about offending anyone. If this was linked to FB or G+, this would be posted there and someone could take offence.
I want to be allowed to post that I think shooting kangaroos is a good idea without losing my friends who disagree.

If we let things link, we'll get a lot of yes people, or a lot of fashionable haters.
18  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Privacy Study on: July 01, 2013, 08:03:08 AM
I always find it amusing to read the comments in these sorts of articles where some person brags about being free of the system of FB, twitter etc, BUT will put comments on news articles. I'm sure Big Brother is more interested in what you're reading than in what you had for dinner.
19  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Bug Bounty From MS on: June 24, 2013, 06:13:38 AM
So basically they want you to keep all the bugs you find a secret so that you can be the only person claiming the bounty. This way no-one will put all the bugs up on the net to be laughed at.

Smooth move.
20  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: silly humor - post 'em here! [warning some NSFW and adult content] on: June 14, 2013, 06:59:41 PM
We're having a charity concert for those who struggle to reach orgasm.
If you can't come, let me know.

PS. I am NOT trying to reconnect with my ex's.
21  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Wrigley Making Caffeinated Gum - New Alert Energy Caffeine Gum on: March 22, 2013, 12:39:53 AM

The chocolate covered beans are nice but have too much chocolate. Just chew on straight coffee beans. Leaves your teeth with bits stuck in them.  thumb down
22  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Wrigley Making Caffeinated Gum - New Alert Energy Caffeine Gum on: March 21, 2013, 08:03:25 AM
Where can I buy it? I want some, could keep a packet so it's available when I need it.
I live on coffee and energy drinks. Yes, it's expensive, but it get's things done, and I get paid more if I get more done. Also I don't have to waste daylight when driving long distances.
23  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: Emperor's New Clothes Kickstarter on: March 11, 2013, 07:12:22 AM
Love it, it's totally awesome.

I want one. I'll keep it for visitors, "let's have a game, you can be crosses, Here you go, have these tokens"
24  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: "Half of our users block ads. Now what?" on: March 11, 2013, 07:00:57 AM
My opinion on this is that on one hand I like things being free especially for younger people etc. BUT on the other hand I would much rather pay then see ads.
Part of the my plan would be copy protection that wouldn't be TOO hard to get around so that kids could use their brains and pirate what they need, BUT you'd be reminded you should pay for it. Like the DC way of paying for it or being reminded to renew your licence.
Remember back in the 'good old days' of Windows 98? Kids who grew up then learnt to use lateral thinking to get things you couldn't afford, with plenty of viruses to catch you out AND then to learn how to fix it when you downloaded photoshop_crack_win.exe Wink
Was really good fun, and you learned to think. Still didn't get anything productive done, but it was fun.

Anyway, I use an ad blocker since I hate ads so much that if I see an ad I'll boycott the company for annoying me. Unless it's an 'infomercial'. If I'm looking at a site to buy building products, they can try to tell me that I should own the latest nail gun, that makes sense.

But basically, I'm happy for a lot of blogs and bloggers to go broke. They don't work as hard as I do, and seem to know less as well. Anyone I like can ask for donations or premium services and I'll pay.  
Same with Android apps, less ad supported only, more crippleware with a pay option. More prestige in owning a phone with everything paid for.
25  Main Area and Open Discussion / Living Room / Re: silly humor - post 'em here! [warning some NSFW and adult content] on: February 24, 2013, 03:35:38 AM
A Salute to Rodney Dangerfield

A 21-joke salute to comedian Rodney (who died in 2004 at age 82) -- his best one-liners.


1. I was so poor growing up! If I wasn't a boy, I'd have had nothing to play with.

2. A girl phoned me the other day and said, "Come on over; nobody's home." I went over. Nobody was home.

3. During sex, my girlfriend always wants to talk to me. Just the other night she called me from a hotel.

4. One day I came home early from work. I saw a guy jogging naked. I said to the guy, "Hey buddy, why are you doing that?" He said, "Because you came home early."

5. Its been a rough day. I got up this morning, put a shirt on and a button fell off. I picked up my briefcase, and the handle came off. I'm afraid to go to the bathroom.

6. I was such an ugly kid. When I played in the sandbox, the cat kept covering me up.

7. I could tell my parents hated me. My bath toys were a toaster and radio.

8. I was such an ugly baby. My mother never breastfed me. She told me that she only liked me as a friend.

9. I'm so ugly, my father carries around a picture of the kid who came with his wallet.

10. When I was born, the doctor came into the waiting room and said to my father, "I'm sorry. We did everything we could, but he pulled through."

11. I'm so ugly, my mother had morning sickness after I was born.

12. I remember the time that I was kidnapped and they sent a piece of my finger to my father. He said he wanted more proof.

13. Once when I was lost, I saw a policeman, and asked him to help me find my parents. I said to him, "Do you think we'll ever find them?" He said, "I don't know kid. There's so many places they can hide."

14. My wife made me join a bridge club. I jump off next Tuesday.

15. I'm so ugly, I worked in a pet shop, and people kept asking how big I'd get.

16. I went to see my doctor. "Doctor, every morning when I get up and I look in the mirror, I feel like throwing up. What's wrong with me?" He said, "I don't know but your eyesight is perfect."

17. I went to the doctor because I'd swallowed a bottle of sleeping pills. My doctor told me to have a few drinks and get some rest.

18. With my old man I got no respect. I asked him, "How can I get my kite in the air?" He told me to run off a cliff.

19. Some dog I got. We call him Egypt because in every room he leaves a pyramid. His favorite bone is in my arm. Last night he went on the paper four times -- three of those times I was reading it.

20. One year they wanted to make me poster boy -- for birth control.

21. My uncle's dying wish was to have me sitting in his lap; he was in the electric chair.
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