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26  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 18, 2007, 06:43:31 AM
what is probably happening here is that you're putting a space in between the comma and the word. as the code is written now a proper keyword search term would be 'Velvet Underground,Debussy' NOT 'Velvet Underground, Debussy'

i'll have to write some sort of trim-space-between-delimiter code to filter out the natural instinct of placing spaces between commas.

Ah!  That's solved the major problem I was having -- that explains the bulk of the test results that weren't spot on! Cool, thanks for that.

Have just been running it and it's excellent. So, thanks again -- I'm sure to use RMTM loads - so if any bugs or weirdness crops up I'll let you know.

Have a great Xmas!

P.


27  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 17, 2007, 04:40:27 PM
that's strange -- because it handled the "Gould" search fine, yet Gould only appears in the ALBUM field (unless it also checks for filename - as "gould" is there too).

The biggest hitch re. the results was where there was more than one Keyword Search term. Unless I got the delimiter wrong (used a comma) it seemed to ignore the second term (see results).

See for example the 'Velvet Underground, Debussy' keyword search results.

i guess what i need to do in the future is really add options to search all possible text fields with keywords. that's prolly the better way to go overall.

That makes sense to me.

By the way, does the program concatenate the metafields into a string and then search that string -- or am I way off? Also something I couldn't figure, was the method behind the search. Does it allow for Boolean AND/OR and "containers" (i.e. search ALL FIELDS containing:  [Bach AND "C Minor"] OR ["Velvet Underground"] Thus finding matches for both "Bach pieces in C Minor" and "The Velvet Underground").

I have no idea a) if it can do this already, or b) whether that is hard to impliment.
But it strikes me that if it were to allow for a "Boolean logical search" in all text fields that would be pretty powerful and flexible! The user would be able to pretty much control the degree of a) Certainty (MUST HAVE), b) Bias (KEYWORD with Filters) and c) Randomness - which, I would have thought would cater for pretty much everyone.

i also noticed a strange exception occuring during playlist making on one of my machines, but can't seem to get it to happen on another. are you experiencing these problems?

Not quite sure what "exception" you're referring to?

P.




28  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 17, 2007, 01:04:46 PM
Hi Seedling ---

Thanks again for the Keyword Priority Search cheesy  --- gave it a thorough testing.

Results are here:
http://www.giantpygmy.net...ix_tape_maker_results.txt

Hope they are helpful.

Keep up the excellent work and again congrats on a great program!

P.


29  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 13, 2007, 09:23:40 AM
I really appreciate that!  cheesy Thmbsup

Looking forward to it.

Thanks again.

ps. Glad you implimented the WavPack suggestion, as that's how I came across your program via the HA post (http://www.hydrogenaudio....index.php?showtopic=59570).

P.
30  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 13, 2007, 12:25:28 AM
Thanks seedling, that's a very clear outline.

Enjoy your travels.

So, I think it's step 4 that creates my particular problem.

I expected the standard KEYWORD search ("Use Keywords" only ticked) to act ahead of Step 4, because as you can see if you only have 60 mins to fill after the MUST HAVE LIST - the chance of a specific KEYWORD SEARCH occuring among the Randomly Chosen files is slim and kind of negates the KEYWORD SEARCH (unless it's extremely general).

step 4) fill the rest of LIST by choosing songs randomly from DB and testing each selected file for user limits (genre, keywords, redundancy, min/max time, min/max size, year, etc) until LIST is 180min (or as close as possible).  this is where setting a min song limit comes in handy.  if you have not set a min song length, then it will continue to cycle throughout the entire DB until the list is EXACTLY 180min or the DB search has been exhausted. so, if you use a min song length of 2min, then if the LIST is at a total of 178.1min it will stop right there, cuz it will know that it is impossible to fill the list to 180 exact because by using even a 2min song, the LIST will be 180.1min (which, of course, is >180). if you have a min song limit of even 1min, it can be helpful, but usually (unless your list happens to be 179.1-179.9min long) it will still cycle thru the entire DB until exhausted.

at this point, you'll see that your 'cowboy junkies' song only stands a chance of being added only if LIST hasn't been completely filled AND that particular song has been randomly chosen in order to be tested against said user limits.


STEP 2 and 3 are clearly ideal:

"step 2) if the must have list is used fill LIST with the files in the must have list (subject to exclusive keyword and/or redundancy limits)"

step 3) calculate time of files in LIST (if all files in must have pass the above filters (keyword/redundancy(if used)) then this will be 120min)

What I guess surprised me was that after STEP 3 the Keyword Search didn't take priority over the Purely Random selections of STEP 4

i.e. step 3.1) fill the rest of the LIST by choosing songs THAT FULFIL THE KEYWORD CRITERIA randomly from DB and testing each selected file for user limits (genre, keywords, redundancy, min/max time, min/max size, year, etc) until the LIST is full.

step 3 AGAIN) calculate time of files in LIST (if all files in must have pass the above filters (keyword/redundancy(if used)) then this will be 120min)

THEN IF THERE'S ANY SPACE LEFT:

step 4) fill the rest of LIST by choosing songs randomly from DB and testing each selected file for user limits (genre, keywords, redundancy, min/max time, min/max size, year, etc) until LIST is 180min (or as close as possible).


I suppose what this suggests is a 3 tier approach rather than a 2 tier one.

i.e.

1) MUST HAVE (subject to exclusive keyword and/or redundancy limits) TRUMPS
2) KEYWORD SEARCH (subject to user limits - genre, keywords, redundancy, min/max time, min/max size, year, etc) which in turn TRUMPS
3) RANDOM FILES (fill the rest of LIST by choosing songs randomly from DB and testing each selected file for user limits (genre, keywords, redundancy, min/max time, min/max size, year, etc) until LIST is 180min (or as close as possible). 

The benefit of this approach is that the user can tweak many of the limits and Keyword search (which if Boolean would be very powerful) to the point where they can pretty much guarantee the degree of PURELY random files added.

I'll give one example then leave you alone, as I'm sure I've caused you enough of a headache already.

User has 10 files they must have which use up 60 mins:
1) MUST HAVE TOP 10

They want to include some (due to time and other limits) Bach pieces in the key of C Major (this comes to 60 mins):
2) KEYWORD SEARCH = Bach & "C Major" (if there's too many the user can add '& Fugue' and narrow it)

The rest are Random that fulfil the criteria (so clearly if CLASSICAL was not selected in GENRE) then STAGE 2 would yield 0 files.

3) RANDOM = POP & CLASSICAL, less than 5 mins, max play time = 180 mins, etc ....


That would be my perfect RANDOM MIX TAPE MAKER.

Again I hope you'll find this greedy suggestion of interest and helpful. Obviously I am only one person and what I want does not necessarily apply to everyone (or indeed anyone else).

But if you think what I've said makes sense, then please give it some thought.

I'll leave you to your travels.

Best wishes and good luck with this application --- I'm certain that it will become THE ESSENTIAL playlist support application.

Thanks again for your patience and swift attention.

P.























31  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 12, 2007, 01:51:42 AM
By the way thanks for putting the save on exit option in -- that's very nice!

P.
32  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 12, 2007, 01:48:49 AM
Hi Seedling

Just tested the new version. That was quick by the way!

I ran tests the same as before.

Keyword = 'cowboy junkies'
There's only one cowboy junkies' song in the collection.

In the Keywords section:

1) With only "Use Keywords" ticked:
Output = Playlist 180 mins, BUT no Sweet Jane by 'Cowboy Junkies'

2) With "Use Keywords Exclusively" + ID Limits ticked:
Output = Playlist 3.23 mins, BUT ONLY Sweet Jane by 'Cowboy Junkies' included

3) With "Use Keywords Exclusively" + Ignore ID Limits ticked:
Output = Playlist 3.23 mins, BUT ONLY Sweet Jane by 'Cowboy Junkies' included

4) With "Use Keywords" + "Exact Keyword Search" ticked (ID Limits greyed out):
Output = Playlist 180 mins, BUT no Sweet Jane by 'Cowboy Junkies'

I guess that's not what you wanted to hear.

FYI -- I'm using Win XP SP2, totally stable good system. Program runs fine, stable, no crashes.


thanks for the reply.

here's a little explanation of how the app works and using keywords.

a list is created

a song is randomly picked from the list

the song is then put through whatever filters the user defines


Later down the line I'm pretty certain I'll be recommending this program on GPA and Hydrogen Audio etc .. I want to be clear how it works:

From the quote above it seems as though I may have got how the program works a little backwards. I'll outline what seems to me to be the obvious way it "has to work" (if you know what I mean) - let me know if this makes sense:

Hypothetical:

All MP3s are stored in 1 directory, I'll call this the database or DB.

Program selects the "Must Have List" from the DB = MUST HAVE SELECTION (say 60 mins worth).

Then checks that this selection fulfils the "Total MB/Total Playing time" criteria (say 120 mins).

= Fine - it has 60 mins of space to fill.

Then it searches the DB on the Keyword criteria and puts these files aside as a KEYWORD SELECTION (say 120 mins worth).

Your program then applies "Time & Size", "Genre", "File Formats" and "Redundancy" filters to the DB (excluding KEYWORD & MUST HAVE SELECTIONS)

Files are then randomly pulled from the pool that fulfil this criteria and stored as a RANDOM SELECTION (120 mins of random stuff - i.e. Total Playing Time criteria).

It then randomly picks from the KEYWORD SELECTION until the remaining 60 mins are filled.

If there's any room it then goes to the RANDOM SELECTION and fills the remaining time from that pool.

Then shuffles the list.

a) Is that correct?
b) If not, does it at least make sense?

All the best - and thanks again for looking at this.

P.




33  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 11, 2007, 01:08:41 AM
Yes, I'm using v1.8.28.77.

Just to let you know -- did another test with Use Keywords Exclusively and keyword was 'cowboy junkies' -- that worked fine but of course ignored the "Must Have" list and thus provided a playlist with only one entry namely "Sweet Jane" by the Cowboy Junkies. So clearly the keyword thing works but for some reason doesn't when combined with the other criteria.

With 180 mins predefined playlist time:
120 mins of Must Haves
leaves 60 mins for random / keyword influenced additions.
Is it possible this is causing a problem - logically it shouldn't the one song that fits the criteria is only 3 mins long.

Anyway, the reason for my interest and raising these issues/suggestions is because I think your Random MixTape Maker has the potential to be THE playlist program. I'm part of Giant Pygmy Audio (http://www.giantpygmy.net) - collectively we've researched god knows how many audio related applications - and in many fields (recording, mixing, editing etc...) there are superb applications -- however in the playlist (support) field there's a huge void - my feeling is this application will fill it and it won't take much to do so. Please take that as a big compliment.

Furthermore, I'm a big fan of standalone applications that do just one job well over those that attempt to do everything and often do many of them poorly.

I read a previous post about the excellent fooobar2000 which as you know has very many 3rd party add-ons and yet even they have not managed to extend the playlist functionality of foobar as much as your application does. I guess what I'm saying is keep up the development and improvements and keep being creative - enthusiasts like me will no doubt increase its exposure.

By the way it works really nicely with foobar2000 - I like the autolaunch element (with save options).

Another minor suggestion is this:

The option to autosave to (and thus overwrite) a default.m3u playlist (in the program's home directory) with the option to "save as ..." on closing the application.

Anyways -- keep up the excellent work.

P.








34  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 10, 2007, 09:44:02 PM
Thanks for that -- using the new version.
Strange - as I came from the Hydrogen Audio link re. the new WavPack support and downloaded from: http://www.donationcoder....edling/MixTape/index.html
And got the older version!

I have one final question regarding these Keywords:

I created a "must have list" of 120 mins approx (must have list enabled).

Time & Size: Limit play time to 180 mins, Limit Max song duration to 5 mins (everything else clear)

Genres Pop and Classical ticked

Only searching MP3s (the collection is 100% MP3)

Limit artists to 5 songs each

Keywords:

Use Keywords (ticked)
Exact keyword search (ticked)
Use ID Limits (ticked)

[everything else unticked]

Song Keywords:

1st test: cowboy junkies
2nd test: cowboy junkies,sweet jane
3rd test: cowboy junkies,sweet jane,ramones


I have only one Cowboy Junkies song and it's called "Sweet Jane" - Genre = Pop, it's less than 5 mins long - yet it's not getting picked up. Ran the other tests, and likewise for the Ramones, though again they fulfil all the criteria and none of their songs are in the must have list.

Can you help me here, it seems like I'm not getting something. It's weird for me because I often use pretty complex audio software and yet this simple looking application is defeating me.

Thanks again for replying so promptly. Your help is much appreciated!

P.
35  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 10, 2007, 05:13:51 PM
I see so weighting is not possible.

I'm not a programmer - and from your explanation of how the app works it seems my suggestion maybe too much.

The only way I could see to impliment is would be at the "a song is randomly picked from the list" stage, because the skewing / weighting would have to be applied here.

So you skew the random list to which is then say 50% more likely to include keywords with "Love" somewhere in the meta data -- then the rest of the filter are applied.

That would still achieve the weighting. How you do this mathematically/programming-wise I don't know. If I find out I'll let you know.

Anyway --- the other thing I wanted to check was the version:
I'm using 1.06.68

I can't see the Keyword options that you refer to. All I have is:

Use ID Limits/Ignore ID Limits
Use Keywords
Use Keywords Exclusively
Exact Keyword Search


How do these option relate to:


"there are two keywording options:

1) song keywords: which will check both artist + title (from any tag present) AND filename (in case the song isn't tagged)
2) lyrics keywords: which, if present, will check the lyrics for any keywords defined."

Sorry if I'm being a bit daft here, but I haven't managed to get the keyword search to influence results --- so I'm clearly doing something wrong. MP3's are all ID3 v1 and v2 tagged.

Thanks for your quick reply and for considering the idea.

P.
36  DonationCoder.com Software / Seedling's Software / Re: Hi Everyone / Random MixTape Maker ideas on: December 09, 2007, 05:53:02 PM
Just wanted to say thanks for a very handy piece of software - just started using it and works very nicely.

I have a couple of suggestions:

I may have misunderstood something - but as far as I can see the keyword inclusion element (under Keyword Options) searches only for lyrics tags? If I'm wrong about that please could someone let me know what I'm doing wrong; otherwise I suggest that fields such as Title and Comment be included in the scan. Example -- I would like to include music in a certain key (and for classical the key is outlined in the Title field (for me anyway).

Which brings me on to the perhaps more greedy, though more general request.

My suggestion is this:

I'd like the possibility of weighting (applied to keywords)

So for example -- if the weighting is a value, 1 to 9 (9 being the strongest weighting) and keyword included Lyrics, Title, Comment, Artist etc ... ID3 fields, then I could do the following:

Keyword = "Love" Weighting = 9
Keyword = "Hate" Weighting = 1

Thus skewing the likelihood that a song with Love in the Title will be selected over "Hate"; whilst songs with "Hate" in the meta data are still more likely to be included than songs that only fulfil the base criteria -- such as Genre, Time etc...

Thus weighting does not guarantee inclusion, but influences the probability of inclusion (perhaps the heighest weighting i.e. 9, could guarantee inclusion???  - which is the Keyword version of the Must Have File List - - but I don't think that's a good idea - as conflicts arise: a 60 minute limited playlist with all songs that include "Love" could be a problem).

Also I think if this is implemented (or even understood - if I've made myself clear enough) then I quite like the idea of negative weightings too -- eg, Keyword = "Love" Weighting = -3 would make songs with Love in the Title less likely to appear than those that merely fulfil the base criteria -- such as Genre, Time etc...

Hope this makes sense.

Once again thanks for the excellent program and good luck with future developments.

P.
(http://www.giantpygmy.net)






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